Hearts of Oak Podcast

Paul McGowan - Controlled Narrative: Has the Art World Been Captured?

Paul McGowan has strong common sense conservative views which are simply not allowed in the art world. His willingness to share his thoughts led to him being cancelled on different occasions. He returns to Hearts of Oak for a wide ranging conversation on topics like climate change and free speech. It all fits under the realisation that art is no longer about free thinking and opinion but about a controlled narrative driven by governments and institutions. 
Paul McGowan studied art at Falmouth, Winchester and Bath school of Art. His work has often created controversy and has been regularly featured in the press all around the world.He established himself as a fashion designer at a young age; when he was 20 he became the youngest designer to ever sell a collection to fashion house Browns, and went on to work for a variety of well-known fashion industry names, including Gianni Versace. During his formative years at Art School, he had his first exhibition in St Ives, and won the Tate Magazine Award. Since this time he has continued to develop a strong career for his distinctive - and often political - artworks, recognised locally in 2008 when he was appointed as artist in residence at the Eden Project.His work is collected across the world and he is a serial collaborator, often producing works released under different identities.Paul's works often provoke strong reactions. Perhaps the most unexpected was when in 2010 police in riot gear were sent to raid a central London gallery after one of the artworks - a fake bomb in the window - caused reports of a 'suspicious' device.His current work has been exhibited extensively in the UK as well as abroad.
For more on Paul and to see his art...WEBSITE: http://www.paul-mcgowan.com/homeGETTR: https://gettr.com/user/PaulMcGowanX: https://twitter.com/PaulMcGowanart1?s=20&t=16-fTGYPaDSKjmj-1xIx2w
Interview recorded 17.10.23
Audio Podcast version available on Podbean and all major podcast directories... ⁣https://heartsofoak.podbean.com/
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Francis O’Neill - The Rise of the Yellow Boards: Waking up the Public One Message at a Time

Show notes and Transcript
Today we delve into grass-roots activism, we have all seen the yellow boards pop up at road junctions across the country, joined with a cacophony of car horns in support. When online censorship tries to curtail the flow of information, it's time to go back to the traditional methods. Billboards. Francis O'Neill has become known to many of us for his high profile involvement with this new/old medium. He joins Hearts of Oak to discuss why he got involved and what the response has been from the public. The concern has moved on from forced jabs to full covid tyranny and the threat of a cashless society, with control through surveillance now the biggest threat we face to our freedom.
Connect with Francis and The Yellow Boards Movement...X:                        https://x.com/FrancisxONeill?s=20                           https://x.com/YellowBoards?s=20SUBSTACK:       https://francisoneill.substack.com/LINKS:                https://heylink.me/yellow_boards/
Interview recorded 26.9.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstin and Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBoschFawstin?s=20 
To sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/
Support Hearts of Oak by purchasing one of our fancy T-Shirts.... https://heartsofoak.org/shop/
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Transcript
(Hearts of Oak)
Francis O'Neill. It is wonderful to have you with us.Thanks so much for giving us your time today.
(Francis O’Neill)
Thank you, Peter. Thanks for having me. 
Great. And obviously, wanted you on, seen many of the videos, pictures, the whole thing with yellow boards, trying to get a different narrative, I guess, to what the mainstream put out.But people can find you.There is your Twitter handle @FrancisXONeill. Also, the sub stack, the links are in the description and they're also on your Twitter page.Francis, maybe before we get into what's been happening, how you've been getting a message out, the response from the public, what are the issues which have become a freedom encompasses a lot and it's become much wider than anti-Covid tyranny.Do you just want to maybe introduce yourselves, because we have probably two-thirds US audience actually now, and they may not be aware of who you are.Do that first and then we'll jump onto the yellow boards.Well, I'm actually a self-employed artist and I was teaching just life drawing and portrait painting.I was living in Oxford and making a living doing that. I was teaching from a studio, which I rented as part of a complex with other artists.And that's how I was getting by. I was doing jobs, sometimes teaching in other locations, but I'd become aware that things weren't as presented in the mainstream media due to 9-11.I had questions on the day, but I wasn't really woken up on the day.I just thought that would be resolved by investigations and so on.But as you know, with the prevalence of the internet, I mean, you start to become aware that there are alternative theories out there.I started to look into that quite deeply. And once I became aware that the official story of 9-11 was not true, I started to question other aspects of our society, our history, the way we were being told things, the way information was being presented to us.And you start to question the sources.And so I became, I underwent the process that a lot of people have gone on since 2020. I underwent it probably around from 2003 onwards. And so when 2020 came, I was already aware that this wasn't going to be true. This was another ruse. This was another means of control. It was part of a larger agenda, which we now know is called Agenda 2030, or it's the World Economic Forum calls it The Great Reset, it is a means of removing our wealth and our, sovereignty to control us.From the very beginning in 2020, I thought something needs to be done about this.I also felt a sense of guilt that the 9-11 truth movement, which I had been a part of, had not done enough.I remember the first day, I was waiting for people to arrive for my class and they did not come.This was before the lockdown, a few days before it was officially announced.I thought, oh my gosh, they are all falling for it, we haven't done enough, I was in a classroom and there was nobody here.I was waiting for people to turn up.I thought this is going to be bad. I had a sense of dread and worry on that day.I was thinking they were really falling for it. I started to be very active very quickly.I emailed everybody I knew on my mailing list for my classes.Everybody, my peers who shared the studios with me.I made my position known, which may have been a mistake professionally and it cost me later because people thought you were spreading the plague, they knew you weren't going to be compliant and so I lost, I was actually forced out of the studio mid-2021 because I wasn't complying with any regulations. But I also got out on the street within about a month. I started making videos, I was making posts routinely anyway about the truth movement. But I'd say it was about April, we started to be, I started to do the first outreach in the streets. I started making videos more to wake up my friends and family and they did actually work, I did get through to my family, they didn't actually, I never like to speak about what they didn't do, but you know what, there was an element of success there, I felt.And so, but in short, I became active.I eventually left Oxford because I'd lost my place of work, which was where I was making my income from I lost that studio because I was forced out in 2021.So I ended up in London in 2022, and I became attached to the Yellow Boards, which is what you were referencing there.And this group, the yellow boards, actually I saw first happening in New Zealand.There was a group of people along a street, a video went round, probably around 2021, late 2021, of people questioning the vaccines and they had yellow boards with slogans on them, like every 50 yards along a stretch of road.And the questions would develop as the driver went past and someone had filmed it from a car.Now this took on in England and also with the rebels, we have a thing called rebels in roundabouts, which started in Stockport.One of the guys there actually said that he'd seen my videos from Oxford and it had helped sort ofinspire or encourage him to get out and do that sort of thing. One of the guys who set up the Rebels and Roundabouts. But Yellow Boards is not my invention, it's something that I've, got involved with that was already ongoing by the time I arrived in London in 2022 and so what's happened is sort of, I'm not really an organiser or a maker of flyers and boards and things like like that. So there are very hardworking people who do this.And I seem to be the one who, like an unofficial spokesperson, I'll speak to the camera and I'll speak to people. If someone comes to ask a couple of questions, they'll say, go and speak to him.They'll talk to you. And so that's my role. I just talk to people and present the information as best I can.
So your name keeps coming up. Francis O'Neill, you know, yellow boards. Oh, yes.So I want to, there are a couple of things I want to pick up on that, But let me just play some of the clips from around London, just to give the viewers and listeners an idea of what happens in case they have not seen it.So let me just, the first one is, the first one, actually, is Shepherds Bush, I think.Let me see. First one, Shepherds Bush, which I know very well, just around the corner in West London.Let me just play this little clip. And then there are two others from London.(cars beeping in support of yellow boards)So that was Shepherd. Let me do just another one up in Harrow. Shepherd Bush is West London.Harrow is kind of North West and it's the same thing and I want to ask you about kind of that response.You obviously hear the horns beeping on the cars, but here is North West London and Harrow.(Music and cars beeping in support of the yellow boards)We could go on, let me, we could show a lot of them. Can I ask you, when you went out, what were you expecting?We are, many people watching, they'll be engaged in trying to change opinion of those around them.You jump out and do something in the wide world with the public.Tell us about kind of the response you've got and obviously we hear the horns beeping.Is that a regular occurrence?When I first started going out in Oxford in 2020, the response was different.We are talking about lockdowns and people were very hostile.Oxford is like an academic town and has a lot of the research facilities like the Jenner Institute.With regard to that, initially it was very hostile but there were people who were very grateful.Thank God there is somebody who is out there on the street.I felt all alone and I didn't realise other people thought like me.You tend to get a range of those emotions.
And we do different subjects obviously, so in London with the yellow boards, the ULEZ , obviously with car drivers, is almost universally unpopular.It is restricting car movement and so on. I think it is also serving to waken people up to the wider problems and agendas I mentioned earlier.With the ULEZ, when we put ULEZ boards up, you tend to get a good response.The good thing about it is, not there are some people who will disagree and they may drive cars because they still think it's in their best interest to have less pollution or whatever the tagline is it seems to vary which I think is very strange as well sometimes it's about an environmental emergency and sometimes it's about children with asthma and obviously it could be about both in theory if it's about clean air, but it's not about clean air because actually if you test the air in London in most places it's very very clean and where they do have hot spots they're not doing anything particular to to solve the pollution in those areas and also on the tube it's up to it's, different studies have said different things like it's 40 times dirtier and people tested maybe have made it higher in terms of the contaminants in the air on the tube so they don't do anything about the air on the tube which is where they're trying to push everybody to go into the public transport but they're concerned about the air where it's actually well within safety standards above ground. And I think people are wise to that. I think people in the cars, they've cottoned on to the fact that this isn't true. So when we go out now, particularly, and it has increased over the time I've been involved, and also obviously since the time it started, but as I say, I can speak from my experience from, 2022, probably mid-2022 in London, even the ULEZ, now it's deafening. You go out there, You get constant car horns.We are not always filming. Sometimes you miss the bits where it is ridiculous, the noise and the cacophony of cars going past.It depends on the location. Sometimes you go to a location that is more muted.And you get more conflicts of opinions where people think that...It is usually people...We are always a bit wary of the cyclists because they sometimes hurl abuse at you.You often get people going past on the bikes as well, tinkling bells going, as in because they don't have a horn obviously on the bicycle so they'll show their support tinkling the bell so so you just can never be sure who's going to say what to you, but the pedestrians...Can be interesting and say things to you. And then you get into dialogue.And sometimes people in the cars will say things like, or like they'll say you're crazy, or I had a guy waving his asthma inhaler at me today. You don't care about me.And I'm saying, well, it's not about air. And I try to explain the things I've just mentioned about how the air is worse on the tube.And when you test the air, it's fine. And it's about control.And I try and make them aware of that.But we all try to be as non-confrontational as possible, but sometimes we get told we're killing children, which is ironic if you actually look at what's going on in the world at the moment.So we're the ones killing children. So yeah, so mixed responses, but overwhelmingly positive about the ULEZ.And I'd actually say we went to the COVID inquiry and we, when Abi Roberts got arrested.And I was surprised given the varied reactions we'd had to COVID lockdown and vaccination outreach that we'd done before, the overwhelming- 
Tell us about it, because obviously it started, all of this has started in a pushback towards restrictions under the COVID tyranny.And I know you were there, I know Abi was arrested. We had her on just after, and her talking about how you were waiting outside, waiting for her.And I think you realize who your friends are in situations like that, when you get arrested.Where's everyone gone?Oh, they've gone home, and you waited outside. And that camaraderie, that connection, that networking, that standing shoulder to shoulder has been something that I've seen turning develop over the last three years.I met Abi at one of the marches in London where they have these worldwide rallies for freedom and Abi is a regular at those and I had a mutual friend and said, Abi is going you need to say hello to her.So I said hello to her and you never know if you're going to hit it off with people or whatever.Abi and I were interviewed by somebody came up and interviewed us and we just had like a sort of rapport and it was funny, we were making a bit of a joke with the interviewer and things like this.And so we hit it off and we had a nice conversation and then stayed in touch and just said, like, I'm going down to the COVID inquiry.And I knew that she'd be interested because Matt Hancock, who was our health secretary during the lockdown, was gonna be there that day. And she said, okay, I'll come down.And so she came down to hold a yellow board and make her presence and her opinions known.And she only lasted half an hour. 
I understand what you mean when you say Abi making her opinions known, it's beautiful.
She wasn't actually that bad, I mean I know that she's very, as in from the police or the establishment perspective, she wasn't that bad, it was just kind of hilarious that she probably lasted about 23 minutes and we had a half-past eight in the morning or something like this in there.And anyway, so she, we walked behind a camera with the yellow board, and we'd been told not to encroach on this space where the camera's filmed.The previous time we'd been at the COVID inquiry, which was about a week before, a few days before.And Abi hadn't been there, so she didn't know, so she just marched in behind and held a board behind one of the reporter's heads. And actually it was a station that she'd previously worked for, the GB News one.So I followed her in and put a board up there and just thought we'll stay here until they move us on.And we did it with Sky TV as well. And then, uh...And she said a few things to the ranks of cameramen and photographers.What have you all been doing? Why are you not reporting anything?And she might have used the F word a couple of times, but nothing too severe, nothing they hadn't heard.And then this guy came out and she's told the story anyway.But yeah, it's on film, you can see. So when she started, when they came to arrest her, I just thought I need to keep my mouth shut because I'll speak over the dialogue and I'll just film it and get a really good footage of it.But then I didn't know whether to put the footage out in case they didn't have any incriminating evidence against her. So I had to sit on the footage until she was released. And then she, there was one moment where I thought the police reacted, I haven't mentioned this before, so in the footage you can see the police, one guy's already told her she's arrested and the others are trying to reason with her, so it didn't really make sense, and they seem to be trying to calm her down and she was saying, do you see this? And she showed one of the badges that she wears for Trudy and whose son committed suicide during lockdown and she was saying, you know, and they, the police, in my first impression of it seemed to recoil at that point.And I thought, oh, wow, that was powerful.Like I was filming it and then, and they seemed to, but when I watched the footage back, I think what actually happened though, he thought was, we can't reason with this woman.They gave up trying to like mollify her and settle it down and stuff.That, cause I thought at first it was the power cause that's what it affected me.And I thought, oh wow, that's got to have an effect.But actually I don't think that's what happened. I just thought that she's, we're going to have to, but they'd already arrested her. So, and then they arrested her and they took her away.And I felt a bit, because I'd invited her down, kind of knowing that she'd provide a bit of fireworks, right?So I felt a bit like, what's the guy? Fagin or something, getting her into trouble.And then she was in the cell. So I felt kind of a responsibility as well.And also thought that if I was in the cell and everyone just went home, I'd come out thinking that's not very nice.So I went down to wait. And also she told me it's only going to be a couple of hours because she'd been given that suggestion.And then as I started to wait and it started to get into the evening, she'd been there 12 hours, the police started to say to me, listen, mate, you're going to have a long wait.And they'd obviously changed the way in which they were going to process her because instead of it just being a basic, you know, you've done a minor misdemeanor, let's get you in and out.They just decided to be awkward and hold her in and charge her in a different way.And they let her out at three in the morning just to be, I think, just to make it unpleasant and uncomfortable for her.So the police became aware of this and rather kindly actually said to me, like, you'll be waiting a long time mate, you should probably go home, she's not going to be let out till the morning. So I had to go and that's what happened.Obviously the whole COVID, well COVID whitewash, not inquiry, but tell us how, because whenever you've been out with boards, it's one thing going with those big demos, where it's that spirit of togetherness and everyone is 100% awake, where you go out on the streets, you kind of expect it to be it to be different. I'm sure going to those demos, I'm sure you've got a lot of pat on the backs and a lot of kind of well done and realizing that people appreciate how you're putting the message out. 
Well on the bigger demos, you're amongst a lot of people so there's the strength in numbers and as you say that you can have a chat with people who think the same as you, you still get some people even on the bigger ones if you're on the edges on the peripheries of a group of people marching down a street where people will pull faces or say get lost or shout some abuse at you. You occasionally get that, not normally though because of the numbers because they're slightly intimidated by the numbers. People tend to keep their opinions to themselves when they see thousands of people marching down.You are a little bit more exposed if you go out with a board but generally speaking it's okay.I mean, one of the, connected with the Yellow Boards, I should say, in Stockport, a thing called Rebels on Roundabouts started up at one of the roundabouts in Stockport near Manchester in the north of England.And I went down there a few times, because that's where I'm originally from.And we had eggs thrown at us from a passing car and things like that.And that occasionally happens.But to be honest, most of the time, I don't feel like I'm under threat.I know that sometimes people say nasty things to you and that might, other people might bother them more.I don't really, it doesn't really faze me, I don't think, I don't think it really fazes the people who do it.If people, a lot of the time people are not very brave when they confront you, for example, people will sit there in the car at the lights and when the lights change they'll shout something just as they're going, or the same with a cyclist, so, or if they're passing at speed, so sometimes it's quite funny when they say something to you and then the lights change and they have to stop and then they they sit there like that, or me, cause you can come and say something back then.So yeah, there's not, I don't know. It's not something that concerns me really.Like I think you are going to get people who disagree with you.And I would say my goal and the goal of people there is not to have a confrontation.So if somebody's, sometimes you get people really angry saying you're killing children, you know, it's disgusting.And because we say with ULEZ, they see that as saving children with asthma.Or that's what they've been primed to think.And we say, well, can you explain that? Like, or just, I just try and, or if someone's so in such a heightened state, I just let them carry on walking, or if I can, I'll try and reason with them and bring them down because I learned very quickly, that in 2020, if you go out there, if I go out there and I'm angry, which I was initially in 2020, and start shouting and raving.It's not gonna get anyone on your side.And that's the goal, really. So for the most part, we're there to have reasoned discussion and to share our views and to make people at the very, even if we can't change their minds, obviously, and sometimes you can't do that instantly, is just to make people think, realize that we're not crazy, that we are coming from a reasoned position.And I think that's very important. So we're not, because obviously, they'll say to you, you're a right wing conspiracy theorist, or Sadiq Khan said it.He said, like, you're COVID deniers, vaccine deniers, Tories, all this stuff, like, all the things could think of to say that might be words to lodge in people's brains but the interesting I think I've got a line that I always think of that people, everybody thinks that it's everybody else who falls for propaganda and that includes me so I'll think like oh someone else has fallen, has been brainwashed by the state propaganda but they'll think of me I've fallen for right wing propaganda it's always everybody else who falls for propaganda.It's never me or you know the person thinking so I think that if you can make people aware that there is a different way of looking at things and at least consider it even if you reject it. I think that's a that's all we can do with the yellow boards is to make that we're trying to circumvent mainstream, no mainstream media has censored our point of view so we're trying to find a route to introduce that other point of view in a respectable way to the public. 
Yeah it is about making people think and not having that argument because that doesn't actually benefit you. But what about you because I mean it's like a political campaign, I mean I remember back in the days of UKIP, knocking doors, flyers, non-stop and it's about getting the message out and you'd see billboards about different political parties and what you're doing, it's kind of getting the message out, it's PR but it's kind of that field. I mean, how did you, are you, have you been involved politically? Are you a massively outgoing person?Because people think I wouldn't want to stand on a road junction with a huge sign. I mean, people want to keep their thoughts to themselves, not to display it to the world. What was that like. Did you have anything politically background that you had engaged a lot with people on different issues?Not all and I as I say, I started online with the 9-11 truth movement and I used to feel like an imperative. So once you become aware that that say for example, there's a great injustice going on like the war in Iraq or Afghanistan. The removal of our freedoms as well, even if you want to be selfish about it with the in the United States it was the Patriot Act and here we had the terrorism act and you could see the trajectory of of the state machinations then you think well if I do nothing that's going to continue and this isn't going to end well even from a selfish point it's not going to end well for me but I also felt like if I was in Iraq or Afghanistan or any of the other countries affected by the 9-11 wars which have been raging for 20 years so it's like northern Pakistan there's places in Africa and every that being bombed and so and also you've got Syria, Libya, Yemen all these places that have been affected I thought well I'd want someone to at least make a few memes on my behalf in the country.So that's what I used to do. I used to try and make posts and raise awareness and use the internet as many of us are now doing since 2020.So that's what I saw as something that I could contribute. And also I saw myself as being someone who could translate some of the dense material into the language or into the format, like a meme that people would engage with.So I'm not like an academic or a scientist or anything like that.I can read that stuff and think what is the kernel of truth we need to pass on and put that into that format.That is what I thought I could contribute to that movement.In 2020 I tried to do the same thing. That would be the role that I was trying to fulfil.So in terms of getting in the street and presenting that thing, I also think I have done a bit of teaching with the art I was talking about.So you get used to presenting information in front of people and being questioned and you know I've taught in front of kids, I've on in front of pensioners and so I'm not that uncomfortable speaking if I feel like I'm informed, in front of people.So there's that side of it. So maybe I was prepared to do a bit of that.But even if we're just holding a board, I think that was, I read, I think, around 2020 about if you're doing a revolutionary movement, you have to have something that other people can do.So like when we were doing the gazebo, one of the mistakes we probably made is that we would speak to and challenge the police and argue with the police and argue with the public.But not everybody feels that they want to do that. Nobody wants a confrontation really in their life.If you can go through your morning without arguing with the police, you'll probably take that, right? So that's not something that everybody can do and engage what wants to do.But if you do it much simpler, it's more passive. It's just like, you can use a yellow board.Everybody can pretend to be a signpost for a couple of hours, right?Everyone can just be like, oh yeah, I'm just holding this in the street.And it's a more passive way. And the cars are going past. Usually you can stand in a place where the cars aren't gonna stop and they're just whizzed by you and they'll just read your placard.And then you don't actually have to have an argument or a fight, you can just say, there's my board.So it's something that everybody can do is hold a board.You don't have to have read the scientific papers. You don't have to have, you know, you're not like you're arguing with Dr. Fauci or Matt Hancock or something.You can just hold the board and say, where's my freedom going or something.So there's that side of it. And that's something that everyone can do.It's easily replicable. And so you can do that. So the yellow boards have been sprouting up.And I think that's the key. got to give something that everybody can do. So it's that kind of thing. It's just making sure that we get the message out, that's the key thing. And it's not about really presenting to an audience, like in the sense of verbally.
And something I've certainly seen is nothing is from the top. I think that's why the police, government, the media are so concerned about free thinking because it's a grassroots thing. You see the yellow boards popping up everywhere, some are organized and some are not and you see the change but I'm intrigued with how people came together on the issue of, against COVID here and the issue of freedom but then you realize that encompasses so much and let me actually, let me play one of the videos of you speaking on, is this the use cash one or is this ULEZ? Let me play it and then we can touch on kind of those other issues which have come up and I think as people have thought more about issues over the last three years they're more open to this but let me play this first one. 
(Video of Francis plays)
Okay we're here today at Harrow Road and if we take things in reverse and just look at things slightly differently and wonder if there was, in the hypothetical situation, that there was a plan or an agenda to deprive us of our freedoms and to change the way we live.What would it look like and how would they encourage us to consent to it? So, if they can't do it by force because maybe there's a smaller number, they would have to get us to believe that it was for our own good and in our best interest. So, they might then tell us, I don't know, like the end of the world's coming unless you all do what we say, like, you know, like the sky is going to fall on your head or something along those lines.And then they might start to say, what we need for you to do is to use less resources and maybe, Maybe not have a car, maybe lock yourself in your home, maybe we'll bring about some measures so that all independent traders lose their small businesses, so that then you're in the sort of grasp of the state, whether it's because you're on the dole, on a universal credit or whether you're working for corporations which seem to have a lot of control in our country at the moment.So, with that in mind then, people often ask me what it is that they should do, like when, we talk to them about the ULEZ, they say, what should we do about it?Now, what guys say to me with their vans, they say, I'm losing my van, I'm going to have to give up my van and because I've not got my van, I won't be able to work, in which, case I'd be in that situation I've just described.So that's a real problem. So, if you then think about it, there's a guy called Alexander Solzhenitsyn, who ended up in a labour camp in Russia, and old Alexander said, I wish we'd have got out there quicker when they first came to us with iron bars and pots and pans and done something about it.Now, I'm not suggesting you do that, but if you're going to lose your van anyway, and you're going to lose your job anyway, and be in state control, what other options have you got?Some people are using the options of taking down the cameras, and some people are not paying the fines. In fact, millions of pounds apparently are unpaid.Now, if everybody who beeps the horn, as you hear there, did not pay and refused to pay, this scheme would not work and we have to consider that if we're all going to lose everything anyway.I think that's a good point, how people respond. That is on ULEZ, which is obviously the ultra low emission zone, which is in London and attacking the motorist. I think I saw a meme somewhere that someone said, we're told that cars, your older vehicle is going to kill children, but if you pay $12.50 it's okay, the child is saved. It's not about money. But tell us about, because there's been massive support for, against the ULEZ with people cutting down cameras. I didn't think I would see that in Britain, that level of opposition and anger and law breaking.I thought, wow, something's broken in the spirit. It's not just the British shrugging their shoulders, which we think we saw in lockdown, but actually people are doing something. I mean, tell us about that in the response and how you see that push back on the attack on the motorists.Okay, so I want to just say something that I should have said in response to your last question, but I forgot, but you're asking me about the yellow boards and what we're doing that is that what we're trying to do with the yellow boards is do what the government did to us from 2020 onwards. So they put signs everywhere, they put arrows on the floor, they put everywhere you went.So we're trying to make it, they made it ubiquitous. It was just everywhere, like the lockdown was everywhere, you were on a bus, it was on the radio, it was on a screen, it was on a post, everything, public transport, shops, everywhere. You couldn't escape it. If you engaged in life outside your house or even inside your house through the screen, you were made aware that it was this virus and this lockdown and all this stuff and that's what you were supposed to believe.So we have to use that sort of tactic against them and make it feel like, and also what they did is they made everybody feel like everybody believed the same thing. So with the yellow boards, what we're doing is we're presenting a constant stream of, like if you're driving past, you'll see not just one, you'll see 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 yellow boards with these messages and repetitive messages and you'll hear the horns which make you think if you don't agree with us why do all these other people agree? Why are all these horns going off? So it makes you feel like you're the minority which is the reverse of what happened in 2020 when you thought you were the minority if you if you didn't believe the government. So we're using the same sort of tactics there. And so there's that side of it. And also, I think what I'm suggesting in that video is that if you can get someone to blow their horn, then that's an act of defiance, like it's just a little act of defiance. But that's how they got you. First of all, it was like, just three weeks to flatten the curve.Just three weeks, okay, or two weeks in the States. And then it's like, okay, just another three weeks, just a mask. So we're starting off with, just blow your horn.Right? And then if you can hear everyone blowing the horn, then you can think, okay, what's the next step then? Okay, maybe everyone agrees with me, everyone else is blowing the horn, so like, then maybe, maybe, then they take the next act of defiance. Now, we can't volunteer that and suggest that people do that because on video or anything else like that, because it's illegal to encourage people to break the law. All we can do is point to the options, right?And so the response there that you're seeing about the defiance in London, people cutting down the cameras. There are some of us who know, some people say we think we know, but we have read the agenda and it is documented, what this plan is.As you said, it is not about money, they print the money anyway, they can print all the money they want.These people are not short of money, they are not short of control in a way.They are trying to change the nature of humanity, they are trying to control us to, the point where they make us into drones that service the elite class who still fly about, use private planes and cars and whatever else they want and have the dominion over the countryside while we live in smart cities and are boxed in like little rabbit hutches.So if you know that, then as I pointed out there, then you take the Solzhenitsyn idea of grabbing your iron poker or your pots and pans and beating them off in whatever way possible.So if you're still in a system where there is a police force and you can get locked in jail, so what are the small acts of defiance you can do? you can not pay your fine and you can spread crazy foam, you can spray crazy foam over the ULEZ camera.So if you actually know that you're going to lose everything, then spraying foam over a camera is not that big a rebellion.And I think the people who know are taking down the cameras.You know, they realize this is a pivotal moment. This is a bridge that we cannot cross.And so that is why you're seeing that. And whilst it's unusual for the British be so rebellious. We don't really have a history of revolution.If you understand what is happening, this is the time to stand up if there's ever been a time. So that is why the cameras are coming down. Now, not everybody is at that level, and which the people who are know something is not right, they know they can't afford it. And the people in the vans are saying I'm being crushed. And I can't, there's people just drive and say, I won't be able to visit my mom, like I need to get them in the car, or she needs a lift or whatever it is.And there's people who are losing their businesses, because they rely on their van for the business to take all their tools to work and so on. So they know they're losing something. So if we can just nudge them along to, you know, a nudge as in the nudge unit, if we can use that same psychological nudging, you're not alone. Loads of people agree with you. You can be defiant. You can stand up. There's solidarity and it's quite fun to blow your horn and hear the mad noise and it's like it's a kind of, it's a little act of freedom. It's kind of weird because most of the time you you drive your car, you have to obey the code of the road, and you have to be, there's speed restrictions which are coming down all the time to lower and lower speeds.And you are, you know, you don't get this, most people are not in a position where they can just rant and rave at work or at home and support, just you can whack your horn, it's a little moment of freedom, and that feels good.Okay, well, maybe I'll try, and there's loads of it. So we're just trying to get people to recognise the numbers and the strengths, and they have the power.And it might not be as, maybe I'm talking that up a little bit, but I think that somebody has to take some steps somewhere and the more rebellious are taking down the cameras and the less rebellious are blowing the horns and we're hoping they can meet in the middle and just throw the whole thing out.
I love that a one-pound thing of silly string or shaving foam can shut down a network of cameras that cost billions.It's beautiful to see that.I think, obviously, whenever you've got a system set up there for taking pictures of cars, automatic number plate recognition, and then that's fed in, that then is a whole surveillance system that is set up.And I think that some people realize that can be used and repurposed for anything but many people don't and you're told oh it just takes a picture and then it disappears and no it's part of a gathering of information on all of us. Do you think people realize that and are wakening up to that? 
Yeah I think the harder they push and the more extreme and illogical the measures seem to people, more people look for the reasons behind them.More and more often now, if there is a line of cars and you speak to someone and they say it is madness, he is an idiot, Khan, the mayor of London, they will say he is an idiot. It is not just him though, they're like, yeah I know. Its a bigger thing.They know it is a bigger picture.They have to look at the motive for why it is happening. It doesn't make sense to people.Why would they be crushing us in this way?People tend to understand it is not just about money. and they can also see it.I mean, the surveillance is everywhere. In Britain, we have in the supermarkets, they film your face.So it's, and if you ask, you say, oh, it's about shoplifting, but they're not filming your bag or your hands, they're filming your face.And there's, you know, there's, and to do, interact with, you know, buying tickets or anything like that, you have to give your details and, or to get into your bank account, you need a phone and a laptop or two devices, one to verify the other.So people can see the surveillance state coming in and people can see cash being phased out.So I think people have an awareness that there's something bigger than just they're trying to clean the air for kids with asthma, these guys who don't care about the excess deaths or that nobody makes a peep about wars that kill and displace millions, but they really care about your granny and they really care about the kids with asthma down the street. And also I think to some extent, obviously I don't know enough people to know, but my experience at the COVID inquiry when people responded very positively to our questioning of the COVID vaccines and made me think that the vaccines have woken people up because I think some people will, many people know people who have not had the same health since they took the vaccine. So there's a whole variety of things that are coming together where people think maybe that wasn't quite right that lockdown business and maybe those vaccines weren't quite right and maybe this ULEZ isn't quite right and maybe the phasing out of cash is not quite right and maybe there's a link between them all. So I think that people are coming around to that idea for sure. 
Let me just finish off on that cash issue, because here's another clip.We'll play a two minute clip and just finish off just touching on that and the response from people.Because I think a lot of these issues, people maybe can feel that it's too big, it's beyond them.But what you're showing, I think, is each individual can play a part and it's that individuals come together as a mass movement, actually changing things. But let me just play this two minute clip and then we'll finish off just chatting over that.(Video of Francis plays)
Okay, today we're here in Hampstead and we've just been giving out a few flyers and raising awareness about the dangers of a cashless economy. I had one woman come up to me and she was asking me about how, what's the point, what's the big deal about it, what's the problem with it, because you know carrying cash is a pain and using card is very convenient.And there is like a Benjamin Franklin quote about foregoing a little bit of liberty for safety, but in our generation we seem to be foregoing liberty for convenience almost. The other daywhen I was out doing, we were talking about ULEZ, people were saying to me about surveillance.They were saying, oh yeah, well, there's already surveillance everywhere. What difference does it make? And I would make the point to them that the surveillance that I have now, although in Britain we have more cameras per head of population than anywhere except China, is a lot. We have a lot of surveillance. But for the most part, the expense they were talking about was like your mobile phone, reading your emails, tracking you everywhere you go.You can put your mobile phone in the bin, but if you start to have like a smart TV monitor your house, you've got smart car which monitors how you travel and then when you step outside you have surveillance at every zone that they put in for the ULEZ and you then they can control whether or not you spend your money and already in this country you've had people's finances stopped for them saying the wrong things that starts to be a problem and I'm starting to realise a little bit I think that people don't actually know what freedom is or how to defend it I mean they're, talking like for example when we had the vaccines people say no you're still free to get the job but you just have to get the vaccine and they're saying you're still free to go where you want but you just have to you know pay a fine or change your car. These are erosions of freedoms, essential freedoms that we've had for a long time that people don't seem to even understand that what is happening while it's happening around them and there's almost like a complacency. You certainly feel it in some areas where people like maybe smirk at you for carrying a board like this or for talking to them about these kind of subjects that they just don't see the trajectory or the[40:54] fact that once these measures are in place it will be too late to contest them.If they don't go the way they want them to, if suddenly it's their money that's getting stopped, it's only their movements that's getting curtailed. And I think that's something very important that people should consider. But in this country, and I think in the West in general, people feel that their freedom is guaranteed for some reason.I think the thing is that, yeah, most people living in the West haven't lived under a communist system and therefore don't understand freedom as being straight. But that looked like a sunnier day in London. But on that, let's just finish off with this because a lot of these things are an act of change of thinking. We're lulled into something often because it is easier, it is simpler, it makes your life easier. So why you have to go and get cash when you can just touch your phone, soon touch your palm, soon you just walk in and it scans you. But it is people thinking actually intentionally how to push back but how kind of what has been the response from people as you've talked to them and highlighted actually maybe something that people have forgotten that actually it's just easier to have a card or a phone actually you really do need to use cash because as you said if you don't use it it'll be gone. 
Well cash is a much more neutral issue for people than say what we talk about lockdown vaccines or ULEZ because the climate agenda and the vaccine or lockdown agendas are firmly lodged.People tend to have a preconceived idea before you reach them.But the cash idea, they're just going to think, well, I've not heard much about that.And then, or they'll say, why do you think that? Or the people who've already onto it, who find it difficult to make their transactions through life using online processes.So yeah, the cash is more neutral and people seem to be more willing to listen to you about that because they're curious or because they hadn't really thought about it.Because it is convenient not to have coins. And if we had a benevolent system and a benevolent government, you know, maybe I'd have no problem with it if you could trust the system. But the fact is that we live in a world where every potential misuse has to be factored in and the government will misuse it to the or somebody at some point will misuse it to the extent to which it's it's possible to misuse it and and that will be to our detriment if we don't have the freedom to spend our cash but I also wanted to say in terms of you mentioned the cameras before on on the ULEZ, introducing the surveillance.That that monitoring that is being brought in. I see a potential threat because you said that we've not had an experience of communism or totalitarianism in this country, but we had it the past three years. I mean, in the Derbyshire Hills, they had drones following people around who were going for a walk on their own, and ordering them home or giving them some kind of police notice for walking in the hills in the countryside. So if you bring in cameras that that can surveil your movement, that those can be, again, misused to the extent to which the state has the potential to misuse them.So if you link all, as I said before, if these things are all linked together, and World Health Organization has a treaty coming in, in which it can override national governments and say if there's the potential for a health emergency, they can impose measures like we've had before, like the quarantines, lockdowns, testing, tracking, tracing, the potential, not the reality of it, just a potential for a health crisis, then you have these zones that are surveilled.If we saw the technology that they had with drones that they use for people in the countryside, if they've got the technology to shut down zones, we already know in this country that they shut down what they call tiers.No, they shut down areas into what they call tiers.Then what would stop them from shutting down an area where they said, oh, this area's had an outbreak because the PCR test, which is not fit for purpose, said that one person, two people had a nosebleed already had a, you know, a cold, they could use the surveillance to shut that down.So I think that the experience of totalitarianism over the past three years has made people more alive, to the fact that these powers can be misused.So when we go out and sort of speak about these things like ULEZ or cash, and you say to them, you might need your freedom sometime, you know, you might need to be able to get into that shopping centre.I mean, in some of the shops, they started to use the one-way arrows on the floor, and some of them had doors with traffic lights on them. So you could go in this door and not this door.It's only one step away from locking you out if they see you as a plague carrying vermin, which is kind of the way they characterize you anyway, because both these schemes, the COVID scheme and the ULEZ scheme, characterized, first of all, they make the air out to be poisoned, as in it's dangerous for you to breathe the air, whether it's ULEZ with cars, and both of them, the people, The agent poisoning the air is the human being.So you are the vermin that is the blight upon the earth and essentially when they say they need to stop the spread, they're talking about people, they need to stop the spread of people, we need to stop them driving around, we need to stay in their homes, we need to stay in the smart cities and all these things. Now people might not have it crystallized in that way in their head but they're aware that something happened over the past three years that was a bit weird and they're aware that they would, that they will remember that it wasn't nice to be locked in their homes or, or prevented from going to shops and supermarkets and nightclubs and pubs and clubs and doing all the normal pleasures of life.So if you start to say to them, the cash could be used in a way, or sorry, the absence of cash could be used in a way to control your purchases or your movements.And would you, I say to them a simple question as well, would you like it if I had control over how you spent your money?Or any other person, like an abusive husband or a wife or a father or whatever, just some third party could say whether or not you spend your money or where and when you spend your money.They can connect with that. They don't want a third party involved with their money.Some people think you're mad, obviously there's still always that range of opinions, but I think that's something that people can very easily identify with.And it's not laden with the same belief system that like belief in the global warming is or in the magic cold that didn't exist for some protests.And did for others or that kind of thing. So it's not laden with that kind of propaganda onslaught.You can just say to them, there's something, cash is your freedom, you need to have control over how you spend your money and they'll go, all right, I hadn't thought of that.
Francis, I appreciate you coming on and it's a whole range of issues which have sprung up, COVID tyranny, cash, ULEZ, net zero surveillance, huge issues but love what you do with the yellow boards and I've be looking forward to getting you on. I love having people on who I don't know, I don't never met before and have them on chat so thanks so much for coming on today and sharing what you're doing with the yellow boards.
Thank you for having me, Peter. It's been a pleasure.

The Week According To . . . David Vance

How’s the craic?It's another Irish night at Hearts of Oak as David Vance returns afresh to give us his honest and often scathing appraisals on the talking points, from the news and from his social media this past week.So join us as David and Peter get stuck into this weeks topics, including...- Trans Madness: Man wins woman of the year.- "Free Palestine” demos across Europe and beyond.- Have Hezbollah have joined Hamas?- Muslim immigrants take to the streets to support Hamas across Europe. What have we imported? - Grooming Gangs: The never ending Rape of Britain continues.- Outrage over order to NOT jail rapists as our prisons are full. If we can’t jail them, what can we do with them?- Captain Toms Legacy: Was it a completely manufactured psyop?- Day of Global Jihad.
Pureblood David Vance will not submit, and he will not comply.He used to be disgusted but now he tries to be amused!In the battle for truth and liberty, David chooses the front line, he has been writing and talking politics for a long time and is a published author, political commentator and podcaster extraordinaire!If the Covid 19 plandemic taught him one lesson it is that critical reasoning and a healthy contempt for the mainstream media are desirable armoury in the fight against tyranny.
Follow and support David on the following links.Website: https://davidvance.net/GETTR: https://gettr.com/user/davidvanceTwitter: https://twitter.com/DVATW?s=20&t=vaRYl6wCZ4_ZLJ9DB0xpXQTikTok: http://tiktok.com/@thedavidvanceLocals: https://thedavidvance.locals.com/BrandNewTube: https://brandnewtube.com/@TheDavidVanceChannelPodcast: https://vancedavidatw.podbean.com/
Recorded 13.10.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstin and Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBoschFawstin?s=20 
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Godfrey Bloom - Elite Financial Institutions: Controlling Our Lives from the Shadows

Show notes and Transcript
Godfrey Bloom is well known for his time as a UKIP MEP in the European Parliament where he served 3 terms, but he joins Hearts of Oak today to discuss all things finance. Godfrey's career was in the military, financial economics and he spent many years as an investment banker. He has written many books including 'The Magic Of Banking: The Coming Collapse'. Godfrey discusses how he has managed to fuse together a life in the army, in politics and in finance. He then then delves into the shadowy financial institutions which control all our lives and have pushed every government into a spiral of debt that will sooner or later collapse the global financial system. We finish by looking at gold and why Godfrey believes it is the perfect store of wealth.
Godfrey Bloom is a libertarian author with six books published on both military history & Austrian School Economics.He worked in the City of London where he won an international prize for fund management (fixed interest) with Mercury Asset Management. Bloom finished his city career as General Manager of a life assurance company.He represented Yorkshire & Lincolnshire in the European Parliament & was a staunch campaigner for Brexit for twenty five years.During his term of office he attracted over sixty million views on his chamber speeches exposing State bank & tax malpractice on Facebook & You Tube. Thought to be an all time record. He brought experience if not influence to the mainly lay EU Parliamentary Monetary & Economic Affairs Committee, putting both members & European Central Bank President under unaccustomed pressure.Godfrey Bloom passed out of Royal Military Academy Sandhurst in 1976 & served as logistics liaison officer to 4th Armed Division in Germany. He is an Associate Member of the Royal College of Defence Studies & has presented papers & lectures to The RCDS, Joint Services Staff College, National Defence University Washington & too many universities to list. His speciality is procurement & geo political military strategy.Godfrey Bloom is holder of the Territorial Decoration & bar, Sovereign’s Medal, Armed Forces Parliamentary Medal & European Parliamentary silver medal. 
Connect with Godfrey...WEBSITE:     https://godfreybloom.uk/X:                  https://x.com/goddersbloom?s=20SUBSTACK: https://godfreybloom.substack.com/
Interview recorded 19.9.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstin and Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBoschFawstin?s=20 
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Transcript
(Hearts of Oak)
Godfrey Bloom, it is wonderful to have you with us today. Thank you so much for your time.
(Godfrey Bloom)
A pleasure to be here. 
Great to have you and people can follow you @GoddersBloom on Twitter. Godfreybloom.uk is the website and godfreybloom.substack.com. On the website you can get about gold and your wealth, the great reset, climate and green energy, COVID, military, all topics that I know our viewers and listeners will be interested in. But for our viewers who may not have come across Godfrey Bloom, he has a long and varied career encompassing financial services, army, politics. It was the politics where I first came across you serving two terms, I think for UKIP in the European Parliament. And one of Godfrey's books, all available on the website, but is The Magic of Banking, the coming collapse paperback. Now Godfrey, how did you manage to fuse together finance, military and politics? It's an interesting mix.Well, of course, it's the only advantage of being very old is that you get lots of opportunities to do lots of stuff. So it's not because I'm particularly clever, it's because I'm particularly old. So just to bear in mind my background in the 1960s, I went into the city with a very prestigious Broking House in the 1960s, about 1966-67, in those days.Now, in those days, if you were going to get anywhere in the city, it was, first of all, you had to wear a bowler hat. You had to have a bowler hat, and it seems a long time ago now, but you didn't have to wear it, you just had to make sure you had it on the hat stand. I still got it. And the other thing, a couple of things, all the senior directors were wartime officers. All the middle management were National Service officers. So you had to have some kind of military connection.Shore Service Commission, Territorial Army Commission, perhaps with a prestigious regiment.And so on and so forth, and you had to play rugger, as we called it in those days.I ticked every box in a fairly modest kind of way.That all fused together. As you go through life, something pops up.My main life was an investment fund manager, a pension investment fund manager, specializing in fixed interest with a view to pension investment.Dull, very un-prestigious. The equity boys were the glamour boys. It was a bit like the difference between a fighter pilot in the war and coastal command. I was more coastal command. So that's what you had to do. And then I was in a territorial regiment and I was then attached, I did a short service with regular back to the territorial army, so on and so forth.Started in life armoured reconnaissance with 4th Armoured Division in Germany.Where we had the sort of stuff that you see now in old black-and-white movies was actually state-of-the-art stuff when I was soldiering. It was all a very long time ago.Then, when I worked for a very prestigious investment house in the city, I was asked to investigate the implications of becoming the common currency, as it was called then in the late 80s and early 90s, what did it entail, so on and so forth.I had a very good team of statisticians and people. I looked at that and I saw the implications.I dug deeper into the implications of our membership of the European Union.And the deeper I dug, the smellier the whole thing got.And that drew me into politics in 2004, where I resigned from the board of financial service companies and went into politics, which was an eye-opening experience.So that's why I came to do all these things. You couldn't do that now, I don't think, because the world has changed and everything is really too focused on micromanagement and micro career patterns and so on and so forth.So I was very lucky to be born when I was, you could have a really holistic kind of career pattern, which gave me my army and politics and business.So I had all three. I don't think you could do that now. 
Very true. And I think that connection with the military and our politics public service has gone as well.And I think that's a shame for our country.But let me talk to you. Many people think they are free to vote for what they want.They're free to go where they want.They're free to use their money as they want.But it's that financial freedom or maybe lack of it. I want to talk to you about.There are financial institutions that can operate in the shadows that control our lives.And I know you've written about this, you've done videos about this.Do you want to kind of touch on that and maybe pull the veil slightly back on that?Well, I think it was Jacob Rothschild who actually got it dead right, for better or for worse, and I would suggest worse.And that was, he said, it doesn't matter who you vote for, it's who controls the money.And of course it's been the Rothschilds being part of the cabal that controls money.Since I don't know, probably 120, 130 years at least, not just in this country, in Europe as well.So he who controls the money. And of course, as we become a more secular society, money becomes the primary goal. It is the religion.It is the religion of Western Europe, it's the religion of North America. It's how much money.In a secular society, of course, you lose any form of moral compass.If indeed, perhaps there was any moral compass, I don't know, but I'm sure there was more moral compass in yesteryear than there is now.So the deal is, and which means you can buy any journalist and you can buy any politician.And almost every single journalist and every single politician is bought.There are very few exceptions. It isn't always overt, but you've only got to look at certain responses from journalists.And I'll give you one very easy example of that. In Syria, for example, when the CIA and the Washington neo-cons are trying to destabilize Syria in order to get their pipeline coming from Qatar, it's all about money, it's all about money and influence, and this is what was happening.Then of course you would find the CIA would put out a press release saying Assad has dropped poison gas on his own people and he's a very bad guy.That would be a CIA press release. Now, people like Andrew Neil on BBC TV would read that out within hours of it being circulated.There was no possible question of us checking whether it was true or not.And Andrew Neil, who was a sort of dwyan of supposedly independent broadcasting, joke, joke, would read that out with a straight face, which meant everybody watching BBC would believe that to be true.And of course, subsequently, we find out that it wasn't true at all.It was CIA propaganda. Or indeed, I have to say, sadly, MI6 or MI5 propaganda.So you're getting a constant stream of lies from legacy broadcasting, and people believe that it was the same in the fake pandemic.80% of people in this country will believe it if it's on the BBC, and psychologically, I did a course with the Smithsonian Institute on trying to get to the bottom of this psychologically.80% of the people, I don't think it's just true of Britain, I think it's 80% of most of the Western industrialized countries, will believe anything they're told, and people do. The people who push back against it are kicked out or de-platformed. I mean I'm de-platformed. I used to be a regular speaker at Cambridge University and various other universities.I can't get on now. I haven't been interviewed by the BBC now for years. Dissent is verboten.So there's no concept of dissent. But if you do an audit trail of all of it and you if you go right back and find out why is this. You will find it's about money or political power.There are no exceptions and there are no good guys left in politics.Well obviously in finance we've seen, I mean Nigel Farage just talked about his issues with banking, it's happened to many many others and it seems as though banks can punish people for whatever reason and I think that's a world away from the traditional view of the bank being someone who kind of looks after your money, it's safe, it's cared for, it's maybe invested well, and I think what we've seen in the last few months has been a completely different side from the banks.Yes, but of course the banks have been politicized as well, have they not?You're looking at concepts of ESG, so your ratings for stock holdings by BlackRock and Vanguard, who are the biggest investors in the world, together they own the world, basically.They actually own each other, but that's another long story.So you have Larry Fink and people of this Vanguard, of course, and people you don't even know who voted, because it's not publicly quoted, so you don't even quite know who really owns it. So, it's highly politicized.And, of course, the situation with Nigel Farage was interesting, because NatWest and Coutts are 38% owned by the government.So, you couldn't get more to be more of a political bank than NatWest.It is a government bank.And the chief executive was put there because she was a government appointee.She has no knowledge of anything, finance, whatever. I mean, laughable. I mean, when I was the director of a main investment bank years ago, I wouldn't have employed her to clean the cars. She's utterly hopeless. She's a political agitator with a clean, squeaky-clean record, common purpose, WEF, the whole tutti-frutti. Of course.Expertise went out, and so did discretion and confidentiality. She had to go because she broke confidentiality, which is at the basis of banking, and Coutts in particular, where I also used to be a client when I had enough money to be a client of Coutts Bank. So you have all these problems.Of course, it's interesting enough, she's gone. She went with £2.3 million payoff.And I bet you anything you like, in two or three months, she'll pop up somewhere else in a very senior, very highly paid appointment. That's how the game plan works, all right?So, it's all about money and so on and so forth, but of course, I have to say...This has been going for some time. They did the same thing to Tommy Robinson, they did the same thing to Britain First, they did the same thing with the political platform of For Britain.They were debanked, which means it's very difficult to function in modern society if you have no form of bank. You can't collect subscriptions, you can't do anything.Interesting though, I have to say, this has been going on for some time.But when it happened to Nigel? That's a different game, is it? Oh, that's a much different game. It happened to Nigel. Nigel wasn't bothered about this until it happened to him. It's the old theory, isn't it, of Winston Churchill.You placate the crocodile on the basis that you hope he will eat you last.
No, it's true. I thought exactly the same, although I was thankful for a high-profile figure to highlight the injustice. But you're right, it's happened to most individuals don't have the ability to have a nationally out program or a newspaper column to talk about this injustice.So at least it is being aired. But as you pointed out, the madness of a bank being partially government owned and the government said, it's not our fault.And you wonder, well, whose fault is this? And they were blaming past regulation.You mentioned some of those companies, BlackRock and Vanguard, and these are shadowy companies.They own parts of many companies. They're very large shareholders of many institutions.Kind of how has it got to that? Should that worry people? Is this just how financing capitalism works or is there a darker side to this?No, one has to just remind everybody, certainly the younger generation, the difference between mercantilism and capitalism.Capitalism is laissez-faire. It means that you invest, you pretty well do what you damn well like, and the only demonstration of true capitalism post-war, of course, was Hong Kong under John Cooperthwaite, where his view was, it's my job to make sure the drains work and the police aren't corrupt, nothing else is my business. That's capitalism and of course that produced one of the most successful territories on the face of the planet in a very short period of time with no natural resources. Hong Kong has no natural resources. What we have now is mercantilism, which is sometimes referred to as crony capitalism, but it's got nothing to do with capitalism.Now, in a nutshell, how these sort of things work, I used to work for a company called Mercury Asset Management, which was part of the Warburg Empire.It was the biggest pension fund manager in Europe.I was the representative of the National Association of Pension Funds, the institution there, as well as being a fund manager.I wasn't on the main board, incidentally. I was on a junior board, but believe me, I knew how the game worked.Now, when you're doing that, Merck Asset Management then owned 4% of the European stock market.That's a very significant number. It doesn't sound like much, but 4% of the stock market is big.Then they were acquired by Merrill Lynch, a big American investment house, and then Merrill Lynch were acquired by BlackRock, and so it goes on, and so it gets bigger and bigger, almost like a sort of an astrophysicist would talk to you about a black hole.It becomes bigger and bigger, and the gravity pull is beyond human imagination.And then of course the oligarchs are part of that, and they're rich beyond most of our dreams. I mean the George Soros's of this world, the Bill Gates of this world, the Mark Zuckerberg's of this world, all these people are wealthy beyond imagination. And so you'd have to go back to the Rockefellers, to find people who were that rich in comparison.And what is interesting then, they would produce organizations, institutions, like the Bill and Melinda Gates and so on and so forth, and the Rockefeller Foundation.And these also get hijacked politically, and you can go back to the Quaker side in this country, to Roundtrees, for example.Quaker, and they were very good to their employees, and they had an ethos, a Quaker ethos.And now there's a very wealthy Roundtree Foundation, which is hijacked, politically, completely.It's woke.The National Trust is woke. Everything has become woke. And woke is really just part of the World Economic Forum's game plan. And this grows and grows in power.So you end up now with a prime minister who is World Economic Forum, no shame about it. No conspiracy theory yet. You know, somebody's always conspiring. That's absolute nonsense. Look at their website. It's perfectly up front. They boast about this.The Chancellor of the Exchequer, the Archbishop of Canterbury, the leader of the opposition, Starmer, when asked, do you think Parliament or Davos, which was the most important, he said, Davos. The King who gives royal assent to our laws now is World Economic Forum agent.In fact, as far as I understand, he could be the top man. I'm never quite sure whether Klaus Schwab reports to him or vice versa but the principle is the same.So now, of course, they control everything, and Bill Gates is the biggest farmer in the United States.He owns more land in the United States than anybody else.It's very difficult for ordinary people to fight against this, and they certainly can't fight against it with a vote.Vote is totally meaningless, and so you have these huge power blocs, and our elected politicians, are simply stooges. Penny Mordaunt, for example, is a stooge to Bill Gates. He wrote a forward for her book. She's an advocate of Bill Gates. All these people are paid, and we have a CIA, who, with a huge budget, an unaudited budget, they could pay you to interview certain people or not interview certain people in a Swiss bank account. Very significant amount of money.And most people have a price.Most people can be bought.And those who can't be bought are people like Neil Oliver, on a much smaller scale, me.You can't buy me, but I'm few. I'm one of the very few, and you can't buy me because money is not my God.I don't know whether you could buy me with other things. I can't imagine what they would be.So some people are incorruptible, but that's a tiny minority, and that certainly doesn't work in politics.How have you seen, looking back at the industry, how finance works, kind of, how have you seen a change?Has part of it been more scrutiny? Has part of it been the internet opens up the ability to question, with the public going direct?I mean, Neil Oliver, obviously on GB News, but having a huge reach on social media.Kind of, how have you seen a change? and how has social media affected the people's awareness of maybe what is happening?Well, social media is a wonderful thing. You know, it's a wonderful thing that you can get a significant footprint on that. But again, most people, it's still sadly legacy TV. It's still the BBC or ITV or whatever it happens to be that calls the shots. People who follow social media of course are the most informed but then if you look at my whole, just let's take me, my whole footprint is probably, I probably in total have overall something like 160,000 subscribers.That really isn't very many. Obviously, Neil Oliver is much bigger, and I'm glad of that because he's, in my view, a great man, a great historian, and a great leader of thought.So I'm a huge supporter of his. But there's still most people, most people go with the flow, they half watch BBC, they half watch ITV, doing something else, putting a shelf up, doing the ironing, whatever it is.So most people accept what they're told.Most people, of course, when it comes to things like pandemics or so-called pandemics, listen to their doctor. People have this divine faith in the National Health Service, which is, of course, ludicrous if you dig down into it, but most people do. Again, it's a legacy thing, and it goes back to people being brought up on Doctor in the House, black and white, Ealing movies, funny enough, where you are now. Wonderful things when it worked and when it was incorrupt.Now, of course, that's all gone.The Bank of England, central banks are now political appointees.You have your head of your central bank, Carney is a classic example, brought in as a Canadian, ex-Goldman Sachs, most of them are ex-Goldman Sachs, which is known as the vampire squid in the city.Even hard-nosed investment bankers like mine used to regard them as beyond the pale.These are the sort of Vlad the Impaler of the investment banking world, but they're all political appointees, so Carney was a political appointee.So that this nonsense of the Bank of England being independent.So it doesn't work like that and they go on to other political appointments with the UN or the International Monetary Fund or the Bank of International Settlements which of course nobody ever told us about, which is the most powerful institution in the world.So all these things come together to thwart the ordinary guy.In my experience in Britain, and I don't know what your experience is Peter, but my experience is the true guy who questions anything of this nature is what we used to call the artisan class.You're sparky, you're bricky, you're joiner. People who actually do real stuff for a living, they actually put kitchens in, shelves in, drive a cab.People who actually do a real job for a living are very much more highly critical and much better informed.So for example, my window cleaner is simply miles more informed than my friends who read history or law at Oxford.You know, the dinner party set, your English middle class are so gullible and naive.It's unbelievable. A working man having a pint in the pub who's a sparky or a chippy, he's not so gullible because he does a real job and sees stuff every day.So the divide, you have this divide. And people make a big mistake if they think, and people do, that the divide is somehow between class, particularly, or skin colour, or wealth.Well, it isn't. I can tell you. And 10 years in politics showed me this campaigning for Brexit, for example.The people who really understood these matters were the artisan class, but your divide in society is between those in the wealth-creating sector and those in the public sector.Your public sector, your civil servant, your man at the town hall, anybody who works for the government is protected.They have index-linked pension funds, which have long since gone from the private sector.These people are virtually unsackable, the Quangos.All these people are entitled and have the arrogance of office.There's your divide. It's not old or young or black and white.It's who works for the government in some form and who doesn't.There's your divide.Of course, in the last five years, we've seen over 100,000 new civil servants.One might imagine that they won't be happy until everyone is a civil servant and therefore everybody can be controlled.If only we had a conservative government, but I see the same difference in conversations with friends, with colleagues, and I echo what you said.Everything we knew about finance seems to have gone out the window, gone out of fashion. I mean, saving money, don't spend more than you earn, invest wisely, make sure your repayments are manageable, have cash in hand for a rainy day.Now every government worldwide seems to be in a rush to see who can run the biggest deficit, who can get the biggest debt. And governments, maybe at one time, would have been common sense.It's this rush to spend much more than any other government. What are your thoughts on kind of how we have got to that state of financial madness?Well, the problem we've had is Keynesianism. That's from the 1930s, where personal savings were regarded as a bad thing.Public spending and private spending and consumption was regarded as a good thing, and debt doesn't matter. This is your Keynesian theory which has been taught now to generations of people in universities and schools and they don't teach alternatives, they don't teach Austrian school economics, they don't mention some of the great names of yesteryear like you know some of the great French economic philosophers.So they don't talk about this. Debt doesn't matter.They can print money. Of course, in 1971 when America came off the gold standard, the dollar came off the gold standard, which was the reserve currency in 1971, Nixon closed the gold window, which was the technicality of the problem.You see the spending power of the United States dollar from 1971.That 1971dollar now would buy you six cents worth of services and goods, a complete collapse of paper currency.And of course, sterling's worse, and so on and so forth. So it's the degradation of money and it's the unseen tax inflation.So who does inflation hurt?It holds people on fixed income, old-age pensioners. Mainstream society suffers from inflation, but not your public sector.For example, if you're in the public sector, and certainly if you're a pensioner, I have a small pension for the Ministry of Justice, because I worked for them for a while.I won't go into the details there.It's very small.But last year I got an 8.5 percent increase, and I'll get another 8.5 percent, so I'm protected.I live in a small village, but we have retired civil servants in the village, totally protected.Always got new cars, expensive holidays, and extensions to their cottages or houses.Money is no object to them because they're protected. But if you're on fixed income, you're stuck.And it gets back to what I say, there's this divide in society, some people who are affected by inflation and some who are not.So when you consider debt doesn't matter, and of course, to keep up, try and give a modern veneer to it, they've taken away the term Keynesianism by calling it modern monetary theory.There's nothing modern about it. And that somehow, and this is the great key, and I tried to explain this to undergraduates when I was allowed to speak at universities.And the faculties who don't understand it, believe me, the faculties at universities have absolutely no more idea about the economic supply to the moon.So they have these thoughts that debt doesn't matter, that somehow an individual like you or me or a small businessman.Debt doesn't matter.Debt matters. You can't get into debt because debt will catch up with you and your business will go out or you'll go bankrupt.They'll come and take away your furniture, etc.That's for us.Somehow a government doesn't have this problem. Apparently, governments go on spending and spending more money, and borrowing and printing more money with no great effect. It really doesn't matter.Of course, it does matter as we're beginning to see because actually now in the United States, servicing the national debt is exactly the same amount of money as their military budget, which is $1 trillion a year.They're spending $2 trillion in the United States a year, to no purpose, $2 trillion.And then mainstream media, which of course is bought and paid for by the state, the BBC in particular, if you don't pay the BBC you go to prison and that's a government-sponsored idea.Nobody challenges it. For example, you get to the chancellor of the exchequer interviewed.We now have the highest tax regime that we've had basically since the war.Nobody ever suggests, in either political party or in mainstream media, nobody ever suggests that they cut government spending.It never happens. Nobody stands on the platform of cutting government spending.So you have high-speed rail, 100 billion.You have OECD, which incidentally is unaudited, 1 billion pounds a month.Five billion pounds to the Ukraine.God alone knows where that goes.And so on and so forth. So we spend quangos, probably 600 or 700 billion pounds a year in all these things.They could halve income tax. They could standardize income tax.They could halve VAT if they stopped spending.But stopping spending doesn't happen. It doesn't occur to them to stop spending.So when they say, oh, more money for the national health, we need more money for the national health because it's crumbling and breaking down. They don't need any more money. The national health system is rolling in money. Their problem is that out of the 1.2 million employees that they have, half of those aren't medics of any sort. They're not radiographers, physiotherapists, nurses, doctors, surgeons. Goodness knows what they all do. Yes, you need some administrators, you need some sparkies, you need bits and pieces, but do you need 600,000? Procurement.Procurement. My sister used to work for the Norwich Infirmary.She said, I can buy mattresses online, exactly the same, for a third of the price that we spend on them, because nobody's in charge of procurement.Nobody cares about public money, because it's not their money.We have waste on an unprecedented scale.The concept has gone of the public purse. If you went back to before the Great War, if you were a councillor, first of all, you'd be unpaid, there'd be no expenses, and there was a very serious concern about the public purse, taken very seriously from a moral dynamic.Nobody cares about the public purse now. Nobody cares.Does debt matter? Well, yes, it does matter, and we are going to see in the next few years, we're going to see a collapse of the banking system, and we're going to see a collapse of fiat currency. It's paper. It's intrinsically worthless. Then the people who survive that will be the people who have the foresight to buy gold, gold coins. 
Well, I want to finish off on gold, but let me just pick up on the move away from fiat, the restrictions on using cash, often in shops and businesses. It's coming more and more, closing of ATMs, closing of bank branches, and this move towards central bank digital currencies, this move towards a new government control. I mean, how have you viewed this? Give us a little bit more of your thoughts on where it's going.Well, the key, of course, to central bank digitalization, which we have to an extent already, of course, nobody, De La Rue do not print notes anymore. It's created electronically. And, of course, I explain this in my book. If you go in and want to borrow £60,000 for an extension, or you want to buy 20,000 pounds of gold, the bank clerk, if you're a good customer, and they know you, they will simply create that electronically by tapping it out and crediting your account. That's digital money. That's electronic money. It doesn't really exist.Of course, then you send it to somewhere else, the person who's sending you a car, so on and so forth. If you look at the international regulation Basel III, for example, and you have to keep 10% reserves.If you put your money, if you put 100,000 pounds into the bank, they only have to keep.
10,000 pounds of that back as a reserve. They can lend it on.Of course, it doesn't matter to whom they lend it. This is one of the problems that we have.It isn't good lending.It's not sound lending. For example, the Euro bond buying process, when I was there and I was trying to look at what they were actually buying, oh, well, it's Asset Bank.Sell them. No, Mr. Bloom, these are asset-backed bonds.Well, they're not. You get BMW or VW Finance, for example. What you're actually buying is a bond and the asset is an aging BMW or Volkswagen.It's not asset-backed at all.We found this out in 2007, did we not, where people thought they were buying a mortgage from a doctor in Washington with a nice big house at Springpool in Arlington.They weren't, they're buying trailer trash in South Chicago.I didn't fall for it.I was in the game at the time, but I knew what I was doing, because I'm an old man.The children that run the city and run pension funds in some of these councils, they fell for it because they simply didn't do their homework.You can't avoid homework.You have all this degradation of everything, bonds, stocks, deposits, not backed, not guaranteed.You have all these problems. The only way it can go is to destroy itself, to collapse.We saw this in 2007 and 2008, but did we change anything?We didn't change anything. Nothing changed.It's the same thing. They've just printed more and more money and borrowed and spent more and more money.Now we're in a situation where it simply must collapse. They want digital currencies so they can control it.They can program it, and for those of subscribers who aren't familiar with the concept, I'm sure they are, otherwise they wouldn't be watching this program, but let's just take it from there.It's programmable. The World Economic Forum, in line with the International Monetary Fund and the Bank of International Settlement will not want you to spend money on travel or petrol or meat.Are all these things that they think are bad under the cover of saving the planet, which of course we all know is absolute nonsense, its fake, its fake science. But they've got to frighten people to comply with it. The planet will boil if you don't do this. And of course most people don't have the benefit of traditional education. So they're being conned by people because a, they can't be bothered to do the homework, and b, they've probably in the main gone to a state school, this generation or the generation before, where they haven't really had an education at all. They're not educated at all. I mean, I speak at universities. Nice kids.Like a beer, play rugby, play cricket. I love going there. Educated? They're not educated at all. They don't even pretend to be. So these are the problems. You have an uneducated workforce.Programmable. So when you go in and it's programmable and the state can control it, the bank can control it, they will say you've had your ration of petrol this month. Just like the war, you've had your ration of meat this month. You've had your holiday, Mr. Bloom. You've had your holiday. You can't go on another holiday. Think of the planet, you nasty man. Of course, you look around and you see the King flying around in his private jet, the Royal Air, and all of them, Candy, all these people, Soros, Bill Gates... 
Sadiq Khan, who's just done a transatlantic flight with his entourage to talk about climate change. 
Exactly, so, everybody sees this, the question is what can you do? Now in London they reap what they sow.I have very little sympathy for Londoners. It's the second time this man's been elected.So whose fault is it? Well, did you vote against him? The answer is, you clearly didn't.That's why he's there, it's the same as Mark Drakeford, isn't it?In Wales, beautiful country, just got back there, hosted walking. I love Wales.Wales is a wonderful, wonderful country and they've got an idiot running.Well, why is he there?Who put him there? Well, the Welsh voted for him, didn't they?So it's as simple as that. And they've got a Muppet in Scotland.And who voted for him? The Scots voted for him. So stop whinging.Voting doesn't do much good, but it might because you can make more of an effort for whom you vote.And so it's programmable and we know it's going to be programmable, don't we?Because that's the whole point of it. And if you look at the World Economic Forum's spokesman on banking, they say it will be programmable. We'll know exactly how you spend it and what you can and cannot spend it on and they'll cancel it so you can't save because they are modern monetary theorists they will want for you to consume they will want you to consume so if you've got a hundred thousand pounds worth of savings or fifty thousand they say if you don't spend it by the end of the year it will disappear so that will encourage spending which they think is a good thing not saving but if you look at countries with the most successful systems over the years and over generations. It's savings. We built the biggest empire the world's ever seen and led the industrial revolution from about 1815 to 1913. The British led it, but it was based on sound money.And savings and interest rates, which outpaced inflation, although there wasn't hardly any inflation in those days. Savings made a point. Saving money made a point. There's no point in you saving money now. There's no point in you saving money in the traditional sense of saving money because you know if you were saving money for a car, which costs £30,000 today, it'll be £40,000 next year. You might as well buy it now. That, of course, degrades your entire financial system. 
I want to finish off on gold. On your website, one of your tabs is gold. People can find it forward slash gold on godfreybloom.uk. It's intriguing, the more control that is being pushed upon us, the more people have talked about gold, also about crypto looking forward, but gold looking at that traditional store of wealth. Tell us why you believe that gold is an important store of wealth and why people should be taking advantage of that personally.Well, gold is a store of wealth. It's not an investment and it's not get rich quick.And as I always say to my undergraduates at universities, I always hold up a sovereign coin. The date on it is 1905. The date isn't really relevant, but it happens to be 1905.I explained that a gold sovereign in 1905 would buy you bed and breakfast in quite a good hotel in Paris, London, New York, or Berlin. It will today, because a sovereign is worth just under 400 pounds, so it will today, and it will in 100 years' time.Then we went back on to the gold standard after the Napoleonic Wars in 1860 and 1817. The Gold Sovereign became money. That was money. That was a preservation of wealth. That was a medium of exchange, which is what money is. I say, I try to explain money in the book. Most people don't know what money really is. They think they do, but they don't.Now let's just take your staple commodity in the 19th century. Let's go from 1816 or 1817 to 1913, a loaf of bread was the same price in 1817 as it was in 1913.You can't have inflation because if politicians and bankers can't print money, you can't print gold.That's the beauty of gold, but it's not an investment, it's not get-rich-quick.It's where you protect your wealth and you have to squirrel it away to protect your family because nobody can bugger it for you. They can't degrade it. Cryptocurrency like Bitcoin has some of the same attributes. It's significantly more volatile and there are all sorts of, situations where that might not do what you want it to do. But I'm not going to go down that route because there are bigger experts than me on Bitcoin, but gold, it's free of VAT.There's no capital gains tax on it because it's coin of the realm.If, let's say, for example, you are 60 years old, you're retired, you're coming up to retirement, something like that, you've worked hard all your life. Let's say you've got about £100,000 worth of saving or £50,000 worth of saving. It doesn't quite matter what it is.You don't need it at the moment. You've got a bit of a pension. You've got a bit of this, you've got a bit of that. You're perfectly okay. What you're worried about is what happens when you get to my age and you're dribbling down your cardigan and you can't recognize your in-laws and you're deaf as a post and all the rest of it, you've got all these things, then you're going to need care, you're going to need private medical care, you can't drive anymore so you're going to need a cab if you're going to go anywhere, so on and so forth. What you want with that £100,000 or £50,000 when you're 60 is the same purchasing power when you're 75. Only gold will do that for you. Only gold, and it's been proven to do that for you, for 5,000 years. If you dig up a Roman gold coin today, or a Saxon gold coin today, it'll buy you just what it bought when it was buried in the ground or sank in the boat. That's your key. And that's where gold comes in, as it has done for 5,000. There really isn't anything else, to be brutally frank. Some people argue for silver, but it's an industrial metal, some for Bitcoin if you can cope with the volatility, so on and so forth. But that's why I'm a gold bug and I've been a gold bug since Gordon Brown sold our gold at something like 270 pounds an ounce to buy Euros. He's still sometimes brought on TV as an elder statement. The man is a buffoon. He's a buffoon. It's £1,600 an ounce now. And he got rid of our reserves. That's your reserves and my reserves. And anybody watching this clip who's British.That was our gold.So, he got rid of it and, of course, now if you look across the world, BRICS nations, Russia and China, are beginning to view perhaps gold as being the medium of exchange for countries and trade.Not buying a newspaper, not buying a pound of sausages, you'll use whatever the currency of the day is for that, of course, that will continue.For us in smaller gauge, it used to be coppers, copper pennies, silver pennies, all that.Yeah, that won't change.But for big deals, for big deals, for individuals, an exchange of trade and goods, it will be done in gold because that's the way it's been done for 5,000 years and nothing's going to change that.Certainly not Muppets like Jeremy Hunt.
There's no bigger Muppet than Hunt. We will end on that.Godfrey, I appreciate you coming on and people can follow you on Twitter godfreybloom.uk on the website and godfreybloom.substack.com Are those the best places to find you?Yeah, absolutely. Yes, you can find me and I just, if I may just put a word in quickly here.It is a not-for-profit website. Everything I do is not-for-profit.I do not turn a buck on anything that I do recommending.Even my books are virtually at cost because I don't need to make any money.Now another advantage perhaps of being an old knacker is that I've got nothing to spend my money on except beer at the rugby club.Well thank you, I've looked at the website and your Twitter and thoroughly enjoy them both for the information they provide. So thanks so much for coming on and sharing your thoughts on finance.Great, Peter. Thank you for inviting me.

James Delingpole - On a Mission From God: My Rekindled Faith

Show notes and Transcript
James Delingpole is a well known podcaster and social commentator who never minces his words, but he is also a man of deep faith and he returns to Hearts of Oak to tell us the story of how he rediscovered his Christian beliefs. In the UK, faith is a private matter that seems taboo and must never be discussed with others yet James is determined to go against this protocol as he knows the importance of faith and belief. He had a very traditional English childhood where the Church of England was a constant through his education, but once free from those schooling constraints he went his own way. But he has now gone full circle and re-embraced Christianity and found a whole new purpose in life. He shares with us how he now feels called to encourage others to find a meaning for their lives, James' boldness, clarity and certainty is an inspiration in an age of confusion and chaos.
James Delingpole is a writer, journalist, broadcaster, podcaster and columnist who has written for a number of publications, including the Daily Mail, Daily Express, The Times, The Daily Telegraph, and The Spectator. He writes regularly for Breitbart London and has also published several novels and political books.James has published articles rejecting the scientific consensus on climate change and he has not been silent in these current crazy times, a fountain of knowledge and common sense when it comes to COVID, The Great Reset, conspiracies and tyrannical political control.And not forgetting, he is the host of the brilliant, popular and ever entertaining podcast, The Delingpod..... which can be found on all good podcast apps.
Connect with James at the links below...Website      http://delingpoleworld.com/Podcast      https://delingpole.podbean.com/X                 http://twitter.com/jamesdelingpoleInstagram  http://instagram.com/delingpodclipsSubstack   https://delingpole.substack.com/
Interview recorded 20.9.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
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Transcript
(Hearts of Oak)
It is wonderful to have Mr Delingpod back with us again, James Delingpole. James, thank you so much for your time today. 
(James Delingpole)
It's a pleasure, Peter. 
Great to have you, and obviously you can follow James there is his Twitter handle, and Delingpod will bring up, everywhere and anywhere where the Delingpod is, whether it's audio you listen on the go, or whether you watch. I certainly enjoy it on Rumble, but I'll let the viewers and listeners choose their preferred platform to watch your many interviews.Now, James, I wanted to have you on. Actually, as I mentioned to you before we went on, it was chatting to Dick at the Comcast event at the beginning of the year.And the issue of faith came up in one after one of the sessions over a few drinks.So I was curious and wanted you to come on. I know there's something you've talked about, but maybe if I can step back a little bit and ask you what was your background kind of growing up in terms of faith and church?I have probably the classic background for a certain kind of Englishman, let's say. So I went to a prep school where we had chapel seven days a week, twice on Sundays, and then I went to a public school where there was a fairly similar arrangement.And I went to church at Christmas and possibly Easter.I think at the time I didn't really know it, but I was what I would probably call now a culturalChristian. I believed in the Church of England as a kind of institution, as part of the fabric of our heritage, you know, you had all thebeautiful churches run about the country. You had the vicar judging the marrows in the village fete and more tea vicar. And the church was there for when you got married and when you got buried, when you got christened. And this was part of the sort of the ritual formality that binds our country. I still respect that element, although I think it's greatly diminished in our culture.But in what you might call my normie days, I would have made a very good case, for the cultural importance of Christianity and of the Church of England, and just sort of giving a degree of shape and meaning to our lives.But what I didn't really, I didn't, I wouldn't say I was an atheist.I know I wasn't an atheist, because when I was at my prep school, I remember arriving at my prep school, I would have been about eight.And you get dropped off by your parents.And then the headmaster and headmistress pretend to be all friendly, like they do in front of your parents. And then your parents go. And then suddenly, you are.It's like being in prison. It really is like being in prison.You are shown to your dormitory.And your bed is not the comfy bed you had at home, where mommy kind of tucked you in and read you a story.It's this grim prison bed with this lumpy mattress and these scratchy blankets.And you're in a dormitory with these boys who, some of them, are crying in their pillows and stuff.And I remember that first night. And what do you do? I remember saying my prayers.Because I'd seen my dad, when I was very, very young, one of my earliest memories is going into my parents' bedroom and seeing my father kneeling down by his bed every night. He said his prayers.And so for me, it was something that you did. So I said my prayers.And I wonder now, looking back, whether a bit like,I think that I did myself a lot of good later on in life by being a cross-country runner at school.When you develop your lung capacity and your stamina at that age, it stands you in good stead for later life. And in a way, I wonder whether my prayers put me on the right footing, with God. And I suppose, did I say my prayers when I was at my public school at Morven? Probably I did. But as you know, there is a massive, there is a sort of cultural cringe towards Christianity, which I now understand is the work of the devil. You know, if you are the devil and the devil does exist. If you are the devil and you've got this institution, Christianity. How are you going to undermine it? Well, I think if you attack it head-on, what you're probably going to find is that people are going to resist and they're going to defend it. It's a bit like when big government pushes too hard.I just done a podcast with somebody who's, sorry, excuse my digressions here, but I quite like a digression. I just done a podcast with Monica Smit and Monica Smit, got, did 23 days in solitary confinement in an Australian prison cell because this punishment for resisting all the kind of vaccine mandates. And she was describing what it was like in the the state of Victoria, which, of all the places in the West, had about the most draconian COVID regulations anywhere in the world.And she said that there was a protest outside the state parliament in Victoria, in Melbourne.Which attracted 600,000 people, 600,000 people.The population, I think, of Victoria is 6 million. So when you discount all the people who were too young to attend or too old to attend, she reckoned it was probably about half of the state was up in arms against it.Because Dan Andrews, their wicked premier, pushed too hard.And I think it's the same where the devil knows this. The devil's a clever fellow.So he knows that if you want to undermine Christianity, you don't attack it head on.What you do is you make it this slightly embarrassing, uncool thing.And you infiltrate the church by making sure that you get priests, clerics, who don't really, they think that Christianity needs updating. You know, that Bible stuff, it's so old-fashioned. It's just like, they're not really.They're not very progressive on issues like homosexuality. And really, you need kind of gay marriage to, because the Bible was, happened a long time ago, and we've moved on since then.And also, you need, instead of psalms and robust hymns written by Charles Wesley with Jolly Tunes, what you need is people strumming guitars. And you need to rewrite the service book. So instead of having the old liturgy with its robust, sonorous, and beautiful language.You replace it with this touchy-feely, limp, toe rag, limp dishcloth stuff that's designed to make you feel awkward and embarrassed and to take you away from the numinous, from the spiritual side of things, which is the only side that really eats.In fact, what you do is you keep the religion, but you remove God.You remove the key element. And one of the things that's really excited me about my sort of discovery or rediscovery of Christianity is to realize that the supernatural element, the element which has largely been written out of Christianity in our secular culture, is the stuff that really matters.Because God is real.God created the Earth. I mean, despite what we're taught at schools, we're taught evolutionary theory is evolutionary fact. And it just doesn't stand up when you look into it.So my journey of faith has been rediscovering that God is real, that angels are real.Two of my followers, whatever we want to call them, have seen angels.I know demons are real. There's a friend of mine who can actually see the demons feeding off people.They harvest our emotional energy. Once you understand that this earthly world, the materium, is merely a kind of Earth-bound reflection of what is happening above in the spiritual realm, Only then do you really understand the nature of reality.Can I, I agree on that? When I talk to atheists, I say, I wish I had your faith to believe in nothing.When you see the complexity of the world. 
Yeah, that's a good one.
But can you, I'm assuming that when you left school, you kind of left that behind.I'm hearing kind of your faith as in prayer, that ritual was part of the education, but when you finish education, you left that behind, or did you keep some of that?
More or less, more or less. I had an interesting period where, when I had children.And every parent goes through this, how do you get your child into a school that is not totally shit, that is not going to break the bank. So in the early days, most of us, can't afford private education for our children. I mean, I did go private later on, but by various means, you know, sort of bursaries and helpful relatives and things like that. But you think, okay, well, got to get them into it, ideally a church. I can't do a Catholic school, because I'm not a Catholic, but Church of England Primary. And quite a lot of Church of England Primary schools know they've got you by the balls. They know that this is a way of enforcing church attendance among parents. So then it came down to what?Most churches are really grim places. And I mean, talking back then, the modern equivalent of talking about Zelensky and climate change, that they've got all these values which have nothing to do with Christianity.So you think, well, and some of them have really long services as well, really, really boring services.Luckily, we had family connections, traditions with a fantastic church called Chelsea Old Church on the embankment.It was Thomas Moore's church, I think.So lots of people have worshipped there. And it had a really good vicar called Peter Elvey.And Peter Elvey and his marvellous assistant, Susan Gaskell, who was this, she liked to sort of have a glass of champagne at 11 in the morning and with a few cigarettes.She was proper old school.And the congregation was really quite pucker. And this appealed to my snobbery apart from anything else.And I like the fact this is an old church. And I think it used the Book of Common Prayer, I think.But they had this great children's service.And in the middle of the service, they had a really good dressing up box.And if you were lucky, your children would be selected to act out whatever the day's scripture, what the day's reading was.And I started taking part in organizing this. And sometimes I would do some of the quizzes where you'd quiz the children on what been said in the story, and testing them, and throwing mini Mars bars to the child who got it.So I quite liked this. I didn't become a God-botherer. 
So this was your first, what, this may be 15 years ago, whatever. This is your first step back into the church, is it? 
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly, exactly. But it reminded me of some of the things that are good about the church. But more, Do you know what, at the time I justified this to myself more on, I remember going back to my school, back to Malvern, and talking to one of the few staff that remained from my period there. He was a history teacher, and he was describing to me how children would come up, would start at, 13 year olds would arrive at the school, and none of them would know basic things like the biblical stories, which I think are one of the bedrocks of our culture. And this really matters to me. I mean, regardless of what you think about the spiritual element, we are a Christian country. Our literature, for example, which is possibly our greatest artistic speciality, if you like. Our literature is steeped in religious learning. I mean, I studied The Dream of the Rude. Anglo-Saxon poetry is all about Christ and the cross and stuff. And then you go through to Chaucer and Shakespeare and so on. Milton, obviously.They all have an understanding, they all write on the assumption that their audience knows things like the water into wine and all the stories.And I found it shocking that I was living in a world where this stuff had been written out of our history.Probably the generation after mine is the first generation in a thousand or more years that doesn't understand the basics of the Bible. And that was shocking. So I saw it as a cultural thing. I thought it was part of my children's education, number one. And probably also at the time, I believed something which I do not believe now. I thought that the great clash of, the great war, if you like, was between Christianity and fundamentalist Islam. I didn't realize that almost all alleged Muslim attacks are actually false flag operations masterminded by the dark side. So I thought, it's Lord of the Rings time. There is evil out there, and we can see what the evil looks like. And we've got to know what side we're on. We're on the side of Judeo-Christian culture, as I would have called it at the time.So I saw it as a cultural thing rather than as a spiritual thing.
So there came a point, I want to pick up on that, cultural Christianity near the end, because it's something I've been pondering about a lot, listening to a lot of commentators.But for you, you talked about going back to church. Then was there a wake-up point, or is it gradually, when you begun to realize, actually the Bible is true, God is real, and that then requires a response from me. 
That came later. So, about just before the fake pandemic craziness, I got very invested in Donald Trump. I thought that Donald Trump was was going to save us.I don't think that anymore. I don't believe there are any white hats.I think they're all compromised. But at the time, I sensed that something was very, very, very wrong with the world.And I think a lot of people who go down the rabbit hole have this traumatic experience in some way, whether it's somebody who's had all their money taken away by the banks, that they thought banks were respectable, or whatever.My own trauma was seeing the leadership of the free world, as I believed it was then, stolen in real time by skulduggery of such breath-taking overtness.It was so blatant.And I saw the entirety of the media, which I'd thought of as a journalist of 30 years, I thought, well, the media's job is to speak truth to power and all the things that Toby Young still believes in.I thought, well, the media will never allow this to happen. They're going to point out all this blatant stuff, ballot papers being discovered by the lorry load, filled in and stuff, and footage from the various counting stations and so on.Anyway, it didn't happen. I saw that the mainstream media, which I trusted to tell the truth, was gaslighting everyone, into believing that actually this was normal and that this senile, incontinent crook in the pay of communist China and stuff, who'd never even gone on the road because his handlers couldn't bear to let such a liability anywhere near the electorate, that somehow this guy Joe Biden had won and worst of all was all the people I'd thought of as my comrades in arms, the people who I thought of as the band of brothers who were going to fight with me in the foxholes alongside me, and I could trust them to guard my flanks because we were all in this one together, that great battle for freedom, for truth, they were participating in this lie.And it was a real, real, OK. I mean, I was desperately naïve.I think most of us are, though.I think because we're subject to this brainwashing process from the earliest stage.Our parents, who know no better, tell us. And then our schools brainwash us.And then the media brainwashes.And the entertainment industry brainwashes us. So it was really, and I went through this period of about three months where, I mean, I almost had a breakdown, actually.And then you start looking into various other things, trying to make sense of the world.And you realize that the whole world is a lie and an illusion, and that there are really, really bad people in charge.And that is the stage where you go from red-pilled to black-pilled.You think, we are totally stuffed. But then, parallel to this, there were various awakening moments. So I started noticing in my podcast that I was starting to talk about that I was, I started mentioning God more, and I was starting to talk about being on a mission from God. And I said it half flippantly.But I began to realize that actually, no, I wasn't saying this flippantly at all.I remember doing a podcast with Jamie Franklin from a Irreverend Pod.Yeah. And Jamie said to me, you know, I've noticed that some of the language you've started using is really quite, you know, religious, Christian in its overtones.And I thought, yeah, you're right, Jamie. What's going on here?There were a few other things, because it didn't... there wasn't a...A saw line moment of sort of blinding realization. It wasn't as simple as that.I remember I did a podcast with Jerry Marzynski, the psychiatrist from Arizona who'd worked a lot with paranoid schizophrenic in high security hospitals and prisons. And it's worth listening to the two podcasts I did with him, but Jerry, unlike most psychiatrists or prison shrinks, who'd prefer to dose their patients with chemical cosh's and just like, you know, turn them into zombies. He actually took the trouble to listen to what they were saying about the voices in their heads. And he discovered there was remarkable consistency in what the voices in the heads were saying was the sort of thing that demons would say, because these things are demons. And he found that the most effective treatment of these demons was the 23rd Psalm. So I thought that's interesting. I get kind of voices in my head, not demonic voices. Well, I mean, I think they are demonic voices. But I think when you say to yourself things like, God, you're such an idiot. I bloody hate you, you bastard, you stupid. I hate you. You really you'd be better off dead. You should die. I hate you. I used to get that all the time, especially after nights drinking, whatever, and stuff. So I started learning the 23rd Psalm, and then I learned Psalm 91. And then I thought, I quite like these Psalms. And what I found was that the Psalms made me based, for want of a better word, the Psalms are a great solace.And it's not without reason, I think, that novice monks, the first job when they joined the monastery was to learn the Psalter.They learned the whole lot, all 150 of the Psalms.The enemy, the forces of darkness, the Russell Brands of this world, they use words.They use words like spells, and the dark side uses spells.Christians too have spells, but we don't call them spells, because that's what they are. They are a form of magic, but they're holy magic. And when you say the Psalms, it gives you... you put on the whole armour of God. They protect you. They protect you from the dark forces. And I mean, There were other moments too. I found that I would have moments where...I didn't have a voice saying, I am God, and thou art my chosen one to go.But I do very much feel, really, really feel, that I've been given a mission, a purpose. And my purpose is twofold. It's one to red pill people, and one to white pill people.And I feel really, really comfortable about that. I don't feel at all embarrassed about talking about Christianity.When I go out into the world, when I'm hunting, for example, and the fact that I go hunting pisses some people off.And I say to them, OK, I wrote a piece about this on Substack once.I say, the world is controlled by Satanists who sacrifice children to the devil, and you're worried about fox hunting. Get real. I think anyone who's against fox hunting is not actually fit to be properly awake, so they don't get it.They don't get that the war on hunting is part of the forces of darkness's war on humanitygenerally, on us ordinary people. If you saw how communities are bound by rural communities, economically they're bound, socially they're bound, the qualities that they instil in the people who do it, you know, courage, camaraderie, a love of the countryside, you know, we even love the fox for goodness sake, I mean, because the fox is a key part of the deal and we respect the fox, we like the fox, the fox is our quarry, okay, he's our enemy in the sense that he trashes chickens and stuff, and if you've seen the hen house after a fox has been in there, it's carnage.Everything that's going on in the world right now is a war on humanity, and we are created in God's image. And that is why they do it. That is why they divide us in all sorts of ways, whether it's through religious schisms, whether it's through things like animal rights, a division between artificial entirely, I think, created by propaganda, between meat-eaters and non-meat-eaters.Almost every division in society is created by the forces of darkness to divide.I think, left to our own devices, we'd all get on really quite well.We wouldn't have wars.We definitely would not have wars. Wars are all engineered by a tiny, tiny, tiny satanic, class. Where am I going with this? I can't remember what the question was.
Actually, on the Psalms, you talk about the Psalms, reading the 23rd Plasms, 91st and others.You've just started a series on the Psalms. Gavin Ashenden, I think, was the second one I watched that.That's intriguing because the only other person, I think I've seen Alistair Williams do, kind of looking at different parts of the Bible. It's something that's frowned upon, as you said, frowned upon in the UK. It's not the American right that where people are fairly open about faith, whether it's real or not. So what led you to actually going through the Psalms and talking about it? Because that's quite a step change. It puts you out there, makes you vulnerable.It's outside your lane, all of that stuff. 
Yeah. They came about me like bees, which are extinct, even as the fire among the thorns.How could you not respond to language like that? I mean, the language of the liturgy is up there with Shakespeare. It was written about the same period. I mean, I just quoted, I hope accurately, the psalm I'm just learning, which is Psalm 118. The one I've been using is, I started out using the King James versions of the version of Psalm 23, and then just KJV.But then a lot of the psalm translations in KJV borrow quite heavily from Myles Coverdale, who was translating them about 50 or 60 years earlier. And I think there's a greater charm in his translations. And so those are the ones used in the Book of Common Prayer, which were were the psalms I learned at prep school, or the psalms we sang at prep school.And I remember at school.And I was thinking, why?Why are we singing these dirgy, I mean, OK, some of the hymns are bad enough.But the psalms, you didn't really know what the point of them was.They were just, but looking back, I'm glad that I've got these phrases lodged in my head, which I was, it was like having a kind of Proust-Madeleine moment where I came back to learning these psalms and recognizing these familiar phrases which I'd resented singing at school or sort of croaking at school, you know, the fowls of the air and the fishes of the sea, and whatsoever walketh through the paths of the sea, so Lord our governor, Herakles, which is my name, in all the world.There was a point, and I doubt even the head of music, who was also one of the school's benders, who used to molest us, I'm sure was the case in most prep schools.Everyone had a kind of molesty master.I doubt he was much of a Christian, not least because he introduced with relish the alternative service book of the 1970s, that horrible yellow band thing with the horrible modern liturgy. So he was probably part of Satan's mission. But anyway, unwittingly, he inculcated us with the language of Miles Coverdale, which has stayed with me since. The Psalms are as,I mean, I'd love to be able to speak Hebrew and read them in the original Hebrew. But certainly in their translation by Coverdale and the team that put together the King James version.They work as literature. They also work as a form of solace, because what they do is tell you that however bad things may get, God is there for you. They're kind of like an instruction manual.It is better to trust in the Lord than put any confidence in man.It is better to trust in the Lord than put any confidence in princes.I mean, if you learn those two lines, in fact, one of them would do, it'd be a very good manual for living out your life, because you wouldn't be putting your trust in Russell Brand.You wouldn't be putting your trust in Donald Trump. you wouldn't be trusting, you just remind yourself that the most important thing is God.And the better your relationship with God, the better life you have. Because God works his holy magic. I mean, all Christians can testify this. All real Christians know that this stuff is not imaginary, that there are ways that God helps you, that the supernatural, the crazy stuff works. And the Psalms were a daily reminder of this. And so if you can ideally learn them, because you inhabit them more thoroughly than you do when you're reading them.I mean, I have a treasury of poetry in my head as well. I learned a representative poem by pretty much all our great poets. I mean, I don't practice them as much now because I'm too busy reciting the psalms in my head.But when you learn poetry, with your stumbling process by which you memorize these poems and you get it wrong, you actually go through the process the poet went through when he was writing this poem. And in the same way, I think when you learn the psalms, you, well, you inhabit them, and they inhabit you, and that is a lovely thing to have running through you every day.
Yeah, because there are numerous times in the Psalms where it says, tell my soul, speak to my soul, and it is a framework.It changes your focus, not only the Psalms, but Proverbs, a guide for living, and whatever you're going through personally, that is what gives you hope, and you're right.If you soak in that, you're infused with that, then that affects what you do.
They have direct practical uses as well. For example, Psalm 91, which is a warrior's psalm.Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night, nor for the arrow that flyeth by day, nor for the pestilence that walketh in darkness, nor for the destruction that wasteth at noonday.A thousand shall fall at thy side and ten thousand at thy right hand, but it shall not come nigh thee.".This, I understand, is the prayer recited by the US Marine Corps when they go into action, and probably many other soldiers as well. And it protects you. It protects you. So that's a good psalm to have up your sleeve. 
You talk about confidence in what the Bible teaches about taking that on and that becomes who you are. I'm curious because when I look at the Church of England and doubt and how that fits, I mean I grew up a pastor's kid, Baptist church, it was certainty, it was absolute, you knew what you believed. Then you look at the Church of England and kind of there's a lot of fear of offending, and I guess doubt becomes a virtue. I'm intrigued with that, where I like the absolute uncertainty that parts of the church bring to the Bible, it is the Word of God, it is true, where The Church of England  seems to struggle with that sense of truth.
Well, I don't think it's just the Church of England. I think that all the, well certainly, the Roman Catholic Church, certainly the Church of England, probably most churches, have been infiltrated by the forces of darkness. Obviously, as you would. I mean, if you were devil, it would be your key target. The Pope is the anti-Pope. The Pope is definitely batting for the wrong team. So is Welby. And yet, I quite like, I'm quite enjoying the fact at the moment that I am a sort of floating voter in that notionally I'm C of E. But I find much that is good in the Calvinists I speak to and in the Catholics, particularly the Latin mass.And it enables me, I think, to speak to all Christians rather than... I mean, I love the Orthodox Church. You're like, wow, I'd quite like to be an Orthodox monk on Mount Athos.But- 
We could do that together. That'd be good fun. 
It'd be fun. It saddens me that there are these- you see it on my telegram channels, that the Baptists and so on, and the Calvinists and whatever, they think that Catholicism isn't really Christianity because they accuse them of worshipping Mary and saying prayers to saints and stuff. And it's a throwback to the emperor Constantine. He never really converted to Christianity. That was just fake. And what he did was he borrowed all the kind of pagan goddesses and you know all this and I'm thinking...God. I don't want to speak for God. But I have a feeling that God is looking at these schisms and going, guys, lighten up, will you? You're all doing pretty much the right thing. I don't believe that he is so picky, that he is saying, well, the Catholics, they are pagans. Look at at the Asherah pole they've got standing in the middle of St. Peter's Square. How can they not?The other thing I've noticed about becoming a Christian, is that the upside is the church, the broad church, the joy you get talking to Christians about Christianity. So the other day I went riding and you're going to be on a horse talking to people for the next couple of hours if you're out on the hack. And some of them are boring, some of them are not. So met these people and two women up from London and I said to one of them.And what's your name and she said I'm called Mariam I said Mariam oh that's an interesting name. It sounds a bit...Ethiopian.  She said, I'm not Ethiopian. I'm originally from a Muslim background. I said, all right. Yeah, well, Mariam, yeah, I've heard it a lot. It's sort of the Copts. I kind of like the Coptic church. It's really old. And I didn't mention that they've got the Ark of the Covenant somewhere hidden in Ethiopia. But I said, yeah, I'm really interested in Christianity. It's just, I think, endlessly fascinating. She said, are you? I said, yeah, yeah, yeah. Can't get enough of it. And she said, I was baptized three months ago. And I said, oh, wow. So the whole of the rest of the ride, we had this great talk about God. So that's what I love about Christianity, the fellowship.[The downside is that you get lots of really annoying Christians who do things like telling you, hinting that you're not really Christian enough, or correcting you on sort of doctrinal inaccuracies. I've got views that I know are heretical. I'm not going to talk about them here, because I don't want to get stick from... But look, I think that you listen to the the words of Jesus. You follow the Psalms. You've got the creed to keep you on the straight and narrow. Go to church if you can. Take communion if you can. We're all on the same team, I think.Can I pick up, just to finish on that cultural Christianity, which has been in my head for a couple of years watching different commentators, politicians, probably more stateside, they kind of, they yearn for those days whenever Christianity gave a moral framework, I guess, and they seem to want the idea that Christianity brings without having the person of Christ.And I enjoy watching conservative commentators struggle with that, that they want this but they don't. And it's like something is so attractive, it looks good, but yet that relationship with Jesus, that actually calls them back.Yeah, I mean, didn't Tony Blair claim to be a Catholic once?I have my suspicions about other conservative MPs who go big on their Catholicism.In fact, I have my severe doubts about any of the MPs who play the Christian card, because I think they're all basically working for the other side.I think what we saw during... I hate to use the word COVID like it was real.But what we saw was the puppets of Satan just doing the devil's work to the people, trusting people who thought these were their elected representatives.I don't think that I, it's not for me to judge, but I don't think there are many MPs, any politicians anywhere in the world who are not going to burn in hell.
But what does that, because I know, I think Thierry Baudet was with you a while ago, and he talked about the Natcon conference.And he was fairly dismissive of that actually being conservative and not only the big issues, but actually what I took away looking at some of those was that Christianity no longer plays a part in those circles, apart from lip service.Is that a fair enough assessment or disagree with that? 
Totally. Yeah, I mean, Natcon is definitely another example of the devil at work. Yeah, yeah.I mean, name me an MP, a politician of any hue, who talks about real Christianity, as opposed to Erzat's Christianity. Yeah, they might like the values.None of those values involve actually believing in God. I mean, can you imagine if you asked any of them about how the world was made?All they'd be doing is thinking of the headline that X believes that, lol, the world was made by God.Come on, everyone knows that evolution is how. was Big Bang and then there was this apparently Charles Darwin tells us, you know, one of the greatest Britons as named by the BBC, so it must be true, They wouldn't go there, they just couldn't cope with it.Oh a hundred percent. I had Eric Metaxas on once talking about the death of atheism and it's a phenomenal book going into the none of this can be luck and chance, none of it, the complexity of, the world. Just a quick question, what about push back on you because you're not supposed to have a series on the Psalms on your channel, that's just not done here. Kind of what pushback, have people say, James, get back to discussing COVID the last three years.
Oh, it's no, no, do you know what? I don't get much of that. I get more, I get the occasional commentator, who has clearly been following me for a very long time in my, in my normie phase where I believed in things like the war on terror stuff.And they're looking at me now and thinking this guy has lost the plot.He thinks it's a conspiracy and what's more, he thinks the devil's kind of running the show.He needs to, you know, hasn't he read any history books? Surely he knows that it was the North Vietnamese that started the Vietnam War, you know, with their...Torpedo boat attack on the U.S. fleet. So their reference points are reference points of those trapped in the beast system. All the history books are written for the devil's party. All the politicians work for the devil's party. It's everywhere. Look, it says in 2 Corinthians, doesn't it? That Satan is the god of this world. And unless and until you understand that.You are missing the biggest piece in the jigsaw. You're never going to get it. You can be right about vaccines, that they're bad for you, and you can be right about the importance of bodily autonomy and stuff. You stand up all these principal things, but until you understand that this is a war between good and evil, which has taken place since the beginning of our time on this earth, you really don't get it at all, frankly. 
100 percent. That is the piece of the jigsaw people have to get to understand everything else. James, I appreciate you coming on. As I said at the beginning, I've been wanting to have this conversation with you and unpacking, so thanks so much for coming along and sharing your story with us. 
Well thank you very much, I really enjoyed talking about it, part of my holy mission from God. 
Thank you, I think the last guest you had on the Delingpod, just for the viewers and listeners that haven't seen, I think was Abi Roberts.And we had her on after she got arrested for swearing, and Abi is a force of nature, so if people want to catch the latest one, it is Abi Roberts on the Delingpod, everywhere and anywhere. So, James, thanks so much for your time today. 
Thanks, Peter.

The Week According To . . . Ben Harnwell

Welcome to our weekly show that looks back over the past seven days and this episode it's the return of the totally brilliant Ben Harnwell!As the international editor for Steve Bannon's War Room and the host of War Room: Rome, who better to talk us through what has captured his attention, piqued his interest or made his blood boil in the news, on social media and in the tabloids.Topics up for discussion...- Israel at War.- Laurence Fox hits out at GB News after learning of his dismissal while being detained on suspicion of conspiring to commit criminal damage to ULEZ cameras.- From a Capitol Hill basement, Bannon stokes The Republican Party meltdown.- American Voters Trust Trump.- Donald Trump followers targeted by the FBI as 2024 election nears.- Out of the 8K troops discharged over Biden’s COVID vaccine mandate, only 43 have re-joined.- Average credit card interest rate reaches its highest level in 30 years.- British university offers master’s degree in a course exploring the impact of magic and witchcraft on society.
Connect with Ben on GETTR  @harnwell  https://gettr.com/user/harnwell
Originally broadcast live 7.10.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstin and Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBoschFawstin?s=20 
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Links to stories...Israelhttps://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/oct/07/hamas-launches-attack-on-israel-with-5000-rockets-liveLaurence Fox https://news.sky.com/story/laurence-fox-arrested-after-video-showing-police-in-his-home-shared-on-social-media-12976589Bannon https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/04/us/politics/bannon-republicans-gaetz-mace.html?unlocked_article_code=nKib4hCg4u08suEva1AfWAcYLcVc6pgYSxJc7tDrWUEI1NqNBZeNMF87o-NOb-88TkLQjTOMY7hrLxU77IiA_AFRzrUnJvp9wwH7BGRNYIKNGHs_Q-uy1VcHWTBzFnAVGdkQeBvun4tT45yONrWjAcKgzbOWiO2TIqe-wMqUv9l2IBQ3ENJ7HJKYnkqPOHEyr7SduRe1p4pODgfRbkUv-YxhgCosg0qQRcsO9QxrbZDNtOfKYm1qC8wzlb66ZbRucx0e4kaTKCLaS6VrPhcYfcGkkdnhqmSFpjFl7qt5VfTlAG8z4q4mzAAJ7pZBSlv1LrK8YzIPJERxrxhMpSyynIof_VCUnLEq-OhP&smid=url-shareTrump Followers https://gettr.com/post/p2rzjw54b28Trust Trumphttps://gettr.com/post/p2rznl90addTroops Discharged https://leoterrell.com/out-of-the-8000-troops-discharged-over-bidens-vaccine-mandate-only-43-have-rejoined/?utm_source=mux&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=gtCredit Card https://themessenger.com/news/average-credit-card-interest-rate-reaches-its-highest-level-in-30-years-reportMaster’s degree in magic https://www.theguardian.com/education/2023/oct/04/exeter-university-masters-degree-magic-occult

Diana West - Has America Become a Police State?

Show Notes and Transcript
Diana West returns to Hearts of Oak to discuss a shocking Rasmussen poll which found that two-thirds of American voters are worried that their country is turning into a police state. The poll was carried out last month and 72% of those surveyed were concerned that the US was becoming tyrannical, with a government that is engaged in mass surveillance, censorship, ideological indoctrination and the targeting of political opponents. Even more incredible is that a whopping 67% of Democrats agreed with these concerns. This is a step change on American opinion and shows the deep mistrust of the government from both Republican and Democrat voters. Diana also gives us some insights on why she thinks a majority of those polled also believe that “The FBI is a danger to the freedom and security of law-abiding Americans”. We also discuss Trump and then turn our attention to the plight of the J6’rs and the outrageous jail terms being handed out.
Rasmussen Reports Poll: https://x.com/Rasmussen_Poll/status/1704947091657662531?s=20
Diana West is an award-winning journalist and the author of The Red Thread: A Search for Ideological Drivers Inside the Anti-Trump Conspiracy, American Betrayal: The Secret Assault on Our Nation's Character and The Death of the Grown-Up: How America's Arrested Development Is Bringing Down Western Civilization. Diana is also one of 19 co-authors of Shariah:The Threat to America (a Center for Security Policy publication).Diana’s work has appeared in many publications and news sites including The American Spectator, Breitbart News, The Daily Caller, Dispatch International, The Epoch Times, Family Security Matters, Gates of Vienna, Manhattan, Inc., M, Inc., National Wildlife Magazine, The New Criterion, The Public Interest, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Times, The Washington Post Magazine and The Weekly Standard. She has made numerous television, documentary and radio appearances, and addressed audiences including at the American Legion, the Danish Parliament, the Heritage Foundation, the Hudson Foundation, ICON, Institute for the Study of Strategy and Politics, Judicial Watch, the National Vietnam Veteran and Gulf War Coalition, the Naval War College, the Union League Club, and Yale.
Connect with Diana......WEBSITE: https://dianawest.net/GAB SOCIAL: https://gab.com/realDianaWestPATREON: https://www.patreon.com/DianaWest​
Diana's books are available on Amazon in print, e-book or spoken word on Audible...https://www.amazon.co.uk/Diana-West/e/B001JRU95Y?ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_2&qid=1660565570&sr=8-2
Interview recorded 25.9.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstin and Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBoschFawstin?s=20 
To sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/
Support Hearts of Oak by purchasing one of our fancy T-Shirts.... https://heartsofoak.org/shop/
Please subscribe, like and share!
Transcript
(Hearts of Oak)Diana West. It is wonderful to have you back with us. Thank you so much for your time today.
(Diana West)
Oh, it's wonderful to be back with you, Peter. 
Thank you. And of course, people can find you @RealDianaWest on Gab, and DianaWest.net is the website. People can look at either of those for your regular updates. And today, of course, a lot happening stateside, and we had, I think, Colonel Allen West on, probably about a week or two ago, looking at some aspects, more or less looking at the Republicans taking control of the House of Representatives a year on what's happened.But today we want to look on, is America becoming a police state? And this is a Rasmussen poll that you had sent over, which is fascinating reading. It gives an insight into those in the, U.S. and how they see things happen. And it is this here, looking at a police state. And the first question was, a police state is a tyrannical government that engages in mass surveillance, censorship, ideological indoctrination, and targeting of legal opponents. How concerned are you that America is becoming a police state? We can see overall 72 percent of the public said yes, they believe that America is becoming a tyrannical government that engages in mass surveillance with, you can see there in the poll, 67% of Democrats, 72% of Republicans, and 76% of GOP. Basically, we have a majority of the US public believing that is the case. So tell me about this poll, what you thought as a US citizen when you read that two-thirds of America do believe that their country is becoming a surveillance state?This, can I just preface my remarks by saying this is a surreal conversation, that we are having this conversation. I'm still trying to get used to this.I suppose, you know, my flippant comment would be, oh, they've been reading my stuff.No, no, this I think in some ways the most shocking aspect of the poll where there's the shock that the United States is becoming a police state. There's the shock that this is a poll question that is asked in very kind of, solemn or, you know, practical terms, very unexciting, just a poll question.Now, is the United States become a police state? Then such a large number, even including Democrats who generally lag on these things. And to find a consensus is good, as terrible.Terrible that it reflects the reality that I do believe we are in a police state, a new kind of police state, let us say, but also that it is a recognition by the public, as Rasmussen has polled them, that is not dependent on the mainstream media, on most, if not all, pretty much government officials, the academy, any sorts of institutions.This is alternate media, this is believe in your lying eyes, and it's also word of mouth.And so maybe there's a positive development in the sense that we're all coming on to the same page, but it's also the realization that our institutions, our leadership is part of that police state in terms of suppressing the truth.Could you see the Democrats, kind of we end up looking at them as a block, but in one way we see looking at the Republican side as split between MAGA wanting something different, wanting America first and the traditional establishment Republican, but then kind of you put it together and it is a uni party in effect.So it was intriguing that one, as you pointed out, the Democrat voters actually saw this.They've got a Democrat politician in the White House. how could they vote for someone and then accept that restriction?Well, it's... It doesn't, the Democrat side of this poll actually doesn't match other polls that I would say run parallel to this one. There was recently a real clear politics poll on freedom of speech.And this sort of reflected a little bit more of what I commonly see or what one commonly sees when Republicans and Democrats are pulled separately on these questions.Republicans tend to believe far more ardently in the importance of freedom of speech, whereas Democrats tend to believe speech should be regulated by the government, which is something we are seeing happening.In terms of the Rasmussen poll, that's a question I really can't answer unless there is just so much widespread disaffection and embarrassment at what is put forward as American leadership.I mean, you know me, Peter, I've been saying since 2020 that America underwent a coup in 2020.A rolling coup d'etat that went on from 2016 with the advent of candidate Trump to 2020 when they removed him from his second term. So this of course would be an embarrassment. The leadership here.As everything I've studied tells me, is in effect a puppet of some other forces. We know not exactly what. So yes, maybe Democrats as well are noticing the embarrassment of being forced to to submit to a demented man connected to corruption and treason as has been revealed over these years as well. So maybe they're just as embarrassed as anyone else and that is what was reflected in this poll and stricken it's not just a matter of embarrassment it's it's a deep we are We're all stricken here.And suffering. We're suffering the consequences. Again, in terms of American leadership, we have none. Just look at all of the indicators. We have what is referred to as the border crisis.It's not a crisis, it's a war. We have endless onslaughts at this point, as I'm sure you and your viewers are well aware, and suffering yourselves. We are now having this incredible uptick of illegal immigration invasion at our southern border, our northern border as well, but the southern border, of course, is much more extreme. And the people running this government, let's say, are making every provision to keep this going, to provide for these people.To wreck our cities and communities with more and more and more. And indeed, it's at the point now where you had a Democrat in New York City, Mayor Adams, actually say immigration is going to ruin this city. Well, it already has, but it's incredible when these people actually step out for a moment anyway and acknowledge reality. So we are in a crisis at so many levels, it's really hard to know how to even put it all together in this, just in terms of of cogent conversation.It's really a hot mess at this point.
Well, I wanna pick you up more on what Adams said, the mayor of New York, because that was intriguing.I was there a few weeks ago, and that, I guess, division within the Democrats, some of them waking up to the reality, is intriguing.Here's a picture that Rasmussen put up on their Twitter account just recently.And the whole issue of Biden himself.This shows him having a video call, I guess, with world leaders, probably in the mid of the plandemic, the COVID nonsense and not wanting to socialize himself.Obviously no one else in the room, in case they all died of this horrendous epidemic.But what about Biden himself? are Americans wakening up to his failure of leadership.And his inability, I guess, to lead America on the world stage?Well, I guess it depends who you talk to, because again, if he is a puppet in the White House, he's being controlled by some other forces.Those who actually support him or support his agenda will still defend it.I mean, you have liberal columnists, for example, like David Brooks or people like that, who talk about this wonderful economy or this wonderful candidate for a second term.It's a surreal experience when you actually see people supporting it.But as far as what Americans are waking up to, it's...We are not in normal times. And so therefore the political mechanisms that we normally look to for change or for redress or for continuity are broken. And so whatever it is that Americans are waking up to in terms of realizing how much trouble we're in, and again at every level, I think what is to people that I talk to, and I'm not talking to to a lot of Biden supporters.But I think there is this growing realization that we are in a rather helpless state.There's this sense that there's this election taking shape and these candidates trotting before us, including President Trump, who's having an extraordinary set of appearances, whereby he is received like a Messiah in many of these.I mean, I'm not trying to be blasphemous, but there is something incredible about the outpouring to this figure, this one man.But I think there's also this realization that what happened last time was never fixed, and I refer to 2020, and we still have all of these pitfalls, these handicaps on a free election, to put it mildly.And so it's almost like the whole thing is sort of a reality show that you unwittingly get sucked into, kind of cheering along or participating in, or thinking, gee, maybe we all could vote really again.But then you have this realization that this is all very alternate reality time.And so it's a really strange time in America. It's very dark time, I'm afraid to say.And where it leads, what conditions we'll be looking at next year come election time, I couldn't even possibly tell you. I just don't think it's going to be good.So that's kind of where things are as far as I see them. 
Because on one side, you've got people that believe in the electoral system, which is vast majority of us up until recently.And of course, in the UK, most of Europe, it is a paper ballot system.I know in the US, you've gone full flank into having a system that can be tweaked and changed.And corrupted at the flick of a switch, at the flick of a computer code.But you're right, to my side, very little has changed. And I worry about those who push in the thought that actually the election can change things where the system you're relying on hasn't changed.Am I missing something here?
No, no, and I think it may be something deep in human nature that is just difficult to accept the the terminus of a system of a democratic system the realization that yes, they will they will tell Rasmus and yeah I'm afraid we're going to be a police state or we are a police state. But then we can vote we can vote and and there is this.It may just be a inability to look into an abyss and really see what's happening. So it is a difficult time and people do get sucked in and emotionally it's almost as if they need to. We've gone through so much battering, all of us, going back certainly within the last three years starting with the whole COVID plandemic, the complete fraudulent shutdown of life as we knew it. And given the powers that were on display for that in concert, in absolute synchronicity all around the world that were able to affect the shutdown of our rights, of our businesses, of our lives, of our schools, of our children, all the rest of it, that still hangs over us.And so it's very much connected with what happened in electoral politics, to be sure.So maybe people are starting to understand it, but as with this amazing, shocking, overwhelming immigration crisis, alien invasion crisis, you can come to a realization and yet...It's too late. It's too late. What can you do? The fix or the pushback or the fight is so much more difficult when you've been lulled into or somehow paralyzed into inaction. And you know.Speaking of the Republican Congress, and I'm sure what Allen West was saying, my brother was saying, they've done nothing. They've had wonderful, wonderful hearings. And I've come to call them a chat show. Congress is a chat show. They have great guests. They, you know, come back next week and nothing happens. Representative Matt Gaetz of Florida had a fantastic kind of rant about this with Maria Bartiromo on Fox Business this weekend where he made this case, she was really applauding what had been done by under Kevin McCarthy, the speaker, and Matt Gaetz was making the case, the reality, that nothing has been done.And let's just look at what the Republicans in charge could do.They could impeach, they can defund, they can even bring in the absolutely criminal judges of the D.C. Circuit who have been flouting and abandoning and abusing due process in all of the January 6 cases, which we haven't spoken of yet, but I know you're interested in that, that have come before the bench.They could bring them in and talk to them. They could impeach them.They could impeach the Department of Homeland Security, Secretary Mayorkas, who is overseeing our border invasion.They've done nothing. So it's, again, this feeling of helplessness when all of your institutions have essentially fallen or perhaps imploded from within and you didn't notice it.No, we'll get on the J6. The whole issue with with Gaetz and the Freedom Caucus is intriguing, certainly for me here in the UK. We don't have any Freedom Caucus in the Conservative Party, as we have in the UK. So I love the way you have that element holding the Republican Party to account. Tell us more about, because we've seen the conversations on the debt ceiling, but it goes much wider than that, and Matt Gaetz seems to have held his nerve along with that block and holding McCarthy to account. Tell us more about that.Well, they've been pushing, certainly pushing him and trying to hold him to account, but again, the power of the House is quite profound. You know, when you talk about, is America a police state?Well, a police state cannot function if the three branches of government, which are supposed to be co-equal, our executive, our legislative, and our congressional branch, judiciary, I'm sorry, judicial, executive, and law-making branches are supposed to be all co-equal.And of course, over the past century, we've essentially seen our presidency, the executive branch pretty much turned into a king, a kind of a king. And we've seen the House, or the Congress,House and Senate, we've seen them fall into, again, this chat show, certainly when the Republicans are in control. And so the fact that we are in this terrible place has a lot to do with the failure of Republicans in the House going back at least, I mean, you can, we can go through a history lesson, but I would say at least in the last 10 years, certainly from the Obama years to these years, the House has been empowered at very key points in our history during with the Obamacare period, around when the House and the Republicans came back, won historic victory in 2014 on the heel, something like the Freedom Caucus, but the Tea Party movement.And then kicked us all in the teeth by doing nothing, doing nothing.And then, you know, forward here, we get to the same kind of place where they are.They are putting forward a line and certainly the Freedom Caucus is extremely helpful in honing that line and keeping that sounding much more MAGA or much more, I would frankly say, constitutional and traditional.But again, there is no execution of House powers that do anything to balance or prevent the police state situation we're in from taking hold.And so that is really, it kind of neutralizes really the good that the Freedom Caucus could do because the bulk of the party and the leadership of the party is still holding a line, still backstopping, essentially, the left. And that's just reality. So it is, again, a uniparty with a very loud and noisy Freedom Caucus, which makes us all feel good. But, you know, Gaetz was right. Nothing has been done that could be done, according to their constitutional responsibility. Oath.Actually the curious thing is this the 70% believing that America is a police state, they're not getting that from the mainstream media, talk to us about how they are being informed because that goes against everything that has been pushed out.
Right well I think if all of say, the Trump, Biden, et cetera had happened in 2010, let's say, instead of 2020, I don't think people would think we were in a police state.I think we would have been fooled lock, stock and barrel and people might've thought, hey, we should have had some recounts. But I really think where we were 10, 12, 15 years ago was a very different place. We've been through a lot.We've been through a lot. And certainly the COVID plandemic was a major education for everyone. but what it did, because a lot of people have seen through that, through personal experience. I think what it did was cause a lot of people to say, well, hey, if the government can lie to us about a, quote, virus, which may or may not exist, and lock us down and destroy our world, and lying about it, and still are lying about it, even as we're experiencing a die-off that is going to approach genocidal levels before we're done, I'm afraid, what else they lie about us? And you go back and you start seeing, I'm just talking about my own experience, but I know it's mirrored in other people, you start looking at the 9-11 narrative again, you start looking at the JFK narrative again, and for me, because I study these things too, it does track back to the Pearl Harbor narrative as well. And so you start realizing, you know, Gulf of Tonkin in the Vietnam War narrative, you start realizing the extent to which the United States government, the Central Intelligence Agency. All other institutions connected, including the press, have been on board in terms of creating these crises to control us, to change our system as they fancy it.It has made people at this point, I think, much more awake. Then, of course, this summer, we went through a crisis that was barely covered in the media, which is a common thread for all of these things, terrible media coverage, of course, or propaganda, and so on. The fire that destroyed the city of Lahaina on the island of Maui in Hawaii. People don't believe the government narrative that global warming caused that fire. And people are still wondering where are all the children?Why did a wildfire do this? Why did the government of Lahaina not sound the alarm, not allow water to be used, keep people in the city?All of these shocking measures before you even get to the ignition of the fire itself.But people are smarter now and more savvy.I think that's why you get to that large number in the Rasmussen poll.We've been through a lot. And there's also this sense that I think Donald Trump was such an interrupter of the 2020, what was it, Agenda 21, Agenda 2030, dictatorship, tyranny plan when he came on the scene in 2016, that they really had to go for it in ways that are far cruder and far more visible to us than they would have had Hillary Clinton come in in 2016.We would not be in this terrible crisis in a way. I think things would be much, we would have gone much more smoother and smoothly into oblivion and digital slavery and all the rest of it.But I think that this has been such a, you know, bumptious era and such a, you know, just bomb-popping era because they were not expecting Trump to come along. What did Trump do?Trump in 2016 awakened the dead part of America. Dead. It was gone. The MAGA people, people who'd given up on the system and were downtrodden. Can I tell you a quick anecdote? I have a friend who was a very established and celebrated news photographer, in the swamp at one of the major metropolitan dailies of the country.And he was out with Trump in 2016. He was out again in 2020.And I remember him saying to me that in 2016, he was shooting these rallies that Trump was going to all over, including the Rust Belt and everywhere else around the country, that the people coming out to see him, many, many thousands of people were down and out, looked terrible, poor, sad, sacks.When he went out again in 2020, they were, even after COVID, they were good looking, they were proud, they were outspoken, they were successful looking.He said it was the most amazing change.That's what Trump did. He awakened the American people who had been utterly disenfranchised by the Uniparty in Washington.And that's why they've had to be so extreme and crazy and aggressive in their consolidation of power.And I think the end game is messier and more violent as a result of it.But it's just where we are.I remember being a CPAC in March and being near the front block, I'm watching Trump's speech an hour and a half along with a prior smoldering speech.And I had never seen him in person, never seen him speak.There's nothing like it. That energy, that drive, that passion, that vision.It's not a, I'm a politician and here are my 10 point plan. It's something which actually connects with you within and drives you.And it's something that's basically not on the British scene at all.And that's why I loved being there and just being part of that and watching him.Well, it really was quite a phenomenon and, you know, where we are now is, you know, we're in such a, we're in such a difficult place.But it's heartening on the one side because he was a leader, you know, he is a very much a charismatic megafauna to use the term from natural history, but he was able to do such, a profound thing for America in just giving people a voice. And it turned out that's the American voice. And I do believe that in 2020, he won a historic landslide, the likes of which we'd never seen in American history. And that is what was stolen from us. It's not just him. It's stolen from him, but it is stolen from the people. And that is what this ruling clack, has complete and utter contempt for, and that is why they're so cruel.They're so cruel and dehumanizing, and it's the kind of people that can take you to a transhumanist place.They could hardly be worse in terms of where they rank on a humanity scale.And I think we see that, again, more clearly than we would have had the same kind of mechanism happened 10 years earlier because we are experienced now and we've been through it and we see it.
Which is why the battle for Trump winning in 24 is even more difficult. I want to bring you on to the second question on the Rasmussen poll. Do you agree or disagree with this statement, the FBI is a danger to the freedom and security of law abiding Americans? I think for 36 of Democrats agree, 45% of Independents agree, and 65% of Republicans agree, which is 50%.So in that you have 50% of Americans agreeing that the FBI is a danger.That's quite a change. What has kind of pushed the American people to that realization?One-third of Democrats, two-thirds of Republicans, 50% overall, that the FBI is a threat to them?
Well, I would say it's not a threat, it's the enemy of.And it became the federal police force that actually J. Edgar Hoover, the famous and much maligned, you know, famous 20th century director, feared that it would become and worked very hard to prevent it from becoming a federal police force. Because in this guise, it has become, it has taken on the guise of dictatorship polices, polices, that sounds like a funny, police forces, stormtroopers. And you can, all you have to do to know that I'm not just exaggerating, is look at the footage of the endless assaults on the homes of people who could very easily, be asked to appear at the police station to be arraigned. They have gone into, this started it started during the Trump years.And, you know, he is, President Trump is to blame for appointing Christopher Wray, a complete swamp creature, to be the director of the FBI.But it began during the Trump years with some extremely like military style assaults on the homes of various Trump people who were coming under arrest, whether it was Paul Manafort, Roger Stone.I think it was something like, gosh, it was dozens of SWAT officers in full tactical gear, including helicopters.And in the case of Roger Stone, it was frog men, because he happens to live near a body of water, coming to arrest him, this man who comes to the door in a t-shirt and shorts in the middle of the night.You know, it's absolutely a demonstration of raw, naked aggression against the American people.And this has been started, you know, with one or two cases. and now it is the norm for people in the political opposition movements.And this would certainly include many of the January 6th protesters who have been arrested for the protest on January 6th.These are non-violent, non-criminal, no one with records kind of thing, ordinary citizens being assaulted by the FBI in their homes with their families and their wives, et cetera, to be arrested and you look at that a few times and you think, oh, that's a danger.That's certainly a danger to our rights. And then you also understand the surveillance, the new surveillance.Normal procedures, which once upon a time would have been brought them into court for violation of our Fourth Amendment rights against illegal surveillance, search and seizure.It is now de rigueur to do something called geofencing, which has to do with surveilling a person through their phone and other media devices to see where they're going, what they're doing, their banking, their other habits.This is absolutely normal and again, it goes back about 10 12 years, When we learned from Edward Snowden. We learned it from Edward Snowden that all of our data was being sucked up by the federal government and logged into massive,I don't know what they are massive, uh online clouds all over the country or out West in these giant places, this is completely unconstitutional and director at the time of national intelligence Clapper perjured himself telling Congress that this was not happening. But of course Congress never actually recommended that he be indicted and he was never indicted and prosecuted. Another great moment in congressional history and judicial history, but this is where we are, where our rights have been taken from us and I think people understand that and when you have no rights and you have a SS-style federal police force arresting political opponents of the regime that took power in 2020, you go, yes, ergo sum, police state.Yeah. Tell us about the J6, because we've had Jake Lang on a number of times with Brandon Straka on recently.And of course, we've seen a 22-month imprisonment for the leader of Proud Boys who wasn't even there. And yet the media by and large think this is normal for someone to be jailed for something. They weren't even there whenever the so-called offence happens. What is happening with that conversation? Is it becoming more public, the frustration, or is it just something that's accepted because people have believed the lie that this was an insurrection.Well. I'd like to see some recent Rasmus and polling on that. I think that there is a great understanding, after especially after some of the video footage came out on the Tucker Carlson show, early in the summer or last spring. I can't remember exactly when it was it was spring or summer, And people saw that these great big boogeymen that were depicted to us with all kinds of Hollywood stylings actually were walking quite peacefully through the Capitol.And many people had never even seen that.And that started to really have a change of opinion, I do believe.In terms of, again, the FBI and the police state question, I think it very much figures into the discovery and revelations, which again, are not covered in a widespread fashion, but do seem to be getting out thanks to some intrepid reporters like Joseph Haneman at Epoch Times, Julie Kelly, and some others who are doing wonderful work and the work of the defense attorneys as well, who have revealed that there were federal agents answering to the FBI and other bodies present at the Capitol, leading or exhorting the protesters on to either violence or violent acts or entry into areas they ordinarily would not have gone into.And this has been documented to a point where even the groups such as Proud Boys, you mentioned when Enrique Tarrio getting the 22 year sentence, not being there, he was in a hotel room in Baltimore at the time, The Proud Boys were infiltrated by federal assets.The Oath Keepers, another one of these groups who were there to provide security for speakers and others who had been attacked at these kinds of rallies by Antifa, who's fine, they don't get any sorts of indictments, or Black Lives Matter, same, they too were infiltrated by federal informants. And so this, again, is part of the FBI picture that people are responding to, and the police state notion. We have political, politics has been effectively outlawed in the United States.We are essentially this, they are trying to consolidate a one party state with its, you know, Republican acolytes just for cover and for interesting chat show material.But they are essentially outlawing political opposition to a point where opposition groups are infiltrated and then falsely or entrapped into conspiracies.We saw that with the so-called Fed-napping, kidnapping, federal kidnapping of a plot against Michigan Governor Whitmer, which turned out to be a complete FBI-arranged entrapment.And we're starting to see some restitution in the courts on that.Oh gosh, I had a second one that also... Oh, oh, the, well, I'm sorry, go on, you had a question.
No, no, I just wanted to ask about the whole Ray Epps thing, because you've got seemingly individuals, part of the intelligence service, part of the FBI, who are moving the situation along.And they seem to get a slap on the wrist where people who were not even there get 22 years.It seems absolutely ludicrous. And zero pushback from the media.Well, it does. And this is the problem when you have such a, you know, such a sublant, submissive media or compliant media. But yes, Ray Epps is highly regarded, widely regarded even before January 6 as a federal asset. The night before he was exhorting people to be sure and go into the Capitol. And he was actually kind of razzed by the crowd. It's on video as a Fed, Fed, Fed, Fed.People are pointing to him saying, don't go in the Capitol, he's a Fed.So there was suspicion about him from the start, but of course, yes, he recently was charged with one misdemeanour, very rare.There may not be maybe more than one other of his poor defendants who came up with such a small charge, but given that he was doing what other people who've been slapped with much harsher charges and sentences, It's extremely suspicious.There's also the problem, which is not covered adequately in the media, of the federal government concocting evidence and planting it.And this is something that was established in court by the lawyers for Jeremy Brown, who was a former Special Forces veteran that the FBI tried to recruit as an informant before January 6.He refused. He was there. He's part of the Oathkeeper Group or had a relationship with the Oathkeeper Group. And essentially, nine months later, he was arrested and charged with having had explosives, a grenade, at the Capitol. But long story short, that grenade had no DNA from Jeremy Brown.And had DNA from a woman on it. It was planted in his van. And then there was also with the Proud boys, there was literally a document that was supposed to show they had a plan for insurrection that has been shown to have been essentially pushed into Enrique Tarrio's phone through a very strange chain of custody. Again, this kind of thing is not unusual, and you see the feds, creating this as an event, a la the Reichstag fire of yore in Nazi Germany, where it was a created event, to cause all kinds of political repercussions, and the destruction of political opposition, same thing here. So this must be getting out there because people have such a strong reaction on that police state question.But certainly it's proof, you know, it's evidence and the media hushes it up, but somehow you can find out about it and you, you know, people need to find out about it because it's truly shocking. And that's why this is now known as as the Fed-surrection.
Oh, completely. I mean, they're...Let's end off on another Rasmussen poll that they had put up and there are so many aspects to this.But this was a poll they put up just days ago. 56% of likely voters think the cheating, and I love that word that they're willing to use, will affect the 2024 election according to Rasmussen poll survey. Do you think that's changed since 2020 and if so what's changed since 2020 that will make your outcome different? 56% across the board, this is again across the board, it's not Republican, Democrat, 56% think that cheating affected the election.What does that mean for you for a U.S. citizen going forward looking ahead for, actually it's just a year away, just over a year away, for the next elections. How does that inspire you? How does that influence you? How does that encourage you to, I guess, engage with that political process?Well, it's very discouraging, and again, it gives you the feeling that you're participating in somebody else's reality show, and there's that sense that I won't be manipulated, but it's kind of almost a tribal right. You want to be, you want to participate, and you want to believe that it's an election. I don't believe in the election. I believe in miracles, so I suppose I will hold out the hope for a miracle, but at this point, we are post-election, post-electoral, post-democratic. We are existing under an illegitimate regime and I don't think that that has necessarily become widely understood. People still rail against Democrats or rail against Biden for this or that. This is a junta. You know, this happens in many other countries. It's happened all over the world. It was not supposed to happen here, but it did. And part of the success of this coup, is in the fact that it is censored and suppressed.
100%. Diana, there are lots we could discuss and I appreciate you coming on and sharing, certainly with our main UK audience, with the War Room Posse, who will obviously know this issue well.Just to finish off, I guess as a journalist, as someone who observes what's happening and tries to inform the public. What is your take on a lot of what you've seen? I mean you put out a strong line that America has to return to some of those roots of integrity, of election integrity, of media integrity, but how do you see that looking forward and what kind of is your key message, I guess, that you bring to the American people through your many writings over the following year?Well, now that's the hardest question of all. I think that we are—this is not a joke, you know, where we are.And I think that at this point, it's very important to take care of yourself and your family and be prepared for the storm. Because I don't think this ends well. That's not the normal uplifting message, but I do think people are taking this more seriously. We are at a point where our government is aggressively killing us and destroying our country. So it really is a time for a miracle. It's time for a miracle.
100%. To the viewers, we first had Diana on to discussing her book, which is 10 years old now, actually, American Betrayal, the secret assault on our nation's character, and just somethingaside as we finish that is an intriguing insight into the change of American society through the influence and onslaught of communism from the USSR and how that developed over time. So I'd encourage our viewers and listeners to get hold of that for something maybe fairly different from the conversation we've had, but I think it's essential to understand what has happened historically and then understanding that, being equipped with that information, I think we can better look forward to what we face ahead of us. Diana, thank you so much for joining us. People can find you @RealDianaWest obviously on gab and dianawest.net online. Thank you for sharing your insights on this huge topic which you know I'm certainly watching eagerly although I have no participation in the US election coming up in a year but we certainly look to you across the pond as hope politically, economically, militarily.Journalistically, maybe that's gone out the window, but we still look to you.So thank you so much for coming on today and sharing that. 
Well, thank you, Peter.It's always a pleasure to speak with you.

Gareth Icke - How the EU Shuts Down Dissenting Voices

Show notes and Transcript
Gareth Icke joins us to discuss all things censorship. His Dad, David Icke has been banned from travelling to the EU for the past 2 years because of his "hurtful" comments and has just had his appeal overturned. He is regarded as a threat to community cohesion and free speech and the judge in the Netherlands has, surprise surprise, sided with the government and rejected his appeal against his travel ban. So anyone can have their right to travel in Europe blocked because they stand up for free speech?This is on top of the censorship being introduced through the Online Safety Bill in the UK and similar legislation in the EU. Gareth explains how and why we have been targeted and what we can do to ensue freedom of speech remains across Europe and beyond.
Gareth Icke is an activist, a singer/songwriter, an author, a former international beach soccer player, the presenter of ‘Right Now’, an uncensored current affairs show on the Ickonic Network and is also the son of the legendary truth warrior David Icke.He has been attending protests and rallies since he was a small boy and he's worked tirelessly in the movement for truth and continues to do so through docu-series, films, books, podcasts, rallies, speaking engagements and much more.Gareth's weekly show, 'Right Now', goes out every Friday at 7pm on ickonic.com.It gives guests from all over the world a chance to say their bit, covering a huge range of subjects that the mainstream doesn’t want you to hear about.
Follow and support Gareth at the following links.....WEBSITEShttp://www.ickonic.com/http://garethicke.com/SOCIAL MEDIA, VIDEO AND MUSICGETTR: https://www.gettr.com/user/garethickeTWITTER: http://www.twitter.com/garethickeGAB: https://gab.com/garethickeTELEGRAM: http://t.me/garethickeMINDS: https://www.minds.com/garethicke/YOUTUBE: http://www.youtube.com/garethicke21SPOTIFY: https://open.spotify.com/artist/0NoR3Ss4kvKyZMwv0vAQn3
Interview recorded 26.9.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstin and Twitter https://twitter.com/TheBoschFawstin?s=20 
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Transcript
(Hearts of Oak)
Gareth Icke, it is wonderful to have you back with us again. Thanks so much for joining us today.
(Gareth Icke)
It's a pleasure, mate. It's always nice to chat to you.
Good to have you on. And of course, @GarethIcke on Twitter, @Ickonic, also on Twitter.Do you wanna, in case we have, obviously, many viewers from the Stateside as well, they may not come across Ickonic, do you wanna just give them a one minute precept of what they can find there and how they can find your material?
Yeah, well, Ickonic's a free speech platform, basically born out of censorship.So when Twitter started banning everyone a few years back, YouTube were banning everyone, Vimeo kicked off all the videos and all that sort of stuff.Parler came along as a bit of a free speech platform and then was quickly sidelined by the fact that it was using Amazon servers or whatever.So it became quite obvious to us that actually, Oh mate, no, you're gonna need the whole shebang in-house, because it doesn't matter if 5% of your infrastructure is owned by them and 95% by you.If they can pull that 5%, they can pull the lot down. So Ickonic was built and it came along, basically from November, 2019, and then the world went mental just a couple of months later.So we've kind of been at the coalface a bit from the very beginning, in terms of trying to get information out there and trying to get whistle-blowers testimonies out there and all that sort of stuff.So, and it's quite funny to be honest, Peter, cause I'm looking at things now that are widely accepted.And it's like, mate.People like me and people like you were talking about that three years ago and, being sent tinfoil hat memes. But there you go, but we keep plodding along don't we?I thought this was funny the other day because I don't know what your feelings are on this actually Pete because I've not spoke to you about it, but the Lucy Letby case is a bit, there's more to know there isn't there? This convicted child serial killer here in England, there's certainly more to know about that case. And I saw, oh goodness me, what's his name, writes for The Daily Mail, was very good during covid at the start and then went a bit quiet, Im trying to remember his name now, his Twitter handle is ClarkeMicah, oh man, whats his name. My brains gone. It will come to me in a minute, he wrote an article anyway in The Mail this week, 'Why is no-one talking about the Lucy Letby case?, I wish someone else would talk about itIt's like, yeah, we have been.
Yeah. Oh, I know. I know. 
Hitchens, Peter Hitchens. That was it. 
Peter Hitchens.Um, no, but a lot of these issues, you end up shouting the TV saying, we were saying that two years ago, three years ago, why did you not, and suddenly it's accepted.And I know, I know. 
Yeah, exactly. Vaccines being a huge one of them, you know, that, that kind of stuff is funny that you have, well, not funny, actually, it's, it's absolutely disgusting, but you have people like Sarah Kayat, who came on national TV and said that these are 100% safe and effective. They do this, they do that.People would have gone and got shot as a result of that and are now paying the price.And even though she was proven incorrect, she's still on telly now.And people like you and me get censored and deleted off stuff and whatever, and it's like...It's funny because we're literally not telling anyone to do anything.We just say, you've got to ask questions, that's it.
When you've got a blood clot or heart attack it's a bit too late to question what you've done so, but yeah.So much and actually wanted to chat to you today about restrictions on travel with those who have a dissenting voice or different view. And of course this, your father was banned from traveling to the Netherlands back in November last year, I think it was, for a freedom demo. And we'll get on to that specific, but I think probably back a couple of years ago, pre-COVID, I would have thought it's important for a government to be able to ban bad people coming in. You don't want people to disrupt the country. We need that mechanism in place. Now my opinion's gone the other way because I think at that point I trusted, institutions or governments to an extent now that's completely gone out the window.Well I think the thing is as well with you know these people that are apparently in positions of power that they're not really in positions of power at all which is why they need to try and silence people because I always think that comes from a position of weakness. It's likeI'll only fight you in the ring if you have your hands tied behind your back.You wouldn't be doing that if you were confident, that's ridiculous. So when you've got things like the online safety bill going through at the moment, they're controlling the narrative in terms of tech companies and they're controlling the narrative in terms of what people can say online.You can, you know, non-person people which is what they obviously tried to do with Alex Jones. But what you can't do then is stop someone taking to the street with a bullhorn and just putting their view out there so all of a sudden you're stopping people from traveling as well. The thing with my dad, it was insane, he was asked to speak at an anti-war rally.Right, so he was literally just going to fly into Amsterdam, speak at an anti-war rally, fly home, probably the next day, done. But they caused such a hoo-ha about it that they actually not only banned him from Holland for two years, they banned him from 26 other European nations, which are part of something called the Schengen List. And what people don't realise is, obviously, my dad was already banned from Australia, but countries like Canada and countries like America, the USA, they take the Schengen list as red. So you might well be banned from 26 European countries, but you try and go in America, you're banned from there as well, Sunshine.So he's essentially banned from, you know, and New Zealand is another nation that does the same, takes the same thing. So you're essentially banned from a large percentage of the world.Well, certainly the parts of the world that speak English that you can converse with you know, easily, for wanting to attend an anti-war rally. And what's crazy, is that they basically, you know, they made up all these allegations, all of which were completely false. They ruled on those allegations and he was banned. So then some solicitors, some lawyers in Holland took umbrage with it and so they actually worked for free, they weren't even hired. They were like, no, we're not having this. So they appealed on behalf of my dad.And so we were all watching it as the Dutch government had to basically make their case to the judge. And so they were, you know, saying all this stuff. And it was funny because the, Dutch lawyers on my dads side were literally just, they were throwing tennis balls and they were just smacking everyone out of the park. And it was actually quite, it was almost painful to watch, Peter, I actually almost felt bad for the government, right, because their spokesman that was there was so confused and lost, he didn't really know what was going on. And so all these accusations were all knocked out the park, rubbish, this is rubbish, here's the evidence, why it's rubbish, blah blah. So in the end it ended up with one thing, which was my dad had said that people, and this was in a documentary Renegade that was like made years and years ago, where he was saying that we the many, we the population, we the world population need to put down our fault lines of race and colour and sexuality and income bracket and all this bollocks and we need to stand as one against those that are basically trying to rule all of us by dividing us and then ruling us. We need to stand up, we need to come together. That was apparently a rallying cry against government which is therefore terrorism.
Wow. 
So I'm laughing, honestly, I'm watching it and I'm laughing. We've got Chrissy, my dad's partner, she's Dutch, so she's translating it and I'm laughing because I'm going, oh mate, they are in big trouble here, this is hilarious. And then the judge goes, yeah, yeah, sounds about right, yeah, bang. So upholds it, right? And so there was the other appeal which took place, about a week ago, where again, they had to rule and they were supposed to give their verdict.They then made my dad wait 10 weeks. So, you know, he can't travel anywhere for 10 weeks.And then they came in with a verdict saying with the judge who doesn't even lift her head up because she's so bloody shamed. The, yeah, if the government says you're a danger, then yeah, you're a danger. So yeah, you're banned still. 
So that's what's come out now that they, they agree.And because he was banned because I read different things, it's always fun to read what the BBC, what the mainstream media are saying, and then you understand where they're coming from, that he was a risk to public order. I think he said, the BBC said he would cause tensions between different groups and disrupt public order. And that's a, you're right, that's a red flag to any, if any government sees this individual is a risk to public order.You don't want them in your country. So it would make sense for every other country to follow that judgment, that statement. 
Well, that's the thing. But what was, what was funny about that is I got an email, it actually came to me. So they notified him that he was banned from 26 European countries by emailing his son. Right. I got the email. It's extraordinary. So it's in Dutch. So obviously I don't speak Dutch. So I sent it across to Christiana. I was like, what does this say? So then she came back saying, this is insane. They're using anti-terror legislation to ban him. So I was like, oh my goodness me, that's extraordinary. So I then went public with that. I was like, I've just got an email from the Dutch saying that they're banning him from 26 nations based on anti-terrorism legislation and a danger to public order and a danger to society. I then just got jumped on by loads of your Matthew Sweet, that BBC knobhead, people like that all jumping on me going, oh the Dutch, did they all email you together? It's like.You know what I meant, dickhead. You know what I meant. And then a Dutch newspaper got in touch with me basically, you know, trying to fact check it saying that no, they didn't say he was a terrorist. I didn't say they said he was a terrorist. I said it was anti-terror legislation, which is what they were using to ban him. I've literally got the email, mate. And he wouldn't let go, this guy. And in the end he did, you know, because obviously he realized, because then they actually started during the appeal using the word terrorism. So at that point, I think he had he had to crawl back under his little rock. But for a while he was on my case, this this Dutch journalist guy. And when I say on my case, I mean, like replying to my tweets underneath saying that's not true. It's like, read the email now, mate. And so, you know, they all kind of, sort of, went for me a little bit about announcing it, which was hilarious to me, because it's like, hang on a minute, so I've just told you that a man who's never been, accused of a crime, has never been investigated for a crime, has never been tried for a crime, certainly never therefore convicted for a crime, is banned from 26 countries because he wanted to attend an anti-war rally, and your issue with it is the fact that I use the term the Dutch, not the fact that this is happening, this is a man in his 70s, do you know what I mean? Like, what the hell are you on about? And it kind of puts things into perspective as well. When I saw, you know, this whole outcry with the whole Russell Brand thing. Now, I found that weird, if I'm honest, Peter, because none of us know if he's guilty or not. I don't know what he's like.I don't know him. I don't know what he's like around women. I know he's a bit of a sleazeball.That doesn't mean, of course, he's a rapist, but yeah, he's a bit of a sleazeball. Can I believe?Yeah, of course I could. But can I believe someone's setting him up? Yeah, I can believe that as well. I don't have the answers. Therefore, my opinion is, I don't know. Let's see what happens. Whereas lots of people within the alternative or so called alternative, if you can call GB news alternative, all jumped on this whole he must be innocent thing. And I, remember reading it thinking, What are you doing? You haven't got a clue if he's innocent or not. This is extraordinary. Like, wow, man, this is madness. Yeah, none of them said anything when my dad got banned from 26 countries didn't say a word.So it's like, you know, this guy who's a multi multi millionaire is demonetized by YouTube. Yeah, that's wrong. But you're kicking off about that, but you're not bothered about a man who's banned from 26 countries.It's quite odd to me, actually, how people can pick and choose who they wish to defend and who they don't wish to defend in terms of freedom.It's, you know, freedom for everyone or freedom for no one, surely. 
No, it is.And I'm exactly the same line as you on the Brand issue, on the sidelines.And I'm amazed how commentators and journalists suddenly become experts at whatever topic is thrown at them without looking at it.They just overnight, they suddenly know all about the case. That is impossible and frustrating.
It's very strange. And it's on both sides as well, mate. Like, you know, that's what I said in my monologue last week and I've got a little bit of ear 'ole grief for that.But it was that the fact that you can decide, we're now at a point as a society, we can decide whether someone is guilty or not of sexual assault based on what their politics are and whether we agree with them or not.That's mental. So people will look at Russell Brand and go, oh, he's a conspiracy theorist.Yeah, he's definitely a wrongun and guilty.And then the other side will go, no, no, no, no. He was anti-jab. He can't be guilty.What do you mean? It's just madness. The only people that know whether he's guilty or not is him and the people that are accusing him.So the idea of jumping, you know, I mean, innocent until proven guilty, of course, you know, having the government write to people like Rumble to try and get him taken off and demonetized, that's extraordinary.And I'm bang against that. I mean, I'm not a big fan of Brand, but that doesn't matter.Bang against that, that's outrageous. But the idea that people, like you say, can comment and say that he's innocent.You haven't got a clue, mate.None of us do. 
Well, that is obviously, I guess at some point or other will go through the courts. So we'll touch on the social media side a bit more. On the travel side, I was intrigued because obviously there is pressure from left-wing governments and individuals to restrict the movement of other people. We've seen that over the last three years and this was a two-year travel ban. And it says actually the Amsterdam's Mayor, Police and Prosecutors Office asked originally the demonstration organizers to uninvite Mr. Icke for his hurtful statements. I didn't know a hurtful. Something you say may hurt someone's feelings. So it's basically if someone's feelings are hurt then that must ban you from world travel. Wow.
You can't say anything now without hurting someone's feelings though. Do you know what I mean?If you say that a woman can't have a cock, that's offending someone. It's just madness. And also, who cares if people are offended? Like, honestly, who cares? It's just words, man.Like, I see things all the time that I think of a bang out of order and disgusting. I think having men shake their naked arses in front of kids in the street pretty frickin disgusting. But, do you know what I mean. I don't see these people getting banned from nations. It's extraordinary.It really is very, we're in a real, we're in a real weird place. But I also think that we're in a weird place because there is a fear there within the establishment that people are waking up massively on a much, much bigger scale.And I think they were starting to wake up. I think we've discussed this before, people were waking up even before the Rona.The Rona just absolutely accelerated it because people started to smell a rat and also people sat at home and had more time to look at stuff that they'd never looked at before.And it would start to resonate with them, hang on, I might be on to something.And so it feels very much like they're just trying to get the stable door shut.And part of that will be to do with shutting up the other side.You know, shut them up online, don't talk to them on the mainstream media, only ever have your voices on the mainstream media, ban them from countries so they can't travel and speak to people in person.You know, I mean, they've been doing that to my dad long before they banned him from traveling.You know, the fact that he's touring around the UK at the minute, and it's called the secret tour where the loca... I don't even know the locations, Peter. I don't even know where they are. It's that hush-hush that I don't even know where the venues are. So people will message me like a couple of days before Oh, you couldn't give us a heads up, could you?And even if it's people I know, Peter, and I've known for years and I trust them, I'm like, mate, I don't even know. I don't even know. That's how cloak and dagger it has to be because, if these anti-hate organisations find out where they are, they will harass and threaten the venues. That's what they do. They contact the venues, they say, he's this, he's that, don't put him on. And if the people then have the courage to go either, well, that's not true. I've read his books, or, well, I believe in free speech, then they threaten the staff.And that's what they do.We can't, they use very, very clever terminology. They say, well, we can't guarantee the safety of your staff then based on X, Y, and Z.And they just plants that seed. So, a venue organizer will be, Oh, geez, I mean, I've got to protect my staff.Sorry.Sorry, boys. I've got to pull it, you know. 
It's true.It is that commercial pressure and no one wants their building smashed up, but also is this, the whole question I think regarding, one regarding the social media side, but also regarding the courts, which we've seen is, who's the arbitrator of truth, or what is permitted speech, and we have all these words thrown around, misinformation and disinformation, and then we have the fact checking, so the government tell us what is accepted and what is not. This is brand new this level of government alliance of what is permitted and what is not and if you fall in one category and then there is there is punishment and I guess this is the government obviously with the online safety bill trying to catch up with the scope and range and reach that the internet provides. 
Yeah and the thing is as well is it's you know it's it's cleverly designed currently to be cheered on by one side. So people who identify as left leaning at the minute will be cheering on the online safety bill because it's sold to protect them from far right extremists and protect their kids from grooming and all this kind of stuff when it's obviously doing nothing of the sort. But what these people don't realise is that these left leaning people that are now cheering it on with the same left leaning people that were being marginalised and shut up because they were calling out the invasion of Iraq not that long ago. And so narrative switch and they shift and governments are very, very contradictory. And so these people that are cheering it on now it will come and bite them in the arse in two years, three years, four years. And you know, it's the same thing you have all the time. It's that first they came for. So I mean, the people are so short sighted, it's extraordinary. Everyone should be defending free speech. I can't stand a lot of nonsense that comes out of people. But they should be able to say it.Because I shouldn't expect free speech if they can't have it, it's not how it exists. Everyone should be able to speak freely and their ideas out in the open and debated. This is the thing that people don't seem to realize as well, by shutting people up and silencing people and marginalizing people, you don't stop them thinking a certain way, you just drive them underground.And so actually, what you'll end up doing is creating extremists.And that's not hard to do that if you start making people feel like they don't have a voice.It's that whole, what is it, riots are the language of the unheard or whatever.And that can go to even bigger extremes than that.I feel like it's a really important time at the moment.It's a really important time. And, you know, it's interesting, you mentioned about these, these anti hate groups and these fact checkers, because they are up to their neck in it.They're political organizations. You know, I just saw the other day, you've got the Centre for countering digital hate, which is an organization that's pushed massively for the online safety bill, Damien Collins, who is a big cheerleader, he's a he's a member of that organization. And the front man of that organization, Imran Ahmed, no one knows anything really about him. I mean, he's a former investment banker.He was a spin doctor for Angela Eagle when she was standing against Corbyn.But what they don't realize is, oh no, no, no, no, no, no. They're an independent organization. Okay.Why then on Companies House is Imran Ahmed still a director of Labour Campaigns Limited?So you've got a guy that's the director of an organization on one side of the political sphere in the UK, while his other organization that's independent, is shutting down debate and shutting down people that are saying anything against the narrative.I mean, it's extraordinary that it's there in black and white for people to see, yetThe BBC, Sky News, whoever, even CNN and MSNBC have rolled out Imran Ahmed on the regular, to give his opinion on hate, the state of hate. I've got my name in that this year, state of hate. It's a badge of honour. 
We were in it one year and then a second year and it was a bigger piece. And I really wanted to write to hope not hate and say, uh, really excited that we're growing in presence. Please let us know what we could do better next year to have a larger spread, because I would like a double page spread. What do I need to do to do that? And just mock them. 
Well, that's the thing. I mean, it's also, you know, they're always what they accuse you of. So you look at these silencing organisations, these narrative managing organisations, they're full of hate, like they're absolutely full of hate. The way that they talk about people and the things they say about people and the emotions that they evoke in other people against these people.Is just hatred and then you actually look at the people they're saying are hate figures and most of them are just freedom fighters that have not got a hateful bone in their body. You know, it really is extraordinary. It really is extraordinary. We are in an inverted world.
I think we've lost, you talk about the media and we've lost that investigative journalism that you would have thought decades ago where hard work would have been done as a scoop and even if it went against the norm or against a newspaper's editorial that there was an ability to put that out. That seems to have gone and certainly in the last three years I guess it will continue where the media becomes a mouthpiece of the government whether it's COVID, whether it's online safety bill, whatever the next thing is.They will simply do what they are told and that's a level, certainly we haven't witnessed in our lifetime. 
No, there's still some about trying to do good stuff, but like you say, they get bizarrely marginalised and maligned and attacked for going against the tribe. One of them, I think, Max Blumenthal was one of them, who was a darling of the left when he was calling out Israel, as he continues to do. Yet when COVID hit and everyone started wetting their sheets and he started calling out draconian measures and restrictions and mask mandates and jab mandates. Well, Max has lost his mind. No, he hasn't. No, he hasn't. He's exactly the same man as he was before, which was trying to call out wrongdoing. And now, obviously, he runs the grey zone. The the the left is now Slava Ukraine.So they they just they think he's really gone off the deep end just because he's now calling out NATO, but you were calling out NATO.It's just the narrative shifted within your tribe and you didn't leave your tribe because that's what I belong as. That's my social media. I'll have to update my bio if I leave the tribe.It's hard work that. So they have to stay within the confines of that tribe. And it's the same on the right. Don't get me wrong. People have mental gymnastics to explain away things.I mean, the Trumpsters are kings of that. When he pushed the jab.What? When he didn't pardon Julian Assange? What? What's that? I'm sorry, I've got to go.Do you know what I mean? Like people, they don't want to... No, no, no, he just did that because...Deep state and that. Like people have these mental gymnastics too because they don't want to admit that actually, okay, you know, your tribe is faltering as well, you know. That's why I'm not part of a tribe, Peter. 
No, I think people see Messiah figures everywhere and that's the danger whenever you lift people up to that level and don't see them as leaders but as flawed individuals who can screw up at any moment. It's a very dangerous position to be in and you see that on both sides, your right, left and right.
Well that's one concern I had with the whole Russell Brand thing, you know, there was two sides to it which was he's definitely guilty because he's a wrong un and then he's anti-vax and he's definitely innocent because he's on our side. Those are the two seem to be the suit polar extremes. And then I'm thinking in the middle of it, I'm thinking, well, I don't really trust this guy. I've never really trusted Russell Brand. He's invented himself more times than Cher.He just kind of tries to find a little, you know, little gap in the market. Or, you know, what can I what can I how can I exploit that free or, you know, the alternative freedom movements growing, that's quite popular, their money's as worth as much as anyone else's, right? I'll get myself in there. You know, I can remember the times when he was being chucked in the fountain at Trafalgar Square, people seem to forget that he, was trying to sort of, you know, co-op that sort of stuff as well. And people saw through him then.And so I'm looking at it and I'm going, do you know what? if you wanted to infiltrate a movement.What better way than being attacked and taken down by the establishment?It gives you some credibility. If you're going undercover into an organization, the police will give you a kicking, the police will arrest you, even if you're an undercover copper, because it gives you then more validity to the group that you're infiltrating. So there's a little part of that. And then I'm looking at it, I'm thinking the freedom movement, whatever you want to call it, it doesn't need leaders.I've never believed it. The truth is just the truth. And the more people that speak it, the more the world will improve, I think and the more people will be held accountable, but it doesn't need leaders It doesn't need that Messiah complex. Like you say everyone along you get make a statue of him doesn't need any of that nonsense, Yet, we've been given leaders. We didn't ask for him I don't know if you asked for Andrew Tate to be a spokesman for our movement. I certainly didn't, I mean, I didn't ask for Andrew Tate. I didn't ask for for Russell Brand to be you know, the spokesman for our organization, our movement and our freedom and our awakening yet we were given them and now we're watching them systematically getting taken down and in some ways taking some of us, not me and you because we've kept our powder dry on it because we don't know the answer, but it will take down a lot of people. Russell Brands, you know, if he is investigated and he is found guilty and he has been up to no good, How are some of these social commentators and some of these TV presenters? I mean this game over mate. No, my I mean my on both, on both Tate and Brand my huge issue is when individuals are as narcissistic as that, whenever it is purely, and we've both met all great people over the last three years in all of this.And to meet people who are high profile, but also humble, and it's not about them, but it's about the issue. You really warm to that, but then you look at the Brands and Tates of this world, I think that level of narcissism just really turns me off.
Yeah, it's, you know, for me, I'm always looking forward. So it's like, how can we make this world a better place?And, you know, I look at, like you've said, some people we've met during this time, people like Dr. Cartland, people that have lost everything and spoken out the whole time is incredible.And, you know, if my, like my daughter was poorly the other day and I was flying solo, so I just get proper paranoid.She was all like, she'd got a real temperature and I was just like,  so I just messaged Dr. Cartland, I sent him a video of her while she was sleeping, with her breathing and stuff like that. He's messaging me back, he's checking up the next morning, how is she, you know. So I mean, it's just like, these are genuine people.And then, and then the ones that are promoted, like you say, yeah, like, oh, here I am with my, you know, Bugatti. I don't give a shit, mate. Give a shit. What are you on about? It's just, that's not what this is about. You know, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's extraordinary. And, you know, both of them are quite guilty of having this whole sort of word salad nonsense as well, where they would just chat away word salad that had a few long words in it so it makes them sound intelligent. But actually half the time they're not saying anything and half the time they're only saying things that people that get banned from 26 countries were saying years and years years and years ago.There's nothing new there, you know, it's and what makes me laugh a little bit, I have to say, is that, you know, Brand will be put on the mainstream media brand will be, will be pushed and, you know, how many million on this network and how many million on this social platform.Because he's a socially approved freedom fighter, but then they won't touch my dad, because it's too dangerous. You can't touch an Icke, it'll backfire on you if you touch an Icke.And it's like, or that's not how it ended up there, is it? That's not how it ended up.Do you know what I mean? So it's like, people will speak out on behalf of Brand because it's the safe thing to do. I'm not sure it is really. I'm not sure it is at all.
No, when someone gets a free pass on social media, you always wonder. I wonder looking at YouTube, but those who don't have strikes, who can say what they like, and I'm thinking, I'm sure they said exactly what I was saying, and yet I got hit. And that protected status makes you wonder where they've come from and why they're there.
Well, exactly. Yeah. I mean, you know, there's uproar, like you say that he's been demonetized from by YouTube and you think, but you know, if my dad even has a video that someone interviews him and they put on YouTube, they delete it straight away. To the point where when people want to get my dad on YouTube, anonymous have done it a couple of times where they've featured him, they will they will edit his voice, they make it sound really deep, and they doctor the voice so it gets past the algorithm. So on one hand, you've got someone who's got algorithms of their voice set up so that they can't even say a bloody word on YouTube. And then on the other hand, you've got someone that you've just demonetized. And it's kind of, you know, I don't agree with either of those things, but the fact that some are very happy to put their careers on the line to stick up for one, but don't say a word on the other, I find quite odd.Oh yeah, 100%. Can I go back and look at the legal side, which we started on, and that's, used in regards to the freedom of social media and battles happening between what people can and cannot say and what restrictions there are. But how have you seen, we've seen the battles on COVID restrictions, on fines and lockdowns, and those have, I don't see them as been massively successful through the courts. You've obviously watched over the last year with your father going through the court system there. How have you seen that? Because again, the court, you have to have a way of pushing back against that level of government tyranny. Have the courts worked in that regard as you've seen or not at all? 
Not really, not from what I've seen. I've seen the odd victory here and there on an individual level maybe in terms of a job reinstatement or, suing an employer for wrongful dismissal or something like that but on the largest scale, you know, these people own the courts.Like I said, the ruling on my dad, the judge doesn't even look up.If you took her out to a wine bar and you went out the back to a private room and just said, look, no one can hear what you're saying in here, she would almost certainly be like, yeah, I think it's nonsense, outrageous.Yeah, but that's not what you ruled.That's not what you ruled, and that's not what the one ruled before when they were trying to say that he was a terrorist and all this sort of stuff.If you get these people on their own, then they would probably go, yeah, I don't agree with it, but it's more than my job's worth.And that's what a lot of these people are like. They just don't realize that actually this is coming for them in the end.It's coming for their kids and their grandkids as well.And it's so massively short-sighted, which is why I find people like Dr Cartland so great because they are, they are willing to sacrifice themselves for the cause, whereas others aren't.And unfortunately, these are people in positions that actually could make a difference.If you could have a judge that could rule and have a real landmark ruling for freedom, then that could send ripples, but no one seems to have the courage to do it.
Were you given any access? I think part of my concern also is that decisions are made behind closed doors or access is not given to the rulings, to the conversations, how they came up with that. You've got like a final, this is it. You're not allowed to say that. You're not allowed to travel here.You're not allowed to be on that platform. And you don't actually know, if you don't know how the person has got there, there is no way to reason or push back. How was it in this case, in the Netherlands? 
Oh, exactly the same, mate. Basically, my dad was in the office.He was like, right, I've got to go in now and I'll get the ruling. He knew what the ruling would be.Everyone sat in the office, knew what the ruling would be. It's obvious, you know. Um, so he literally just went in there, sat in the office, got told by the judge what the ruling was, and then within 10 minutes walked out of the office again. There's no involvement in any way of where that decision making has come from. You know, you've, it's stupid really, because you've had to wait 10 weeks for someone to tell you what you already knew they were going to say.They could have just sent you a WhatsApp voice note saying, yeah, you're not coming in son.Save my time. 
Or drop you an email. 
Yeah. Yeah. From the Dutch. But that's the thing, isn't it?We knew what the answer would be. There's no involvement on that decision-making process, but there never is. You think about COVID, Johnson would just come out and stand at that podium at 5 PM and tell you what the situation was going to be. There was never any, input. There was never a referendum on any restriction. No one got a say in anything.We're just listening to the experts, those ones with hundreds of thousands of shares in pharmaceutical companies, those experts, I saw this, actually, this is GB news, right? Because I know what we're saying earlier about GB news being alternative, right? So GB news put an article out about how an expert was saying that this, that this COVID strain was going to do x, y, and z. And this was going to be worse than whatever, and millions more would die. I don't know who the other millions are before, but apparently millions more are gonna die. And it says it in the headline, expert. So I'm like, right, okay, well, I'm gonna look who the expert is. So I had a look at the expert, expert was, it's a financial consultant that was part of procuring the first round of vaccines.
Wow.
So it's a businesswoman. But it said COVID expert. I don't even know what that means.I mean, surely me and you are COVID experts after three years of this nonsense, but it's just funny, isn't it? Because people don't read the small print.They don't. People just see headlines and they know that.They know that's why they do it.So you put that in the headline. The amount of times you see a headline, you go, oh my God, you read the story, which most people don't and you go, well, that's not what they said at all.That's not, that's not even what the story is, but people read headlines. That's what they do.
And there was a on, on GB news. One thing was stuck with me when the Brand situation came out and he had talked about online safety bill as a reason why he was being restricted and banned and GB news said, well, he is, you said the online safety bill was become law, which is not true.No, it more or less. I mean, what, what is King Charles not going to stamp it?It's passed. It is what going to become, but they were putting that doubt in people's mind.And again, I thought, no, that is, that, that is misinformation.That is saying something which isn't true just to discredit someone.And I thought journalists are supposed to delve a little bit deeper, but no. 
No, they don't.They don't. And the thing is with, I always think with alternative organisation or so-called alternative, The litmus test really, on a personal level, is whether they'll touch a member of our family or not.Cause it's, it's the most offensive four letter word in the world at the moment, our surname. Right. So I got asked to go on to, I think you were there when I got asked, I think it might've been when we were in Gibraltar, I got asked to go onto GB news and I laughed and I laughed. I went right. Yeah. Okay. I'll talk to anyone, me. So I was like, right. Okay. Let's, I'm gonna tell you what's gonna happen, right?What they're gonna do is they're gonna start advertising it. And then I'll get a message saying, I'm sorry. We double booked you. That's what I think is going to happen. So, it was Jen that I was talking to, she was like, well, maybe, but we'll go for it anyway. I was like, all right, fine. So I was out walking with my mate, we walked from Chesterfield to Sheffield, which anyone that knows England, that's quite a stomp, right?About 20 miles. 
On one of your crazy walks. 
On one of my crazy walks. Yeah. So so me and my mate are stomping along. Now I'm supposed to be in London the next morning to go and do this GB news thing. I knew it wasn't happening. So I've got a hotel in Sheffield for the night before, right? Worst case scenario, if I'd have got up in the morning, and it was still on, I would have just hopped on on the train straight down, bosh and I'd have done it, it'd have been fine.But I wasn't gonna put myself out. I wasn't gonna get a hotel there the night before or anything like that, because I knew, whatever.So then I got a message saying, oh, can you plug it? Because they're gonna plug the interview now.I went, all right, mate, yeah, no worries. So I put it on my social media, right?I sat down, this was at Rother Valley Country Park, it's about 50%, about 50% of the walk through.There's a nice country pub there.Do a good pizza and a pint, right? So me and my mate sat there.The time it took me to tuck into a pizza, which anyone that knows me, ain't long, right?Bosh, I already had a message, right? Oh, there isn't a show this week actually, there's made a mistake.I went, all right, so I was gonna go for the double book, but okay, isn't the show this week?That's slightly left field, but either way I've been cancelled, right?About 10 minutes after it's been announced.And then weirdly enough on the next day, there was a show, there was a show, weirdly enough, just didn't have me on it, right?And I just thought then, do you know what I mean? I'm not, I don't say anything offensive.I'm not going to come on telly and effing Jeff and, And, you know.Anything else, you know, but what's happened is you've announced that it's on and you've got a phone call pretty quickly.Because of the surname, you're not having it, you know.Yet you have these other people that are apparently going to change the world, they can get their faces on every TV screen and they can get a microphone in front of their face whenever they want.
 No, but actually the flip side of that is, that's why we do generally pre-records. We do the Saturday evening live and it's with guests.We kind of have on semi-regularly, but other guests, because you put out that you're doing a live and then they phone up and say, oh, I've had all these complaints or I'm being attacked or I'm really sorry.I can't do it. And generally, if that happens, the guest you're going to have on is surprised at the vitriol they've got from some hope not hate somewhere. And they don't want to get the shit. I get that.I don't want to give them that either, but that's why it's often, you're probably the same doing pre records. Cause then it's in the bag and it will go out.
Well, we, yeah. I mean, early in doing the show here, I would do, you know, a little video a couple of days before, you know, on the show this week, we've got Joe blogs, we've got X, Y, Z, X.Y, you know, any questions you want to ask them, you know, whatever, that kind of thing to get a bit of sort of audience participation.And then that happened to us a lot, the same thing.These people are just get attacked and whatever, and then you'd soon have a cancellation email.So we're the same mate.We interview people, we do the show, it's all done. And then we'll do a promo and put that out publicly once it's all in the bag.Cause yeah, you're right. You know, we've had people before involved in politics, people that are involved with the NHS.That have cancelled on us because they've got ear 'ole grief, you know, which is extraordinary, really.I think it would happen less so now, but in the early days of the Rona, when everyone was petrified to say boo to a goose, that it happened all the time, mate, all the time.There were, you know, it was funny, because once where I ended up interviewing Rich Willett, right, who's a mate, but he was actually doing, you know, he was releasing a documentary.So it was a decent enough interview to talk about a documentary, about the freedom of speech and about the war of the words and how the media was, you know, controlling the narrative.So it was, it was a cool interview. And I always like to talk to Rich anyway, but I got like some grief online. I will be, people are subscribing to see you talk to your mate.And I'm thinking, well, one, it's an interesting interview, but two, there was about three other guests that all bottled it.And so in the end, you're sat here and you go, right, so.We either don't have a show or we do something different, which is what we did.People, particularly in the early days, wouldn't have a clue of the amount of times I was sat at the desk behind me with my head in my hands because we lost another guest for that reason.
I'm surprised how much people want an easy life. I still am because I thought I was compliant to an extent and then I've realized I don't really give a shit and enjoy that fight, enjoy that pushback. If someone says you can't do this, I'll say I'm going to do it.I'm surprised that most other people are really, they just, they just fit in and that spark, that fight, maybe it's just been battered out of them over the years.
A little bit. I mean, I guess, yeah, a little bit, it's been battered out of people where people are just kind of, you know, weary of the battle really and done with it. But on, the other hand, I think it can go the other way. Like, so for me, I took loads of shite as a kid, which wasn't very pleasant in the media and all that kind of stuff. And some people could then, you know, call themselves, you know, where is the result of all that nonsense and want to quite always want to be no, I just want to be me. I want to be no, I just want to be known as me rather than someone else's son. Do you know what I mean?And I get that. I've felt like that, you know, can I just be myself, please? And, you know, even now I still get stuff going on, you know, your, your dad's is like one guy commentated, you know, he was on one of the what's up podcast clips. I mean, rich, just having a laugh. It's a joke. It's a comedy podcast. And we put this, this clip out and this guy replied saying, you know, your dad was a genius.He's doing this and that. And you're just acting like an effing idiot.And it's like, yeah, it's almost like I'm not him, isn't it?So it's almost like I'm not him. 
You're a person. 
Yeah. Imagine that.But I, but I look at that now, that time as a kid and how brutal that was.And I think that was, that was my basic training.So actually the idea of what people think the idea and the fact that I spent time in a wheelchair as a kid as well, obviously getting all the grief that you'd get for that, that kind of knocked out of you as well. It knocked out that, giving a monkeys what people think.Do you know what I mean? People say, I've got a problem with you, and you go, okay, I haven't. Good luck.You're the one with the problem then. You've just said you've got a problem with me.Yes, that's right. You've got a problem. I'll see you later.
Yeah, leave it with them.Can I just, final thought, can I just ask you about the legal side? Where does it go?The difficulty I guess we all have is which legal avenues will do something which is against what the government are telling them to do.So that must restrict, because people say, you know, if you have a legal battle and you fail, then you can go to the next level, the next level. Kind of, what are your thoughts when something happens like your dad on that restriction?Do you just have to then accept it or what?That's a good question. The minute I don't know, I mean, you can just appeal again and again and again, but you, smacking the mic over, but you know what's coming back.It's just another judge with the same, not making eye contact thing, you know, I mean, sure, you know, you could go, people go, you need to go to the court of human rights, you can go to this and go to that. And you look at them thinking, really, you don't think they're owned? Like, no, there's no independent body within any of these organizations. So, you know, because the, these cult so called elites are so weak, really, and so paranoid that they have to own all 22 players and the referee just to make sure they can win the game because they know they can't win it otherwise. I think the trick in the end will be basically stepping away from the game, stepping out of the stadium and actually having no part of it, which is how I am politically.You know, people say, oh, you don't vote. You've got no right to say anything. Yeah, I have.I have. I've got a choice between AIDS and cancer. Why would I do that? And so there are more and more people that can say no to it and just step away from all of these organisations. Oh, you've got to do that, that's how it's done.Is it? Does it have to be? Does it have to be how it's done?And if there's enough people, again, this is the thing, Peter, that comes down to it's numbers game all the time, isn't it?You know, March, 2020, you're locking down. No, you're not.No, you're not. If enough people said that, it was over before it even started.But unfortunately people let the wolf in the front door and then they cry when the wolf's going through their mom's wardrobe. Well, of course they are. You let them in the door, what did you expect was gonna happen?And that's the thing, isn't it? It's a case of drawing a line and say, no, not doing it.You know, and if you're going to bring in gender theory and critical race theory and all this bullshit in the school, you fill your boots, mate, but I'm taking my kids out. And then you see how many academies survive when there's 14 kids in a school year because everyone else has taken them out.And that's what has to happen. You know, people, there's that whole thing, isn't it?Oh yeah, we're going to lose cash.Do you use cash? No?Okay. And everyone has that point. There's things I buy sometimes that I can't afford.I don't have the cash and I might have to put it on a credit card. So I'm not going to be one of those people pontificating. But at the same time, if you can use cash and you've got the cash in the bank, take it out and use it. Or don't complain that it's being taken away. These are the things that we can do. You look at even with Rumble, you go, right, who's pulled support from Rumble?Okay, ASOS, right, well, I don't buy ASOS clothes anymore then.Burger King, nope, don't eat Burger King anymore. You know, I don't eat Burger King anyway, but that's where people can make a difference, you know, because I would occasionally, because I refuse Starbucks, one, because they're a horrendous organization, two, because the coffee's shit and bitter, so I'm not a fan of it.But I would have a Costa fairly regularly, every other day, probably.I've not had one since they're promoting double mastectomies.And so, you know, someone might watch this and go, oh, I bet they're well terrified that they're not getting their 12 pound a week off you.Maybe not, but if there's 100,000 like me, they might be a little bit terrified.And that's the point, isn't it? And that's what we need to do.We need to, because I'm not all for cancel culture at all. You're free to sell your coffee, I just won't buy it.And that's what I think people need to do.Because they're using this way of to try and destroy us and to try and destroy Rumble and anyone else that's on Rumble. At the end of the day, Russell Brand is just the face of it.But if Rumble goes down, ain't Russell Brand that's getting taken down.It's everyone on there.So it's much bigger than him.Um, and all these things are much bigger than him and much bigger than Tate and all these names that were given, like I say, these, you know, beware of false prophets and all that. But I think that's where we can make a stand.We can avoid using these organizations and avoid giving them our money.You know, why would you give money to people that have absolute contempt for you?100%. And that's a perfect ending to finish on something we can do, because often we feel powerless or individuals can feel, but actually we all have economic power and power to choose where we go, who we shop with, who we connect with. 
So yeah, absolutely. Yeah. We have the power to either go along with stuff or not as well, because, you know, even with masks and and all that stuff that they're going to try and bring back.Just don't go along with it.Yeah, I wasn't. I was walking into shops and I wasn't wearing them.I never wore one in a shop. I was going into pubs, you know, when they were making you stand up and put one on if you need the toilet. I never did any of that.And guess what? Nothing happened.
You can just say no. Yes. Gareth, I appreciate it's always good to chat to you.Thank you so much for coming on and sharing not only the restrictions on the social media side, but what's been happening with your dad and his travel restrictions and that court ruling. So thanks so much for joining us today.
That's a pleasure, mate. I did say to my dad as well, when they lift the ban, we're all going to chip in to take him on a Viking river cruise.So that's going to save me a few quid now that they've not left it.
That sounds a great live stream, a Viking river cruise.Thanks so much, Gareth.
Cheers, mate. Take care. Bye, mate.