Hearts of Oak Podcast

Alex Newman - The Deep State: Fact or Fiction?

Alex Newman returns to Hearts of Oak to help us to unpack The Deep State. Alex has his finger on the pulse like few others, his daily show and regular pieces in publications like Epoch Times cover so many current issues but four years ago he wrote a book on our topic this episode.What is the Deep State and why is there such a backlash against those who seek to expose it? Join us as Alex answers these questions and illuminates this clear and very present danger.Alex Newman is an award-winning international journalist, educator, author, speaker, investor, and consultant who seeks to glorify God in everything he does.In addition to serving as president of Liberty Sentinel Media, Inc, he has written for a wide array of publications in the United States and abroad. He currently serves as a contributor to the Epoch Times, a correspondent for the Law Enforcement Intelligence Brief, foreign correspondent and senior editor for The New American magazine, a writer for WND (World Net Daily), an education writer for FreedomProject Media, a columnist for the Illinois Family Institute, and much more.Over his career as a journalist, Alex has interviewed current and former heads of state, members of Congress, royalty, and countless other fascinating people. His work, which has received numerous awards, has been repeatedly highlighted by Drudge, Breitbart, Fox News, and many other outlets. His writing has been published in major newspapers across America, and his PR work has appeared in the New York Times, the Washington Post, Reuters, the Associated Press, and more.In addition, Alex has authored and co-authored several books. One of his major works was an exposé of government schools with internationally renowned Dr. Samuel Blumenfeld called Crimes of the Educators published by WND Books. It was endorsed by conservative leaders ranging from Phyllis Schlafly to Ron Paul.Across multiple platforms and with tens of millions of views on his videos so far, Alex also hosts and co-hosts a number of shows. Alex hosts The Sentinel Report on the Frank Speech network which reaches many millions worldwide. Separately, he hosts Behind The Deep State and Conversations That Matter. Finally, he co-hosts Unravelling the Narrative.Alex is on the Leadership Council of Freedom Force International, one of the premier liberty organizations in the world. He also serves as a director for the organization Bear Witness Central, which works to protect and preserve the U.S. Constitution by educating the public in partnership with other conservative organizations. Alex is a Leadership Fellow at the James Madison Institute, Florida’s premier free-market think tank. And he serves on the advisory board of Citizens for Free Speech.Alex has a B.S. degree in journalism from the University of Florida with an emphasis on economics and international relations, as well as an A.A. degree in foreign languages from Miami-Dade College. He also studied international relations at the Institute Français des Alpes in France.Follow and support Alex at the links below...The Sentinel Report TV show:https://frankspeech.com/shows/sentinel-report-tv-show-alex-newmanLiberty Sentinel:https://libertysentinel.org/GETTR:https://gettr.com/user/AlexNewmanTwitter:https://twitter.com/ALEXNEWMAN_JOU?s=20&t=evt_r4vYv-FbhWUa2yqkxAFacebook:https://www.facebook.com/alexjnewman86LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/alex-newman-9109845/'Deep State: The Invisible Government Behind the Scenes' and 'The Deep State: Pulling Strings From Behind the Scenes' available on e-book from Amazon...https://www.amazon.co.uk/Deep-State-Government-Constitutional-Principles-ebook/dp/B08LHH4HGZ/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=alex+newman+the+deep+state&sr=8-1https://www.amazon.co.uk/Deep-State-Pulling-Strings-American-ebook/dp/B079QFPM9H/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=alex+newman+the+deep+state&sr=8-2Interview recorded 14.3.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstinTo sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Please subscribe, like and share!
[0:22] Hello, Hearts of Oak, and thank you for joining us for another interview with Alex Newman, just coming up. Alex was with us back in July, and he's joined us to talk about the Deep State, Fact or Fiction. He has written a book five years ago on the Deep State, and it's a massive term, one that's misunderstood, one that there's a lot of pushback when you address, which always makes me curious. So we delve deeper into it, and Alex was able to share his input, his knowledge on what the Deep State is and look at some of those organizations and institutions that are using, how the media engage with it. Alex of course writes everywhere, he is on so many channels, he is the founder and president of Liberty Sentinel Media Inc, he writes for Epoch Times along with many other organizations, appears on many programs and is on Lindell TV every Monday to Friday at 4.30 Eastern Time which would be 9.30 p.m. UK time. You can catch him there. I know you'll enjoy listening to Alex as much as I did speaking with him. Here he is.
 
Alex Newman, it's wonderful to have you back. Thank you so much.
 
It's wonderful to be here. Thank you so much for having me Peter.
 
Thank you for having me yesterday on your show. The first time on your show it's great to be on it and I've watched it. I've watched it on on Lindell TV and obviously the website.So it was great to join you. Thank you for that.
I was an honour to have you. Thank you very much. It's great to have a British perspective sometimes.[1:50] I think Americans are very inward focused.We just focus on America, but it's really great to hear from somebody who is in another place, who's dealing with the same kind of things, only a little bit further advanced.It's a good warning, I think, that Americans need to hear more often.
No, absolutely.[2:07] Well, Alex was with us back in July after I met him at the AFA conference over in LA.He is the founder and president of Liberty Sentinel Media Inc.And there the link is underneath there, libertysentinel.org.And I think today we're gonna look at the deep state.I put it, fact or fiction, a lot is written about it. And I know Alex, you have written about this and people can get that on the website. We'll put the link in the description, the deep state exposed. We'll touch on that a little bit.And so of course I need to let the viewers know if they're not watching Lindell TV, they can catch you on Monday evenings. Is it once a week you're on?
No, it's actually a daily, every weekday.Yep, every weekday from 4.30 to 5 New York time.So.
 
Liberty Sentinel, they can get you on that. Maybe just go back, what was your vision?[3:08] You set up Liberty Sentinel what was your vision for it? What did you want that to actually achieve?What was your idea behind this?
Actually, we set it up as a college newspaper, believe it or not.I was in college, this was 2007. And I got together with a group of, we got liberty minded people, liberty minded guys. And we decided, you know, all the newspapers are fake.It's all propaganda.We need something for this community and for the surrounding area to have good information.So we created that. It started off just a once a month print publication with an online component and very rapidly grew.And pretty soon we were distributing, you know, 15,000 copies a month throughout, what was it, eight or nine counties. After college, we didn't really prepare successors.So we kind of shut down the paper.I kept the company. And the thinking was, you know, I don't know what I'll need this company for in the future, but today it's a lot of different things.We produce content for a lot of the biggest and greatest media outlets out there.I write a lot for the Epoch Times. I serve as senior editor for the New American.I do five or six other shows.We work with all kinds of different people.[4:20] Just trying to get reliable, accurate, truthful information out there from a biblical perspective, from in our country, we have our constitution, from a constitutional perspective, for the purpose of informing, educating, and activating, especially Americans, but also people around the world on these issues.
Yeah, absolutely. Well, if I can bring up where people can get, or when they go on the website, That's what you'll get.It's packed full of articles with the videos there as well. So make sure and make use of it that that's not on your list of places you have a look at each day.It is well worthwhile.[4:58] Now, the book, it was five years ago, actually, you were at the Deep State Exposed.And that I think has become a term that encompasses a lot of the control, the agenda, the attack on truth, reduction of value of the individual.And it's a term that's actually not used that much in the UK.[5:19] So maybe we can go back to that point and you wrote a book on the deep state.Do you wanna just unpack the meaning of that? Because two thirds of our viewers will be UK, a third will be US. And it may be a term which isn't deep inside people's minds in the UK.
Yeah, thank you, Peter. And so I actually chose the term because it was starting to become part of the popular lexicon in America.There had been a poll commissioned by one of the universities, the Monmouth University Polling Institute early on during Donald Trump's presidency.And they found that 75% of Americans, and this was pretty evenly distributed across both parties, believed in what the pollsters described as a deep state.Now, they defined the deep state in the poll as a group of unelected military government and other individuals who were seeking to control the national policy of the United States outside of democratic means.It was some, you know, don't quote me on that, but it's a rough paraphrase of how they define the deep state.And I think that is actually a decent definition. And so we were at the point already in America, actually the, I first did a special report in the New American Magazine on the deep state.That was about five years ago.And then about two and a half years ago, we turned it into a book.Deep State, the invisible government behind the scenes. I probably have a copy here.[6:39] I do. And I went all over the country doing talks on this subject as well, on the Deep State because it was really coming out of the closet, right? And this was something I had been exposing my entire career as a journalist, this unelected secretive network.I go a little bit deeper. You know, yeah, there are the forces in Washington, DC, the permanent bureaucracy, you know, some of the forces within the intelligence community, things like that that have been caught over and over again, doing things they shouldn't do.But there's also another layer behind that. And in the book, I define it as the deep state behind the deep state.And these are the organizations that are less known. Some of them are technically secret.Others actually have a website. They publish membership lists, like the Council on Foreign Relations.The counterpart in the United Kingdom would be the Royal Institute for International Affairs.These are very, very powerful organizations.That don't necessarily operate in the shadows, but people don't really understand what they do.Of course, you have the Bilderberg group, you know, 120 plus weirdos and their minions come together.And I actually snuck into one one time, that was fun.[7:42] You've got genuine secret societies like Skull and Bones, we have at Yale University here.We've got the Bohemian Grove out in Northern California. I'm sure you guys have your own in the United Kingdom.And, you know, I started noticing a pattern as I started investigating these things.I started noticing that they were all moving us generally in the same direction, all moving us away, from the concept of nation states toward first regional and then global governance, moving us away from individual liberty, God-given rights protected by the constitution toward this more utilitarian technocratic view of government that the individual is more of a cog in the machine.[8:20] So, that was very disturbing to me. And I actually related directly into the Bible.In this book, I actually outline that what I think is going on here is we're dealing with a struggle against evil. The Apostle Paul describes it in Ephesians chapter 6 as a battle against powers, principalities, the rulers of the darkness of this world, spiritual wickedness in high places. And so, is every member of the Council on Foreign Relations working for Satan?No. Well, maybe, but not consciously necessarily. I was brainwashed with this stuff too. I was taught in school that countries are bad and that's why we have wars and if we want to get rid of wars we got to get rid of religion we got to get rid of nations and just move to this one world kumbaya United Nations so I think that really is ultimately my understanding of the deep state I used the term because it was already in the popular lexicon but I take it a step further than say your average person walking down the street might understand
 
And of course there is a[9:16] backlash, which always intrigues me whenever when you speak in something you suddenly find there is this backlash, not a backlash of engagement or discussion, but of ridicule, of smearing.Do you want to kind of touch on that? And certainly we've seen it the last three years on COVID, but it goes back further than that. Whenever you touch on certain things, you find you're told you're not supposed to discuss that.
 
Yeah, and what we're seeing here is actually just a more advanced form of what Pavlov did with the dogs.And actually, they start training the children for this very early on in their so-called education, which is really a fraud. There's very little education actually happening in public schools in the United States.But this is a conditioned response. It's a conditioned behaviour.So just like the dogs start drooling, you know, when they hear the little bell ringing.And so the people start drooling when they hear the term conspiracy, right?And they actually don't even know what the word means. They just, conspiracy, that just means something stupid that's not true. No, get a dictionary, conspiracy means two or more people working together in secret for immoral, illegal or wicked intent.[10:22] And so there are conspiracies everywhere. Your average person understands this very well.Businessmen conspire, right? If you ask an average person walking down the street, do you think businessmen might conspire to extort you out of money or raise their price?Well, of course they would, right? We all understand that.Might politicians also, oh no, that's a conspiracy theory, right?And they start drooling. So this is not actually a result of logic or reason.It's not that they're processing evidence.It's that they have been conditioned, first in the schools and then later through the media, to just start drooling.And of course, I'm using drooling as a proverbial, right? But, well, that's silly or whatever buzzword of the day.That's racist or that's homophobic.Or that, you know, just pick your buzzword that they've been trained to spout when they're exposed to the stimuli.[11:06] And that's what you get. That's a conspiracy.And so you end up with a large segment of the population that is actually impervious to reason, logic, or evidence.And I think that's how the deep state likes it. You know, more and more, this is falling by the wayside.I think more and more Americans, especially, and I think it's probably true in Britain as well and in other parts of Europe.I spent a big part of my life in Europe, but Latin America, Africa, you know, I have people that I speak with regularly all around the world.I think people all across the planet are starting to realize that, you know, they may not know all the details, but they're starting to realize that, wow, there really are people who want to undermine our nation states and undermine our individual freedoms and move us toward a system that at the very least we never consented to, and at the very least we haven't voted on, right?And so I'm encouraged by that. But yeah, there has been a very deliberate process of trying to ridicule and marginalize people who point this out, which of course is exactly what you would do if you were trying to secretly undermine institutions and values that people cherish.
No, I think whenever watching Trump from afar running and winning in 2016,[12:13] The vitriol against him was one thing, but it seemed to be something more than that. And certainly I hadn't, from being a student of politics, had not seen anything on that scale before. I mean, what were your thoughts around that time? Because it seemed as if there was something bigger against this individual who was standing than we'd seen ever before.
There absolutely was. And that's because the deep state, to borrow the term, to continue at this term, understood that Trump was not necessarily part of them. He was not controllable by them. And you know, you don't have to agree with everything that Trump ever did or said to recognize that he was kind of like a human wrecking ball, right? He had his own ideas. He was going to go in there and do those things. And he didn't care what the fake media or anybody else thought.And you know, for many years in his life, he was actually close to some of this machinery.But he also came from a background that I think deeply disturbed them, right? Early on in Trump's presidency. In fact, it might have even been before he was elected. I went to Roger Stone's house and to Roger Stone's office and we filmed some interviews. And this was for public, right?This was not a one-on-one conversation. This was for the public. And Roger Stone tells me, yeah, Donald Trump, he comes from an amazing background. His dad was a good friend of Robert Welch, the founder of the John Birch Society. His dad was one of the major funders of the John Birch Society.[13:32] John Birch Society is like kryptonite for the deep state. They start freaking out.It's like throwing water on the wicked witch of the West.Because the John Birch Society has been trying to fight this for 60 plus years.And so when you have Roger Stone, a very close aide and advisor to Donald Trump, saying that Trump's dad was John Birch Society.Trump, of course, was mentored and worked very closely for decades with Roy Cohn, who was on the board of the Western Goals Foundation, which was founded by Congressman Larry McDonald, who, in addition to being the chairman of the John Birch Society, was the most conservative, the most anti-communist, the most anti-deep state member of the US Congress.So much so that the Soviets ended up shooting down his airplane in 1983.You know, he really made a lot of people mad. And so Roy Cohn was on the board with Congressman Larry McDonald. Congressman Larry McDonald was kind of like a Donald Trump, you know, just a human wrecking ball when it came to stopping the machinations and the plans of the establishment.And so Donald Trump came from this background.[14:28] It was very obvious that he wasn't going to be a conventional politician.It was very obvious that he wasn't going to be taking marching orders from the Council on Foreign Relations.Or he actually was the only Republican president in the last hundred years who hadn't gone to go visit these clowns at the Bohemian Grove with their weirdo rituals that they do.And actually, apparently they had talked about him there. Some emails were leaked from Stephen Harper, who was the Prime Minister of Canada and Colin Powell.And Colin Powell had written to Stephen Harper, no, sorry, to the former Defense Minister of Canada.He said, I got to sit next to Stephen Harper And, you know, we had some nice chats and we all agreed Donald Trump is terrible.You know, we got to stop Donald Trump.So within the kind of organizations and networks that we kind of broadly classify as the deep state, Donald Trump was viewed as very dangerous.And even after he was elected, they continued to come out of the woodwork and say this.I've got a video that I used in my presentations across the country on the deep state of the former head of the CIA, John McLaughlin.Saying he was asked on a panel discussion. So Donald Trump is whining that there's a deep state out to get him and that they want to remove him.Is that true?And I think she was expecting the guy to say like, what an idiot, what a conspiracy theorist.And he actually says, thank God for the deep state.[15:41] Wait, what? You're thanking God for a deep state trying to take out the elected president of the United States?Did we just hear that?You had Senator Chuckie Schumer, the leader of the Democrats in the US Senate, said on Rachel Maddow, this weird guy who's got a TV show on MSLSD, Asked him, you know, about Donald Trump.And Chuckie Schumer says, yeah, you know, the intelligence community has six ways from Sunday to get back at you. So Donald Trump better be really careful.Who says that? What's that supposed to mean? Are you going to shoot the guy?Are you going to, you know, put fake news about him in the media?What tools, what six ways from Sunday does the intelligence community have to get back at the elected president of the United States?And so I think it was very obvious.Again, you don't have to agree with everything Donald Trump said or did during his presidency or before to realize that there was a very powerful network, not just American, but global, that absolutely hated the guy.And even though every once in a while he'd throw him a bone, you know, he'd meet with Henry Kissinger, he'd pursue some policy that they were pleased with, ultimately he was a human wrecking ball to their agenda.He got us out of the UNESCO. He got us out of the World Health Organization.He got us out of the Paris Agreement. I mean, these are all critical policies that the deep state has been working on for a long time. And here comes this guy, and in just a period of a few years is destroying the whole architecture that they'd spent all these decades building.So they'll never forgive him for that. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw, you know, another SWAT raid on Mar-a-Lago and they bring the CNNs and stuff to drag them out in chains.[17:10] But yeah, they hate him. And I think the reason why is obvious.
Because I think every president really up to that point kind of fitted in the jigsaw. They fit it neatly in. They were in one of two parties that stayed in their lane. And then you have someone coming, an enigma that blows out of the water. And it was interesting to see the, I guess, the split in the Republican Party of a fear that someone was coming in that was maybe uncontrollable and they were losing that control of their own party.[17:44] Yeah and you know there's always been this struggle within the conservative movement and the Republican Party. It's been going on for many many decades. You had kind of the establishment faction and the grassroots faction and the establishment faction really has been primarily represented by I would say National Review and William Buckley. You know if you actually go back and read William Buckley's position, I mean the guy has a lot of troubling connections. He was a member of the Secret Society. I mentioned Skull and Bones at Yale.He was a member of the Council on Foreign Relations. He worked for years for the Central Intelligence Agency in Mexico City. He was okay with abortions. He was okay with what he described as a totalitarian bureaucracy within our shores to supposedly deal with the Soviet Union. So, you know, on a traditional political spectrum of where Americans are at, William Buckley didn't really fit very well in the conservative side of the spectrum. And yet, the New York Times and the and the Washington Compost and PBS, they all trotted him out as the conservative.He was the representative of responsible conservatism and anyone who didn't line up behind William Buckley was somehow irresponsible or extreme.And so we saw this in the 2016 election, right? National Review did a whole issue about stopping Trump and they brought all their clown car out and everybody wrote the article about why Donald Trump is so scary and so dangerous.And the conservative movement and the Republican Party laughed at them.They said, you guys are clowns, right? We don't care what you think.You're not the leaders of the conservative movement.[19:07] And so at that point, I think the establishment wing of the Republican Party really was destroyed.I mean, a lot of them are still there, but they've had to camouflage themselves.They've had to pretend to be conservative. They've had to pretend to be MAGA, if you will, to borrow a term from the modern lexicon.[19:22] But a lot of them were just pushed clear out, right? Bill Kristol, the editor of the Weekly Standard, another leading figure within what was the establishment Republican.I mean, there's no genuine grassroots Republican conservative today in America who seriously cares what Bill Kristol thinks.I mean, the guy's a joke to the extent that anybody knows him, he's a joke.Same thing now today with National Review.National Review hasn't been to CPAC since Trump won the presidency, because they realize they're not really part of any actual movement anymore.They're kind of this fringe, you know, they don't quite fit in with the Democrats, because they like more war than I think the Democrats are comfortable with. But they certainly don't fit in with the Republicans.So they're kind of out in the wilderness.And that was all a result of Trump's presidency. He was the first one that was able to really.[20:07] communicate this to the American people in a way that they would understand, in a way where the media couldn't suppress it,[20:13] Because it happened very rapidly, the discrediting of the media completely among conservatives.Because it used to be, you know, the media could come in and play air support and kind of do damage control whenever the truth started leaking out.But with Trump, Americans, and this became very clear after the election, Americans who supported him were inclined to believe almost the opposite of what the fake media said.So if the media said, well, National Review said Trump is bad, and National review is the standard bearer of the conservative movement, conservative Americans would say, okay, I guess the conservative movement is actually not led by National Review, National Review must be a joke.And so you saw this really big rift in conservatism that was there for decades and decades.There was always this power struggle within the party.Do we want constitutional, Christian, limited government, God-given rights, or do we want this kind of establishment brand of neoconservatism, right?Irving Kristol, Bill Kristol's father was kind of one of the founders of neoconservatism.And he actually admitted once that it was kind of Trotskyite in orientation.[21:10] So this struggle existed for decades and decades. And then Trump's presidency kind of finally blew up that struggle.You know, and I think the final contest there was Liz Cheney running for office in Wyoming.I guess really somebody that was a political newcomer. I mean, I knew Harriet Hageman.She's been in some of my talks.I've known her for years. You know, nice lady.But National America Republican Party had not heard of Harriet Hageman and yet she crushed Liz Cheney like a bug.I mean, it wasn't even a contest. And I think at that point it was clear to everybody, all the analysts, everybody that the what was used to be the establishment wing of the Republican Party was basically not just impotent, but ground into dust.[21:50] Yeah, well, I'm just back from CPAC, which was a, I don't know if I dreamed about CPAC, certainly daydreamed about it. And you compare it to what we have in the UK, and it's got that energy, that razzmatazz, that showbiz, that, and it was great to be there and to the energy there.Obviously, Trump spoke at the end for, I think, an hour and a half, and really good speech, although didn't raise it to high decibels as such, but bang on so many of the topics.But I kind of look when you look, you're wondering whether, I mean when he got in in 2016, whether actually people know him much better, they are even more afraid of him, in many parts of the country, and whether that fight for this time will be even worse, even harder, even more brutal than it was before.[22:48] I think it will be. And it's very interesting now. The establishment has realized that they're not gonna be able to run one of the regular milk toast fake Republicans.I mean, the idea of Jeb Bush seriously running in a Republican Party, nobody can take that seriously.It's a laughing matter.Nobody would seriously consider running an establishment Republican.And so what's happening is the establishment Republicans now coalescing behind Ron DeSantis.And, um, you know, I, I spent hours and hours in Ron DeSantis's office.He used to be my Congressman, always, you know, pestering him about the votes that were less than ideal.[23:22] He's my governor. Of course, you know, he was at the meeting we were at just a few weeks ago, had a chance to speak with him briefly there. And so, you know, I really don't have a personal problem with Ron DeSantis. He's been a great governor. He's my governor.He's certainly the best in the whole country. But I think the reason the establishment wing of the Republican Party is coalescing behind Ron DeSantis, and this is a really good sign to me, is because they realize there's nobody else who doesn't have credentials as a hardcore conservative willing to punch these clowns in the nose that has any chance of winning against Donald Trump.And I think that they're more terrified of Donald Trump than they are of Ron DeSantis, because Ron DeSantis is still, you know, something more of a conventional politician.He doesn't throw out like insults that are gonna embarrass these people for the rest of their lives, right?And so I think they're like, you know what? Maybe Ron DeSantis isn't the policy guy that we like, but at least he's not Trump, and he has a chance of beating Trump.And so, you know, let's marshal our forces behind him. So it's gonna be really interesting.But I think just the fact that this is where the Republican Party at is a really good sign.[24:21] You know, Ron DeSantis has been a standard bearer for the freedom movement, actually.And he could have done better. Of course, he's a human being like anybody, but he did, early on he succumbed to some of the hysteria and did a few of the little mandates, but very rapidly he turned that around.And he actually protected the people of Florida from the craziness that was affecting most of the rest of the country.And I know, cause I live here, you know, we really didn't have mandates from the local, from the county or from the state level where I live.Life just pretty much continued as normal. Never did anyone here tell me to put on a face diaper, never did anyone tell me I couldn't do something if I wouldn't take the thing. And so, and I thank Ron DeSantis for that, you know, he really led the way. And so I'm frankly pleased that I know a lot of conservatives are very worried about the possibility of Trump and Ron DeSantis kind of of destroying each other and dividing the conservative movement.And I think that's a fair concern.[25:11] And I share it, but I also think there's a silver lining here.And this shows you that the American people are breaking free of the fake, you know, uni-party, the fake two-party system where they really all agree.And they're demanding somebody who's going to actually be bold and courageous and standing up for the rights of Americans against the tyranny that has really run almost unchecked for so many decades now.So I think that's encouraging. And actually, at the meeting we were at just a few weeks ago in Miami, I spent a little time with Anthony Sabatini, a lot of time with Anthony Sabatini.I would say he was our best legislator here in the state of Florida by far, took on all the crazy COVID stuff.And he planted a seed in my mind that I haven't been able to stop thinking about.He said, you know what? This is really gonna be good to have Ron DeSantis and Trump running because they're gonna both have to run to the right.They're both gonna have to run as real conservatives. That's gonna change the Overton window in this country.The fake media is no longer gonna be able to keep the debate confined within this dumb little box.They're gonna smash it wide open.And yeah, it's gonna be interesting.But yeah, the media is gonna do everything they can to attack Trump like they did last time, the deep state will as well. I think potentially even including criminal charges that we may see soon.[26:22] But it's a fascinating time to be alive.
 
Well, it is. And you talk about the media and it's interesting to see how, with Trump, the media coalesced against him, but generally how they've come together against many of the values.And I don't know whether that means the media just a useful idiom, a pawn used by others, or whether they're more part and parcel of the evil we're seeing?
 
Well, I think at the highest levels they are absolutely part and parcel of what we're seeing. In fact, I mentioned the Council on Foreign Relations several times. That's the sister organization of your Royal Institute for International Affairs. Actually, Cecil Rhodes set up this huge global network, and it's described in a book I have behind me. It's called Tragedy and Hope, Cecil Rhodes, of course, the mining magnate who made his fortune in South African mining.And when he died, he left a will and he created this whole global network.And he really was interested in globalism. He kind of talked about we want to spread English civilization around the world, but I think that was really not his primary objective.But in this book, the historian who writes it explains that actually in the United States, the chief outpost of this international operation is the Council on Foreign Relations.[27:39] So you have the CFR. Now, CFR has corporate members, right, which is interesting. And what you'll find is that a lot of the major media organizations in this country, the conglomerates that own, you know, massive media holdings, in addition to other things, right, not just media, they're corporate members of the Council on Foreign Relations. In fact, until not too long ago, News Corporation, which owns Fox News and the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post, was a corporate member. Some of the Murdochs have been members. In fact, I think some of some of the Murdoch children still are members.And so, yes, the media is absolutely a part of that. Now that doesn't mean that your average bozo who's reading a script on the television is consciously participating in the subversion of American values, but at the highest levels of these companies, absolutely they are.[28:24] And I think the American people have started to see through this.They might not know all the details, but we've been getting poll after poll after poll now that shows the overwhelming majority of Americans realize that the media is not just biased, right?Bias was one thing, everybody's biased. I think even the concept of unbiased media is rather unrealistic. You can be fair, but everybody's got a bias and it shows up in who you're gonna interview, what stories you're gonna choose to write. I mean, we just need to be honest and say that.[28:48] But this is not bias. This is an issue of dishonesty. And the latest poll that I saw, I think this came out within a month or so, was that the overwhelming majority of Americans now recognize that the media is consciously deceiving us.They're lying to us. And that's way beyond bias.And I think, again, the 2016 election showed that pretty clearly.You had the mainstream media absolutely united in lockstep.There was no major media outlet in this country that came out in favour of Donald Trump.Of the big networks, the Media Research Centre did an analysis.It was 92 or 93% negative coverage of Donald Trump.When he was mentioned, it was in some negative context. Of the top 100 newspapers in this country, I think two endorsed Donald Trump. So with all the media united against Donald Trump, What happened?[29:34] He won in a landslide. And so, you know, obviously Americans are not paying as much attention to this nonsense as they used to.And I think in many cases, and I think a lot of the people who control the media realize this, in many cases, when the media says something, Americans are just automatically inclined to disagree with it.Like with Ukraine is a good example. A lot of Americans could have been brought to bear to support Ukraine, but when they see the media supporting and when they see Joe Biden supporting, they're like, no, I don't want anything to do with that. And that's where we are now as a nation.I think the majority of Americans now completely reject the media.Many of them, even to borrow a term from Donald Trump, as enemies of the people, which I think that's a dangerous term, that's a communist term when you start calling people enemies of the people.But I think a lot of Americans are there now. They say, CNN, CBS, ABC, they are enemies of the people, and they might not be wrong.[30:24] One thing that excites me, and if it was all up to,the hope of America being in Fox media wise on the right. That would be depressing, especially as we've seen what's happened to it.But the proliferation of other alternative media outlets, you're obviously very much part of that in the US.And it was great going to CPAC, walking along media row and seeing so many different podcasts, different TV shows.And of course, in the corner, you've got, you couldn't even get past because Real America Voice, Steve Bannon was there, Lindell TV next door.There's so much, and that seems to be more difficult, I guess, to control when it's all independent.And I think for me, that's one thing that it excites me looking ahead.[31:17] Yeah, and I think this trend has been emerging for a long time.The internet really broke it.You know, when I was in journalism school, I was at the University of Florida, which is considered one of the top journalism schools, and they were always telling us, I mean, in class, you know, these professors who had been executive editors of major, you know, left-wing propaganda machines called newspapers in the big cities, they'd always tell us, I mean, just drill it into your head, you all are the gatekeepers.You're gonna control what people are gonna say. And I would just laugh, like, I guess these guys haven't figured out that the internet exists now, right?Because, I mean, already YouTube was out there back before it was owned by the totalitarians at Google, the fascists at Google. You could find anything you wanted, right?And so I think these people were still living like decades earlier, where the media actually was the gatekeepers that had already ended.They just hadn't realized it.And it's taken a while for this to develop. But I do think we're at the point now where probably the politically dominant forces in this country are now largely informed by alternative media.And if you go from state to state, right? You turn off CNN, you turn off Fox and you go just to different state capitals.What you'll find is that the state legislators, the people who are making the decisions that impact our lives, our County commissioners, our mayor,[32:26] they're getting their information from these sources that used to be alternative media or conservative media.Now they're just the media. That's just where people go to get their information.CNN is a joke. CNN has less viewers at prime time than ancient freaking aliens, right?I mean, CNN is a joke. They really, they've lost their viewership.At prime time, they often get less than a million people watching.And most of these people that are watching are not really politically active.It's like people in a nursing home that are forced to watch a CNN or people that are trapped in an airport that have no interest in watching what's on the screens up there.[33:00] You know, these are not the people that are going out and working their hineys off for candidates.These are not the people that are donating to political parties, right?And so I'm really encouraged by this. The media monopoly has been broken.And you saw it so clearly in 2016. I think this is why the fascists at YouTube freaked out.And again, you know, you don't have to agree with everything Alex Jones has ever said. I like Alex Jones. I go on his program sometimes. But, you know, what we saw in the 2016 election, he was absolutely mopping the floor with the fake media. His YouTube channel was getting more views than ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, New York Slimes, Washington Compost combined just on his YouTube channel.And so they saw this and they're freaking out.[33:39] They're like, wow, the people who actually vote, the people who actually determine elections, they're not getting their news from us.We have billions of dollars, but they're getting their news from this guy in Texas, Alex Jones has got a radio show in a TV studio and they panic.And so, you know, the YouTube, it wasn't enough to just shadow ban him, right?Because in a free marketplace of ideas, that the new media was absolutely crushing these people.So they couldn't have a marketplace of ideas, even in a rigged marketplace of ideas.Because first they tried the shadow banning, you know, they tried to break their algorithms so you couldn't find what you were looking for.And still the new media, the alternative media was crushing the legacy fake media.And so they finally said, well, we just can't do this anymore.We just have to delete these people from the internet so that no matter how hard you look, you can't find them.And that still didn't work.And it's not going to work. There's a hunger for truth out there among Americans that no matter how hard the fascists in Silicon Valley[34:32] try to suppress this information. It's not gonna be suppressed and we're seeing that we're gonna continue to see that There are too many millions of Americans who are awake to this now They're gonna have to do something much more drastic than shadow ban us or kick us off of Twitter to stop this information from coming, Out.
 
I do love how Alex Jones triggers there everyone and it is a joy to behold and how they've gone after him makes you think actually there is something there if they're going after him with such verocity and aggression and beyond anything we've seen before.But you're on, people can watch show on Lindell TV and that's another platform by Mike Lindell who also is vilified by the media at large by the left.And I mean, I love the way someone who in effect is kind of the American dream, where he's come from a back road of addiction.And then now has pulled himself up, has built a business in my pillow, and then also has a TV station. And that kind of the American dream, that's what is needed across the US, across Europe, really.[35:38] It is, it is. And yeah, the media has demonized him like crazy. And guess what?Just recently they did polling to see who was gonna be the most popular candidate to lead the Republican party, to serve as chairman of the RNC.And Mike Lindell was far and away the biggest one, the most popular candidate.So, you know, we're at the point now in America where if the media demonizes you, people like you.If the media says you're bad or you're a conspiracy theorist or you're extreme or whatever, people automatically say, well, that guy must be good.And so this is a good spot to be in, you know? And I don't want people to get the impression that I think everything is just rainbows and unicorns and we're just a clear path to freedom now.I'm not saying that, but we are at a point now where the media has been totally discredited, totally defanged, and now new voices are rising to the top and that's as it should be.And you are one in the United Kingdom and even here in the United States.And there are just this whole new ecosystem of voices and platforms and shows and blogs and websites and magazines.The Epoch Times is another good example.I mean, this was completely unknown two decades ago. Today, it's one of the biggest newspapers in America.It's a number four, if I'm not mistaken, in subscriptions behind the New York Slimes, the Washington Compost and the Wall Street Journal. Last I checked, they're at like 1.7 million subscribers.[36:54] And that happened very, very rapidly. And I write for the Epoch Times.I love the Epoch Times, but how did that happen?It's because they're telling the truth. People are hungry for the truth.And so, you get a newspaper that tells the truth, guess what, people will flock toward it. So this is extremely encouraging in my opinion, Peter.
And I think one of the things, obviously, you writing the book on the deep state and discussing it and bringing it out in the open, but then I think over the last three years that's been sped up with many people beginning to question what is happening, question organizations and organizations which were maybe in the shadows have been brought into the light. I mean, I mean, what are your thoughts then on the last three years on how it has exposed what is happening under the deep state?[37:43] I'll tell you what, Peter, everywhere I go in America, and I'm constantly on the road, everywhere I go, I'm meeting people who are like, you know what, before COVID, I was just a mom.I was just, you know, I was worried about getting my kids fed and clothed, you know, had none of this stuff on my radar.And then COVID hit, and they said my kid had to wear a diaper on his face.And they said I couldn't go eat at a restaurant unless I would take this experimental thing.And they woke up.And not only did they wake up, not only did they start saying, what's going on here?Who's behind this? What is really happening?Not only did they do that, After they got educated, they said.[38:17] I'm going to work on stopping this. And so they're forming groups and they're getting together with other moms, they're getting together with other patriots, they're getting together with other Republicans and they're getting involved politically. They're joining Republican executive committees.They're running for office. They're lobbying their state legislators.They're running for Congress.And so we're in a really unique moment, I think, in American history.A lot of people are starting to call it a great awakening and that has very strong Christian overtones.So, you know, I don't know that I'm ready to say that we're quite there yet, but something is happening.You know, a lot of people who just a few years ago were not paying any attention, they really didn't care.They've suddenly realized that they're now in a battle for the heart and soul of their nation, in an existential battle for the very future of their family, for the future of their country, for the future of their church, for the future of their liberties.And you know, once people realize that, once people realize that like, there's been a war declared on you, and if you don't do something, it's gonna end really badly, people get activated.And I would submit to you, and I don't have any numbers on this, but I would submit to you that there are many millions, millions of Americans who within the last three years, they were completely out of the fight before and they are now very active participants.[39:29] And they're gonna grow and they're gonna develop and they're gonna move up the ranks and they're gonna get higher and higher in elected office.And so, my big concern now is that, and the deep state recognizes this, they've got wonderful forecasting models, they've got people like Peter Schwab or Peter Schwartz, excuse me, over at the World Economic Forum, that do a future scenario planning.I mean, they've charted this all out. They realize that we're on a trajectory now where if people keep waking up at this rate, they're gonna be in big trouble.And so my concern is we may see something wild, something dramatic to try to put a stop to this.Something like, you know, the World Economic Forum not too long ago did the cyber polygon exercises that were the communications and the grid would go down.You know, so I think the deep state recognizes that they're in a very vulnerable position right now.They've completely lost the support of the public.And you saw this on YouTube. I think that's why YouTube had to get rid of the thumbs down.Every time World Economic Forum would put up one of their dumb propaganda videos, it'd get like two thumbs up, right? It's the guys on stage. And then a million thumbs down.So, oh, wow, people woke up. So they're in a very dangerous place.And just like a dangerous animal.Once you get them in the corner, you know, they're liable to lash out and behave all crazy.[40:37] That's where we are right now. Too many people are waking up too quickly, thanks to what happened with COVID, thanks to what happened with the 2016 election, thanks to what happened with the 2020 election. And, you know, they're going to need something a lot bigger than a January 6th PSYOP to try to put this toothpaste back into the tube.
Yeah. You mentioned the Great Awakening in that biblical context. And when I was with you yesterday you had mentioned that you'd been preaching a church on Sunday. And that link, I mean, growing up as a pastor's kid, very involved in my local church, and that is the most important thing to us as Christians, that Jesus is the most important thing. It's intriguing that mix in the States, and especially with this pushback, that there are churches, not necessarily across the board, but maybe who were more passively involved, there is that spark. What is that like for you, kind of in two different camps, a media camp, a church camp? Tell us about that mix.[41:41] Yeah, what I'm seeing is just, it's really encouraging. It's wonderful. And in fact, I think COVID had a profound effect on the churches. You know, what the enemy meant for evil, God absolutely is using for good, right? The enemy wanted to shut down all the schools so that all the kids could be forced online so they could gather all the data. Well, what actually happened? Parents started of seeing what was happening in their kids' schools and they're yanked their kids out of public schools.Millions of families have fled the government's indoctrination systems.And something similar happened with churches. The enemy thought, hey, this is gonna be a great way to attack the church.We're gonna force these Christians to stop meeting and stop praying and stop singing.And what actually happened?A lot of pastors grew a backbone. A lot of pastors that were basically out of the fight, you know, just, you know, preaching 18,000 different versions of a John 3, 16 sermon, largely out of context.[42:24] They were like, wait a minute here, what's going on? This is like, wow, this is serious.And so a lot of the fake churches actually crumbled. I read somewhere that one in five churches shuttered and didn't open again.And you know, that sounds terrible. It makes you want to cry.And then you realize that the overwhelming majority of those churches were not Bible believing churches. They were not.Truly preaching the word of God. The people in that congregation did not truly have a relationship with Jesus Christ.And what happened? The people who did actually went to the good churches.This church that I just preached at, I preached all four morning services at this wonderful church in Idaho.[42:58] The Christian Candlelight Fellowship in Coeur d'Alene.It's now the biggest church in the region. And what happened during COVID is they just absolutely exploded.They became huge. People were coming from everywhere to the point where they've massively outgrown their church.They're having to do four different, I've never been to a church with four services in one morning.That's how rapidly that church grew. And this is happening, I mean, I just mentioned that one because it was last weekend, but this was happening all over the country, Peter.[43:22] The churches that remained faithful to the word of God, the churches that said, like John MacArthur in California, you know, just brilliant.The guy had always been, you know, Romans 13 means you must submit to the government and everything, don't ever ask any questions, don't even be involved politically, right?And then this comes along and he says, wait a minute, Sorry, Governor Newsom, but you're not the head of the church.You can't order us to shut down. Jesus Christ is the head of the church and we're gonna have to stay open.You know, we respect you, we honour you as the government authority, but you don't have that authority.We're gonna have to stay open. And so now this pastor who, you know, influences tens of thousands of other pastors across this country is preaching sermons on how governments are making themselves illegitimate by doing the opposite of what government was instituted by God to do.Instead of punishing evil and protecting good, They're punishing good and protecting evil.So you have this huge awakening happening in the church and it's extraordinary to see, it's amazing.I think God is doing something hugely significant in this country.Yeah, I think one of the big reasons that we're in this mess, Peter, is because churches and pastors have not been preaching the whole counsel of God.[44:30] I've been working in, we've been doing pastors summits all across the country.They're called the Liberty Pastors Summits and we're doing them all over the country.We're bringing hundreds of pastors. We've done thousands of pastors now all over the country, bringing them together and teaching them a series of different things just straight out of the Bible.So I've been teaching on globalism and education.Pastor Paul Blair, who's kind of leading and Dan Fisher, who are kind of organizing, leading this, are pastors out of Oklahoma.They're teaching, you know, what does the Bible say on government?What does the Bible say on all these critical issues? And I love what Pastor Paul Blair always says.Jesus cannot just be the Lord of your Sunday morning.Jesus needs to be the Lord of every single area of your life.That includes your family, that includes your business, that includes your politics, that includes your government.Every area of your life needs to be in submission to Christ.And that has profound implications. And that's something that's been largely lost in our country. the reason our country was born.Is because the pastors were preaching the truth from the pulpit.[45:26] And this has been largely forgotten, but we had the Black Robe Regiment.Without the Black Robe Regiment, we probably, and I know this is a sensitive subject for Brits, so I won't rub it in, but we never would have actually declared independence.It was because the pastors were saying, this king is acting out of line.He doesn't have the authority to do these things. This is ungodly.We are not going to be okay with that.And that's why our country was born. It was because the pastors were preaching in their pulpits.And that's the history of our nation.And this was, you know, shortly after the great awakening when John Edwards and others were preaching these fiery sermons and just the spirit of God was moving across this country.Our founding fathers were kids listening in the pulpits to this.Of course, they were inspired by the great Christians of Britain, right?Oliver Cromwell, of course, you know, our founding fathers had him in mind where he said, you know, Lex Rex, the law is king and who ultimately establishes the law, that's God.And even the king has to submit to the laws of God, right? The king cannot ignore the laws and the commands of God.The king must be in submission to them as well.So all of the ideas that are at the centre of our country, that are at the centre of our constitution, that are at the centre of our civilization, have been lost now through multiple generations of indoctrination in the public schools, through multiple generations of pastors being too scared to preach the truth.[46:39] Because the IRS threatens they're gonna go after anybody who says anything that they don't like for their tax exemption.And now that's all crumbling. Now we're seeing pastors and congregations and Christians realizing that no, this all, the Bible is the answer to these things.And that's how our country was born. That's how Western civilization was born.If there's gonna be any hope of reclaiming it, it's gonna have to be through reacquainting ourselves with the word of God and through courage in our pulpits, in our churches and among the body of Christ.[47:09] I think we'll end on that. That's absolutely perfect. Alex, I really appreciate you coming along.Thank you for joining us today.
Thank you so much, Peter. It's an honour and a pleasure. Really appreciate all that you're doing.Hopefully we'll meet again very soon. I hope you get back to the United States or maybe I'll be on the other side of the pond this summer. So let's keep in touch.
Either or. And can I just finish here, obviously on gab GETTR truth and I know libertycentral.org.Just remind the viewers kind of what is the best place to find you and what can they find on the website?
Well, thank you so much. So my personal website is libertysentinel.org.I put up a really eclectic mix of things there, everything from some of my shows, podcasts, articles that I and others write. I'm the volunteer executive director of a ministry called Public School Exit.We're actually helping churches and families, not just across the United States, but around the world, figure out how to get God's people out of the government schools and into the safe sanctuary of home schools, Christian schools, private schools, et cetera.You can find that at publicschoolexit.com. I'm senior editor of the New American Magazine.You can find us at thenewamerican.com. Even if you don't subscribe to the print magazine, you can get the daily headlines for free in your inbox by email.[48:15] I write for the Epoch Times. And yeah, I do a lot of other things.I write for the Law Enforcement Intelligence Brief.It goes out to every police chief and sheriff in the country, but people are welcome to get that as well if they want. So a lot of different things, but you can find me on Twitter or post a big mix of stuff there, at Alex Newman underscore J-O-U. And of course, Gab GETTR.I'm still on Fascist Book, although I don't use it all that much.But thanks again, Peter. Really, it's an honour to be here with you.Thank you for all that you're doing and God bless you, sir.
God bless. joining us today, Alex.

The Week According To . . . Voice of Wales

Welcome to your regular dose of news-based chat, opinion and an honest appraisal of the past seven days with free-thinking guests from all walks of life and this episode is the welcome return of our good friend, Dan from Voice of Wales.Buckle up as Dan let's rip on the topics this week including...- Judges issue arrest warrant for Vladimir Putin over alleged war crimes.- Tommy is back with a new documentary 'Plantation 2: Rise of the Celts'.- Fears two refugee hostels will swamp North Wales community and ignite public 'unrest'.- Lord Ahmed of Rotherham: Nonce's prison sentence cut by appeal court.- Minority teachers to receive £5K bonus from Welsh government.- 13 year old girl 'attacked' by boy in a gender-neutral school toilet says she dreads returning to lessons.- Nursery tells parents to not tell their daughters that they are 'pretty' or to call them 'princess'.- Funeral for paedophile drag queen's cortege that was led by horse-drawn carriage stops outside city's oldest gay bar.- Statues of ‘old white men’ may need to be destroyed, Welsh government advises.- Match of the Day without Gary Lineker was watched by 500,000 more people than usual.Voice of Wales are the only common-sense media outfit in Wales.Labelled as a 'threat to modern day Wales', these lads are nothing of the sort, they are in fact 'The True Voice of Welsh Journalism'.They will tackle any issue whether it be the lockdown madness, ignoring immigration, self-hatred of Britain, destruction of free speech, refusal to speak out against grooming gangs, giving a knee to BLM or destroying our children's education by rewriting our history.Dan and Stan have an opinion and they are the only voice that Wales needs to hear.Follow and support the lads at …Website: https://www.voiceofwales.com/GETTR: https://gettr.com/user/VoWalesOfficialTwitter: https://twitter.com/VoWalesOfficial?s=20https://twitter.com/DanVoWMedia?s=20Telegram: https://t.me/VoiceOfWalesOriginally broadcast as a live discussion 18.3.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstinTo sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Please subscribe, like and share! Links to articles discussed this episode...Putin https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/mar/17/vladimir-putin-arrest-warrant-ukraine-war-crimesPlantation 2 https://gettr.com/post/p2brydx6f15Refugee hostels https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/fears-two-refugee-hostels-swamp-26434766?fbclid=IwAR3THor7ejS8PxQppzlItNRcmDGN986LNaWJTq5mklGz1KwUbhEpwrtLoeg#lf44aiv6qbuskv08p7Lord Ahmedhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-64989574?s=09Welsh Governmenthttps://www.voiceofwales.com/minority-teachers-to-receive-5000-bonus-from-welsh-governmentGender-neutral school https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11873283/Traumatised-13-year-old-girl-attacked-boy-gender-neutral-school-toilet.html?ito=native_share_article-nativemenubuttonWoke Nursery https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/dont-tell-your-daughters-theyre-26488241Paedophile Funeralhttps://web.archive.org/web/20230309180716/https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11840417/Paedophile-drag-queen-dead-alleyway-remembered-funeral-cortege-stops-outside-gay-bar.htmlWelsh government https://web.archive.org/web/20230311235209/https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/03/11/statues-old-white-men-may-need-destroyed-welsh-government-advises/Gary Lineker https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11850255/amp/Match-Day-figures-half-million-viewers-tune-amid-Gary-Lineker-crisis.html

Father Calvin Robinson - The 21st Century Church in a Woke Society

Here in the UK we have had the Church of England announce they will bless same-sex unions while over in the US the so called 'Asbury Revival' has been making headlines. To understand these two diametric concepts of revival and woke-ism we asked Fr Calvin Robinson to join us. Calvin speaks out strongly on how the Church is England is losing its message of Christ as it embraces 'new' values and concepts of the world. He has also been keeping a keen eye on the unusual events at the church in Asbury University in Kentucky, where a service of worship just went on and on. Can the Church of England return to truth and is what is happening in Asbury the beginning of a renewal in Christendom?The Reverend Calvin Robinson is a popular British political advisor, presenter and commentator.Fr Robinson is Minister-in-Charge of Christ Church in London and has been published widely in the media, including GB News, Talk radio, the Guardian, the Daily Telegraph, Daily Mail, the Spectator, and the Daily Express among others.He is a former assistant principal and has consulted for the Department for Education, supporting school leaders across the South East.Born and bred in the East Midlands, England, Calvin is on a crusade to reclaim our country from the woke using truth and common sense while standing up for family, conservative, Christian and British values.Catch Calvin every Sunday at 3pm for the 'Common Sense Crusade' on GB News.Follow and support Calvin....GETTR: https://gettr.com/user/calvinrobinsonTwitter: https://twitter.com/calvinrobinson?s=20&t=46rqU2zEtSYZDNs2huAI7ATelegram: https://t.me/calvinrobinsonSubstack: https://calvinrobinson.substack.com/Website: https://www.calvinrobinson.com/Interview recorded 13.3.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstinTo sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Please subscribe, like and share!
[0:22] Hello, Hearts of Oak. Thank you for joining us on another interview coming up with Calvin Robinson.We've had on numerous times before, and we're looking at the state of the church, where the church fit into a 21st century society. We go through a number of the issues which Calvin has spoken about regularly on GB News and on his social media platforms. The whole issue of marriage and the Church of England recognizing LGBT unions, whatever alphabet mix you want, it is now recognized and blessed, although they don't actually carry out a ceremony, so it seems to be a fudge on the issue. So we discuss that and some of the other issues. I know Calvin has talked a lot about the buffer zones and the prayer being illegal outside abortion centres. And then we look at, actually looking ahead, why a revived church, a church which is on fire, a church which is speaking truth, why that is important for, if you're not a Christian, actually for all society, not just Christians, because that has a positive effect on society, speaking truth and bringing,[1:31] looking at issues of right and wrong, I guess, in a time where there's a lot of confusion about what actually is right, what actually is wrong. And the church, I think, can be a moral guidance, a framework once again for our society. And I think many of us would see that there is a place to be had, even if we are not regular churchgoers or don't call ourselves Christians. There is a positive impact and element to our society from that. So I know you'll enjoy Calvin, as much as I enjoyed chatting with them.[2:05] Calvin Robinson, Father Calvin Robinson. It is wonderful to have you back with us.Thank you so much for your time once again.
 
Anytime Peter, how are you?
Absolutely wonderful. All the better for seeing you and hopefully you'll shed some light on a lot of the chaos has been happening, but we'll get into that.@CalvinRobinson, obviously, is your handle across all platforms.People can also sign up to your sub-stack and get your regular e-mails giving your thoughts.Of course, Calvin can be found every Sunday on GB News at 3pm.Or you can see him in the flesh at his church in the morning.So you can get him twice in the day. Your church isn't live streamed as yet, Calvin, no?
No, it's rooted in place. People have got to be there.
 
I do like that. Personal contact is good.Don't go down that, because then people just stay at home. So stick with the one-on-one contact.Calvin, initially when we had talked a couple weeks ago, we wanted to look at what was happening, I guess, termed as the Asbury Revival over in the States and talk about, I guess, renewal in general.[3:15] But maybe before that we could go back and start with maybe where the Church is at in the UK.And one thing which certainly has struck out with me was what happened back in February.The Guardian's headline. We'll use the Guardian because that's, I think, what the Church of England like to support and promote, and are more worried about column inches in the Guardian. But anyway, it's the Church of England votes in favour of blessing for same-sex unions. Passing of motion at General Synod represents profound shift in Church's stance on homosexuality. Do you want to give us your thoughts on, kind of, that event and that quite a large departure from traditional Church of England Anglican teaching.
 
Yeah, well, the Church is saying it's not a departure in teaching.They've said they're not changing doctrine, which is fluffy to say the least because we in the[4:13] Church of England tend to believe lex horrende, lex credendi, like you are what you believe, you practice what you believe and you believe what you practice. And so if the Church of England is essentially saying that you can bless same-sex unions, some of which will be sexual in nature, the Church of England is now saying you can bless sin, which is an oxymoron, you can't ask God to bless something he has said is sinful. But at Synod it was voted in favour with a majority, that the Church of England can now, priests within the Church of England can now bless couples that come to them that may be in a civil partnership or may be in a secular gay marriage and those individuals within that relationship can now be blessed. So basically people will go to the registry office, they'll get their same-sex marriage under law and then they'll go to church and have that marriage blessed. That is wrong. It is not in line with Christian teaching. It's[5:10] causing the Church of England to enter apostasy essentially because these bishops are heretics, and it's a problem for even the very good sound priests in the Church of England who do want to remain orthodox because we are, as Anglicans, we're an apostolic faith so we believe that each congregation serves a bishop and each, well the bishop serves each congregation, so you can't separate one from the other. You can't say well I'll be a good priest in my little parish because that's congregationalism. That means you're not respecting obedience to your bishop and not seeing him as your servant leader. So if the bishop is a heretic, it makes you a heretic. That's the problem people are facing. So many parishes are going to have to consider now do they want to leave the Church of England because the Church of England has already left them.
 
And we'll get into that schism in a little bit but I mean marriage has...always been, traditionally, been a lifelong union between one man and one woman.And it does seem, I know, I know, Calvin I'm only following you, so that's bad.[6:19] I've seen your show, Calvin, much worse. But how can they say that's not a change? Because if the church is saying basically we're not actually carrying out a ceremony between two men or two women but we will still bless it. There isn't much, it seems to be just semantics really.
It is semantics. That is exactly the right word for it. They think they're being clever because they're trying to please everybody. You know you can't please everybody because what you end up doing is upsetting everybody. But worse than that you can't compromise on the truth.And the truth sometimes is black and white. Most things in life are quite nuanced but the truth, isn't always, because we believe as Christians that the truth is universal and Jesus Christ is the truth himself, right? It's not this case of what we see in modernity where everyone has their own perspective and everyone owns their individual truth. That doesn't play out in Christianity. So what the Church is doing is saying, well societal norms have changed, they've adjusted over time and the world around us has become liberal progressive and the faith is rooted in time and place and is very static and traditionalist and[7:33] old-fashioned, how do we marry the two? Well, we can't institute gay marriages because that's an oxymoron, but what about if we bless same-sex marriages that have been done elsewhere? That's good compromise, right? And of course it's all misguided. It might be well-intentioned, might not be, but it's just impossible. It's an impossibility.
 
Because up to this point, Church's teaching would would have been that there are areas of sin.You can read your Bible and you can make whole lists of them.[8:05] I've just been sitting in a series with Jay John going through the 10 commandments and those are a list of rules which are for our own good really for society.But the church seems to have kind of completely abandoned that.And I know internally the church has had this the hierarchy, I guess, this struggle of where they go on this issue, and I guess that maybe Justin Welby and others would have liked to kick this even further into the long grass. So I'm wondering what kind of pushed them to actually make a decision, because often the church of England are very good at not actually making decisions.
 
Yeah, they're really good at fluff, you know, Anglican fudge they call it, but this had to happen because the living in love and faith process is what they called it over the last six or seven years they've been discussing how to be more inclusive to the LGBTQ plus IAA plus plus plus community and just that just that sentence alone is problematic because the church of course is inclusive it's you know the church is welcoming to everyone because we are all sinners and they keep forgetting this that well how can we be more welcoming to this particular community and it doesn't make sense like that it's a false premise. They need to focus on talking about sin more and you're right the commandments are rules by which we should be living our lives. The[9:32] Commandments are set down by God as any father would to his children to say this is how, these are the boundaries, you may play within these boundaries, if you leave these boundaries you will get hurt. That is what sin is, it's separation of us from God, and that's hurtful for us as well as for God right? So we, should be trying not to do that, we should be trying not to sin. But we don't talk about sin because it's seen as derogatory. Every time I bring it up on my own, well I won't talk about specifics, but whenever we talk about sin people say silly things like,you can't call that sin. It's legal. It's like, what? That sentence again doesn't make any sense.By saying it's a sin isn't me saying it should be illegal or it shouldn't be legal. It's me saying that it's something that is harmful for us and we should avoid it if possible. But we are all sinners because we are fallen individuals and we should acknowledge that we all do sin. And that is that's not okay but we can repent and we can change our ways. But people these days don't want to repent and they don't want to change their ways, they want to live in sin.
It is interesting that people pick and choose how sin or legality work because you look back at things which are, were illegal, you look back at slavery and we see that as abhorrent and yet it was accepted legally. So it's interesting how often people pick and choose what is accepted or not accepted.[10:56] That's a very good point. I'm going to use that one in the future, actually.That's a very good point. Because it's so annoying when people say, you can't say that homosexual marriage is a sin, or that homosexual sex is a sin.First of all, I'm not saying anything about homosexuals in particular.Usually I'm talking about fornication. I'm labelling the sin.I'm using the name of the sin. It's sex outside of marriage, which is sinful.[11:15] And that is the same for heterosexuals as it is for homosexuals.But they really get hung up on that word sin.So we need to talk about it more so that people understand it and realise that it's not us judging other people, it's not us pointing a finger that way, it's us doing this and saying yes we are sinners too, we're all sinners, let's help each other sin less.
I guess a conversation the church doesn't really have is the whole issue of the stability that a lifelong marriage between a man and woman brings to not only to small areas of culture but to society in general.To me it would be, if they're looking for popularity I guess, it is an open goal to talk about the benefits that a male and female bring to that lifelong and then in regards to raising children and that structure and the benefit to society if not, to me that would be a open goal if the church wants to kind of be more political I guess with the public and engage with them and that would be a good policy.
Well it's right there, so it doesn't matter which church we're talking about.If we're talking about the Church of England it's in the Book of Common Prayer, if we're talking about the Catholic faith it's in the Catechism of the Catholic faith, in that marriage is between one man and one woman, it's heterosexual and monogamous for the reasons of procreation, for the begetting of children, so that God can bless you with offspring.[12:44] That is a good thing. For the purposes of fornication without sin, so that you can have sex without it being sinful, so that you receive that grace.[12:55] And for the betterment of the community, for society as a whole, like we all benefit when people raise families because that's how our society is built upon.First community we all belong to is the family and then we have the wider community and then we have our nationhood and these things are all good things, good things in the eyes of God, like objectively good. And so you know marriage is for a reason. God hasn't said it must be one man and one woman because I'm bigoted and I want human beings to be bigoted. He said this is good, this is ordered, this is a way for you to live your lives for the benefit of yourselves, the people around you and me.
You mentioned inclusivity a bit earlier and that term, it seems to be that we are misunderstanding terms.I hear inclusivity a lot. You hear love being put out as well.Love is love and God is love and we can all love each other as seemingly a green light to whatever you want.Is there a way that we can kind of reclaim some of these terms, so to understand once again what they truly mean?
Yeah, of course, because this is what the left does, isn't it? They twist language.They never actually outright lie. They use half-truths to make a lie seem real. And so[14:12] when they talk about love, quite often, they're talking about lust. And it's the Hollywood version of love, right? That you're getting into a relationship with someone, and then have sex and that's it, that's the epitome of love and that's the pinnacle right there that we're all striving towards. Actually no, love doesn't mean that in a Christian context. Agape is the term used quite often but there are[14:32] actually multiple terms for love in the Bible and it means it's something that's sacrificial, it's self-giving, it's willing the good of the other. It's not about you and people forget that quite often in this individualistic societies.But I love him or I love her therefore I should be able to, I have a right to. No you're putting yourself first and foremost that's not love that's something else that's your own desire and desires often lead us to sin and love is completely the opposite of sin and when we say love is love it's a free for all isn't it because well if love is love it doesn't matter what the terms are there are no boundaries but of course there are boundaries on everything in life including love. And for me love should be in terms of marriage at least between a man and a woman. But that's not to say there aren't different types of love.I love you as a brother, I love you know my friends in a different way to how I would expect to love my wife right. And likewise you love your children in a different way to how you love your spouse. So there are lots of different levels of love but even then there are boundaries on those different relationships and what I really struggle with at the moment in the LGBTQ plus III community is that they want to say that a sexual love, a desire, a lustful[15:53] relationship is appropriate for anyone without boundaries and we all know where that heads if it's fine for two men or three men or four men or two men and eight women, whatever.[16:04] Why is it not fine for a man and a child? And that's where it's all heading. That's where liberalism ends up. That's where the devil is pushing from. It's paedophilia is what they're aiming for. And people say, that's homophobic. You're saying you're conflating homosexuality with paedophilia. I'm not at all. I'm not in any way, shape, or form conflating the two.I'm saying this liberal progressive movement, this work movement of love is love, of boundaryless, borderless love, results in paedophilia. And that's very different.
Well, picking up on that term and what we've seen with the drag shows, and you were highlighting one of them recently, but that whole, I mean I'm surprised, although I maybe shouldn't be, but I still try and be surprised at the lack of response from churches, that was Turning Point UK, so it is a secular organization. You've got you and Lozza and others[17:01] actually standing up and opposing this, getting a report on GB News. It's kind of, you're looking around thinking, well, I'm just waiting for the local church to come in and actually get involved, but that's not happening. What has that been like as you've kind of campaigned on some of these issues without, probably with silence from the church. Tell us about that.
Even worse than silence, the church is getting involved, but on the other end.St James's Piccadilly hosted a drag queen in their sanctuary, like a sacred space, and they're putting a scantily dressed bloke, dressed as a woman, which is an affront to women in the first place, but they're putting them there where Christ should be, by the altar essentially. And it's just, I don't want to use hyperbole, but it's demonic is what's happening here.And the church is on the wrong side of this argument. And even this week, over the last couple of days, my Easter special got cancelled, right?And I do Easter specials and Christmas specials every year. I think it's a time when I'm able to use the platform that I've been gifted to proclaim the gospel, to promote the message of salvation and redemption and to talk about Jesus Christ explicitly without having to talk about other political issues that I have to do on my normal show.It's just a show entirely about Christ.[18:19] And it got cancelled by a church because a gay member of the secular choir in the church said to the priest, we can no longer sing here if Calvin Robinson is coming here, he's a homophobe.Now, rather than the priest using that as a teaching opportunity to say, no, Calvin's not a homophobe, the things he says there, you're misunderstanding.He's a Christian.He adheres to the Christian values on sex and sexuality. And let me talk to you about them." Instead of doing that, he said, "'Oh, let me talk to my bishop or his ordinary.'" He spoke to his ordinary.Between them, they decided it would be too much hassle to have our Easter special film there.So essentially they said, "'Look, you cannot proclaim the gospel this Easter because a gay member of a secular choir got upset.'" And that's how the woke mob works, isn't it?[19:02] I think, was it one of the Christmases you were in there? Was it the Oratory and, where is it, South Kent, isn't it?But tell me about those experiences, because you're bringing something quite different and quite fresh to the TV screens, to a news organization that wouldn't traditionally, or may have, songs of praise, which kind of ticks that religious box.But what you're doing with those kind of specials seems to be more intentional.And tell us about you personally, why you want to do that and[19:39] maybe some of the positive and negative responses you've had.
Yeah, I mean, this is what I'm called to do, right? So the whole reason I'm on television is because I see it as a platform for public ministry. And the reason I'm not on TV full time is because it's not a career for me, it's not an ambition. However, I do feel like I've been gifted the platform of television and social media and all these things where I have a following is so that I can proclaim the truth. I can talk about our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ for his benefit and for theirs, right? And so for me these specials are well they're special, they are the reason I do the rest of the stuff that I do on TV because it gives me the opportunity to do these things and the response is, mostly positive. It really is. People are happy to see Jesus in the mainstream again and to see the Christian faith normalized and for someone to be unashamedly Christian and not embarrassed about their faith, that helps people in their faith and it also brings people to the faith. So we're evangelizing as well as encouraging. That is, you know, that's why I'm here, that's why I'm doing what I'm doing. Of course there are a minority of negative responses and they tend to be the ones that stick in my head because as human beings, as flawed human beings, that's what happens isn't it? You can have a hundred positive responses that one negative is what you remember but, You know, the[21:01] Catholics, for my last special, the one you mentioned at the oratory, the most beautiful, I think it's one of the most beautiful churches in the country, the Catholics were saying, why have you let this Protestant in your sanctuary? Firstly, I'm an Anglican, not a Protestant[21:13] And then the Protestants were saying, how dare he pray to a saint that he's invoking the saints?This is not scriptural. And so the Protestants on one side, the Catholics on the other side, and I'm like, look, I'm here using a national platform to try and proclaim the gospel and and spread the message of Jesus Christ.And you guys, the Christians, call it demon-pleased. How do you think we're going to get this message out to the rest of the world? It's like we fight and bicker amongst ourselves endlessly.It's tiresome. We should be united in Christ.[21:45] There's another issue that you've touched on on GB News as well, which is the sanctity of life and the buffer zones around, which probably is more a free speech issue than a pro-life issue.And I know you've interviewed the lady who was arrested and arrested once again.And that's just gone through parliament last week where they rejected any thought that prayer should be legal.No, no way, we'll defeat that amendment, kick it out.I mean, how, again, you're bringing that and it's interesting where maybe if you look at the States, the debate is a lively public debate where in the UK it seems to be a very lacklustre, extremely private debate.And I'm wondering why it's been so, I guess, marginalizing conversation.[22:39] I think because people are conflating those two issues, free speech and abortion, right?So I can address this from a free speech perspective and say that no thought should ever be a crime.And that Isabel Vaughan Spruce, who is a fantastic lady, who I've had on my show a couple of times, She's been arrested twice for praying silently within the vicinity of one of theseabortion centres when it was closed, when there were no other people around. So people can't say well she's harassing people or she's intimidating people because that's a lie. She's literally stood there silently minding her own business, praying in her head because she thoroughly believes in the power of prayer and she believes what's going on in the centres is evil and should be stopped and therefore she's praying to God for support for these women who think it's their only option. Of course it isn't. Now she could be actively protesting, she could be stood outside the abortion centre with a placard saying don't go in. She could be preventing people, she could be intimidating people. She's not doing any of that. She could even be there handing out literature offering these women alternative options. We know that's been successful in the past.[23:42] And that women have been so grateful for the opportunity to discover another option that hasn't been presented to them up until that point, and they've gone on to raise children that they're very happy to have in their lives. She's not doing any of that, she's just silently praying in her I had. So I can address it saying look this is an issue of freedom of thought, freedom of religion, freedom of expression, even freedom of association. But then the naysayers on the other side will say no, this is about intimidation, harassment, this is about her impeding on someone else's right to abortion. And it always comes down to what they're actually protecting is the killing of unborn children. They don't care about the other freedoms and they want to balance that one. And it's not a balance, there's no balance there because, no one's preventing these women from abortion. As abhorrent as it is, it's[24:29] about their feelings as they go to initiate this abortion.That's what this is all about. It's about someone's freedom of religion versus someone's taking offense to someone's religion. And religion is losing.
 
I mean I had this conversation with a church leader and I should have just walked away quickly, but I wanted to delve a bit deeper and at the end of the conversation, a very pleasant conversation, but he said you're probably would be like one of those right-wing American Christians who would be shouting and abusing the women going in. And that made me think kind of how far do you go in doing what's right? If you see something wrong happening then do you actually intervene and with the case talked about it was just silent prayer, which is again free speech, thought's been legal. But actually I thought well as a Christian how kind of how far do you go in making a stand against what's wrong? I don't know what I'm not calling for aggression or violence, absolutely not, I'm just trying to work that out as we change in society and move further and further away from what is true. How do you see the response of those of us who are Christians?
Well the fact that that[25:58] minister said that to you, that you'd probably be one of those right-wing Americans. It just shows, how far the faith has shifted, doesn't it? Like he should be, as a minister of the faith, he should be doing anything he can to save human life because all human life is sacred. And that's the message of the gospel. I despair at these people. I lost my train of thought on the question because I'm so annoyed at these so-called ministers. But I mean, it's not even happening in this country.In the UK we've never had harassment outside abortion centres. I have seen it in America, granted, but we're not American and harassment in this country is already illegal. Therefore, what is this legislation for? You rightly pointed out that the amendment to remove prayer, to remove silent prayer from this bill, was rejected. So they explicitly want outlaw prayer.Is it because these dark forces are playing and they understand the power of prayer and they don't, don't want Christians praying. Because it is about Christians as well. We see that, Muslims in this country are supported in a way that Christians are not. You can just scuff the corner of a page on a Quran and your child is receiving death threats, the mother is apologizing in front of the imams, backed up by the police, and the child is suspended from school. Yet a Christian cannot silently pray. This is a direct attack on God, is what this is. And our parliamentarians are a part of the problem.[27:20] It's curious that you have a platform on a news channel, just like BBC or Sky, and then you've got GB News, and it's not a Christian channel in any shape or form, and yet GB News seems to have a greater understanding of right and wrong than many of our churches. I mean, how have you found, because you're given license to speak, I'm sure GB News is not perfect, nothing is, but you're given leeway and freedom to address these issues where probably the church maybe down the road would ban even any conversation about it. What does that feel like, that platform that you have?
That's an interesting way to put it, because I'm a pessimist, so I tend to think I'm held back, I'm restricted all the time.I'm constantly fighting to talk about things that people don't want me to talk about, and to get guests on that people don't want me to have on.It's a battle every single day. So I think it's nice of you to put it that way in that it is important for me to recognize that I do get a lot of conversations out there that wouldn't be had elsewhere and wouldn't be had otherwise.[28:37] I try to at least be on the side of God, right? I wouldn't say it the other way around, I would say God's on my side.I think that's arrogant. I try to be on the side of God. And if we're on God's side, it's the old adage, isn't it?If God is with us, who can be against us? So as long as we are doing what we're doing for the greater glory of God, then we can't go wrong.[28:56] Exactly, but no, I think you maybe see things differently when you're in the mix and you realize the difficulties possibly in putting something out, the public get to see what goes out and they see that positive message where you're maybe thinking actually that could have been more in that or we could have an extra but I mean God takes what goes out and uses for his purpose, doesn't affect people and if that's the only place they're seeing it then that's extremely positive.
Yeah, I think you're right there. Thank you for that. I needed to hear that.
Going on to just we, I started on mentioning Asbury and I was blown away actually by watching Tucker Carlson, Steve Bannon, programs that are not Christian actually having whole pieces on it. And I think War Room had like a four minute beginning intro of just Asbury Church service, I thought this is really curious watching the secular media promoting what is happening in churches. And I mean what were your thoughts as a Christian and as a journalist looking at,[30:07] I guess that phenomenon, and many of our viewers will not be Christian and they may have different thoughts on it, but it was something new, refreshing, seeing the church packed, seeing the, miles long of traffic of people wanting to get there, because something special was happening there. Yeah, what were your thoughts looking at it?
 
It did look special, that's a good word for it.It looked important, it looked significant somehow. They were all very young and it wasn't liturgical in any way, shape or form and it wasn't organized, it was just organic. It felt to me like the Holy Spirit was present, I'm sure it was. And I think, I hope that's the start of something bigger, a bigger movement in the States because we need a revival, especially Generation Z which is a generation, and I'm generalizing here, that is wrapped up in itself, an entitled generation of individualists. They need a reminder of something transcendental that is bigger than themselves, they need to be reconnected with God and whatever shape that takes I don't think it really matters.[31:16] There's also a growing traditionalist movement, especially amongst Catholics, so that's entirely on the opposite end of the spectrum to Asbury, but if what's going on in Asbury, that charismatic movement, if that does something and connects people to Christ, then great!
Because I guess renewals throughout history never, are always different from previous and I guess if we were sitting planning one, it could be so different.But it's interesting to see that, how they can often be so different when you read through church history and see how God has moved at different times in special ways.They always seem to meet a hunger for something above, something greater than us and to give hope.[32:06] But yeah, I've just been interested and I've gone back and been reading some of the great revivalist evangelists I guess and been excited by what God has done in past generations and how it changes society.
 
Absolutely and society needs changing right now. I talked quite a bit about how the Christian faith thrives under persecution. I think in the West now we're seeing intolerance verging on persecution but once it reaches there something will happen.At the same time we're seeing the churches in the West crumbling. The big C church will never fall because Christ won't let it but the institutions can. That's the Church of England, that's the Episcopal Church in America, these churches are fallen because they're made up of fallen individuals who seem to be at the moment trying to appease the liberal progressive secular norms around them.And so as these western churches die and as we become secularized and then persecuted.[33:11] We will start to see more of these revival movements because there is a god-shaped hole in people's hearts that needs to be filled and people are latching on wherever they can to things that just don't fill, can't fill that hole. The only thing that can fill it is God. So eventually it all comes back round to him.
What are your thoughts there? Probably people have seen what's happened over there and thought, well, I'm not a Christian, I don't go to church, it's absolutely nothing to do with me, I don't care what happens.How does a revival or renewal, a church being vibrant on fire, speaking truth, how does that affect or fit into society?
Well, I mean, this is it, this is it, right? right? People talk about the cultural wars but this is a spiritual war. I don't think people can truly understand what's going on unless they have the faith and there's no way to describe, there's no way to talk about it. It's like the matrix, right? You take the blue pill or the red pill and people who take the blue pill just they're ignorant and they cannot get it and I'm not saying that as an insult, it's just there's a wall there whereas people who take the red pill, people who have faith in Christ can see what's going on and it is it's wicked, it's evil, it's demonic and we need to fight against it. And it's not just about diversity, inclusion, equality, it's about[34:27] replacing what's good, what's beautiful, what's true, replacing God with falsehoods, with a false narrative, with the devil, essentially.And so, to the non-Christians who are watching, I suppose I'm praying for you, is the message I would say.And I don't mean that in a patronizing way, I mean that in a way that I hope your eyes are opened and your ears are opened to Christ, just as people who watch your show, who consider themselves awake to what's going on around them and have problems, struggle talking to normies or NPCs, about COVID or Brexit or lockdowns or vaccines, whatever.[35:08] Or the Ukraine.It's difficult to have conversations with people whose eyes and ears are closed.And that's how I feel at the moment about people who are not Christian, because this is the biggest spiritual war of a long, long time, and we're all in the middle of it.[35:25] And I guess when you were saying you're a pessimist, I get that, but then from my point of view as a Christian, that's when it gets quite exciting because there isn't a step-by-step plan because it's so bad.And you're thinking, where do we go from here as a society? And I think that's why something, what happened in Asbury was exciting because you kind of look at our politicians and I remember growing up and seeing so many Christian politicians, strong leaders, and we don't have that anymore.So you look at wet Welby, you're thinking, well, that's not gonna provide much direction and guidance. So you're thinking, well, actually, the only way this can happen is God. And I think that's why being in a difficult, dark situation is exciting.
Yeah, and there's two sides to this. So on the one side, people want to defend Western culture, and rightly so, because it's a great thing, because it was built on Christianity.However, it isn't Christianity. It is separate, and Western society can, and probably will fall, but that's okay, because another society will rise in its wake.[36:37] But the thing we have to fight for isn't Western society, it's the Christian faith.We have to fight for our Christian values, Because when society does fall, they are what will sustain us.Christ in the mass will sustain us, and our faith in him will sustain us.So we have to get past the idea of clinging onto the worldly goods that we see around us.[36:59] What, it's, it's, it's sorry, I've lost my train of thought...When you look at-
 
Sorry, just to add to that before we move on.Because the great thing about that is, because even if we do lose this battle, We might not, we could still turn it around and woke could become a thing of the past and Western society could become strong again and the British empire could be revived.You know, we can dream, but even if it doesn't, even if all this stuff crumbles like Rome fell.[37:26] We're only losing the battle. The war has already been won. Christ defeated the devil. Christ conquered evil for us and he died for our sins and was resurrected for our salvation. So that is the good news, that it doesn't really matter.
 
Yeah, my God said I will build my church and the gates that will not prevail. So that's what happens in the end, irrelevant to the efforts of the enemy.I've talked to many people in, I guess, the conservative movement, and many of them would talk about, well, they're a Christian, they're a cultural Christian, and they believe certain truths. Obviously, as a commentator, that's probably something you've come across a lot. Do you want to compare that, a cultural Christian, whether that's a Christian at all, and actually a personal faith and what that means.
Yeah, I don't really think there is such a thing as a cultural Christian, it's just a Brit, right, because British values are built on Christian values and they are aligned but they're not identical, just as Western society was built on Christianity.[38:36] You're either a Christian or you're not, right, so you either believe that Jesus Christ was truly man and truly God and died on the cross for us. Or you don't. You either believe in the resurrection and we'll have eternal life in him or you don't. There is no cultural element to it.[38:52] I mean you can turn up to church and enjoy the hymns as much as you like but if you don't believe what the songs are about it doesn't really matter.
 
Can I ask you about the split you touched on at the beginning, maybe it's something to end on, the split we have seen within the church where parts of the worldwide Anglican community have basically said, oh this is not biblical, enough is enough, and have drawn the line. There is a tension there between, I guess, the liberal, progressive, woke, Western church and the more traditional church of Africa, of Latin America, Asia. Tell us about that tension because I think often we can see what's happening in the Synod or the Church of England and think, well, it's all going to pot, but there are those bright sparks of tension desiring truth.
Oh yeah, absolutely. The majority of people in the Church are faithful and the majority of churches are orthodox. It's just this minority in the West, England, Wales, Scotland, America, Canada, and Australia that are falling more rapidly because they've left behind their orthodoxy.[40:09] So in Anglicanism for example, the Church of England has entered apostasy now, it is promoting heresy as acceptable. So the Church of England has left the wider Anglican communion and we see this manifesting itself in several ways, but GAFCON, which represents 80% of Anglicans around the world, has said, well you guys have left us, therefore we now renounce you. So we don't see the Archbishop of Canterbury as the first among equals, he's no longer our leader. So now we're entering a period where conversations are being had with primates, bishops and church leaders around the world, saying do we need to elect a new leader? Do we need a leader at all? How is this all going to work?And there's a meeting next month, the next GAFCON, which is the fourth global meeting in Rwanda. I'm going to head out there and see what's what and see what they decide. But it's going to be very interesting and very exciting. Though it's not just the Anglican Church, you know, the German Catholic bishops are trying to copy with their same-sex blessings and heretical views and the the Pope needs to have a strong firm hand and say, no, this is, This is you're excommunicated, be gone with you.[41:16] Because there is an outcome of punishment that does come on. I mean even when it talks about the Lord's Supper, communion, remembering Jesus' death, and it talks about judgment upon the church, judgment upon yourself, if you enter into that without reverence and without recognizing your sin.So I guess at some point there is that punishment.[41:48] And not that I want you to end on full fire and brimstone, but I'm curious kind of how that plans out because as British living here, this is our country.We've grown up with churches and seen them slide into, I guess, depravity often.But I guess there is a line where God says, enough is enough.
 
Yeah absolutely and false teachers and false prophets will be punished more than everyone else because they're leading people astray and that's the issue there. Our shepherds were supposed to lead our sheep right and if you lead people the wrong way that's gonna upset God because he wants everyone to love him and he wants to love everyone. So I mean I'm trying not to put a negative spin on it but I'm trying to see what's the positive of that in that we are called to be good Christians and good shepherds and good sheep and we all have a responsibility. So if we see that our deacons, priests and bishops are leading people astray, we can hold them to account because they are servant leaders and we can remind them to be rooted in the scriptures and rooted in the tradition and the doctrines of the church and not to be chasing societal norms. And you know, none of us can do this on our own.
Calvin, thank you for your time. It's always good to talk to you.[43:13] Im sure you get, was it GB views or GB news? That you get responses from viewers and I'd encourage the viewers to certainly tune in and give their responses because I'm sure part of you being on GB news, part of the enjoyment of it is having that interaction with the viewers.
I do love the engagement with the viewers. It's fantastic. One thing I miss about radio actually, being able to have them live on the show, that kind of thing is brilliant.But yes, thank you. It's always a pleasure talking to you.
Not all. Thank you, Calvin.

Karen Siegemund - Unpacking CPAC

I had a great time at CPAC and made lots of new acquaintances while catching up with many old friends too, including our guest this episode. Karen Siegemund is the President of American Freedom Alliance and I had the privilege of meeting her at the 'AFA Propaganda conference' in LA last year. Karen has been a regular face at CPAC where this was my first time, so she joins us live to compare notes and to give her thoughts on this years 'Conservative Political Action Conference' which was held in Washington DC. It was a packed 4 days attended by all the nations top conservative faces, featuring special guests such as Senator Marsha Blackburn, Congressman Matt Gaetz, Congresswoman Lauren Boebert, Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene and Lt. Governor Mark Robinson with the memorable event concluding with a 90 minute key note speech by the man himself, President Donald J Trump.As the daughter of a man who grew up in Hitler’s Berlin, Dr Karen Siegemund has always been keenly aware of how precarious freedom is, and how tyranny typically begins not with a revolution, but with a slow erosion of rights and freedoms. For this reason, Karen has dedicated her life to fighting against this erosion on every level.During the Cold War, Dr. Siegemund worked in the field of underwater acoustics, developing new sonar systems and testing them during sea trials around the world.After the defeat of the Soviet Union she turned her sights first to earning a Master’s Degree in International Relations, then a doctorate degree in “Education and American Culture.” Recognizing that only with an educated citizenry could we hope to maintain our freedoms, she became an educator; for over ten years she has taught in a number of areas, from Latin and French to Science and Mathematics, at the middle school, high school and University levels. Along with these specific academic disciplines, of course, she strives to educate her students about the values that make Western Civilization generally, and America specifically, as exceptional as we are.As another result of the recognition that totalitarianism creeps in with baby steps, and that our media has been complicit in its advance rather than the bulwark against it that it us supposed to be, Karen had founded and was president of “Rage Against the Media,” an activist group in Los Angeles which fought against the propagandistic nature of our news media.Since becoming the President of the American Freedom Alliance, she’s been part of the fight against a longer list of encroachments on our freedom, and has been hosting exceptional events ranging from World-Class Conferences to Literary Cafes, Lectures to Movie Premieres, all on topics relating to Freedom, how it’s being attacked and how we can preserve it.She has also paid a price for the position she takes in defense of Western Civilization and for her political activity outside the classroom. Karen became a victim of the very “cancel culture” she warned about when her teaching position at a local private school was not renewed. Among countless articles, the Epoch Times ran a feature article about her, and she was a guest on The Huckabee Show, a frequent speaker at clubs, organizations and events, and is published in a wide range of publications.The American Freedom Alliance is a non-partisan, non-profit organization which promotes, defends and upholds Western values and ideals. AFA sponsors conferences, publishes opinions, distributes information and creates networking groups to identify threats to Western civilization and to motivate, educate and unite citizens in support of that cause.American Freedom Alliance linksWebsite https://americanfreedomalliance.org/YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC_mKQpt648ouOD7SuotFhSAGETTR https://gettr.com/user/americanfreedomallianceFacebook https://www.facebook.com/AmericanFreedomAlliance/Twitter https://twitter.com/AFAllianceVimeo https://vimeo.com/afaBroadcast live 13.3.23
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[0:22] Karen Siegemund, thank you so much for coming on slightly earlier today. Thank you.My pleasure. Delighted to be with you, Peter.
 
Karen and I had a good catch up, having only met in June for the first time at the American Freedom Alliance Conference Propaganda over in LA, where she had great speakers like Naomi Wolf, James O'Keefe, and many others, Alex Newman, James Wood, Elizabeth Sabaditsch-Wolf, and it goes on and on. She has so many conferences with some of the greatest guests, So I was absolutely overjoyed to catch up with her over the East Coast this time.East Coast is much closer for me, Karen.
Yes. Yeah, it's funny, either coast. It's always great to see you.And there's always great stuff going on one way or the other.[1:10] Absolutely. Now, we're just want to unpack CPAC. Obviously, we've both been there just a week or so ago.It has been a whole week since we saw each other, Karen. Time flies.
Yeah, I don't know how the time flies, yes.
So the AmericanFreedomAlliance.org is there on the screen. I encourage you to go have a look at it, have a look at the conferences they've had.Everything is available there on the website.Now, CPAC, it was my first time at CPAC. I don't think I dreamt about going, but I dreamed about going many times.Got that bad, which we have a feedback. But Karen has been, what, four times you told me before we went live, Karen.
Yes, this was my fourth.[2:01] So where, this was in DC. Where was it other years you've been or has always been in DC for you?
For me, I've only ever gone to the ones in DC. It's the nation's capital, seems to me that's where it's supposed to be. And of course, during COVID, they moved around as one does and did. You try to find pockets of freedom here and there, Texas, Florida, obviously.I think they had others internationally also, but to me, CPAC isn't CPAC unless you're in the, capital of the United States. Much as it's a swamp and we talk about all of that, but there's still people working very hard in the right direction, in the correct direction towards freedom, towards re-establishing a constitutional republic. So it's nice to be in the nation's capital and give them support and meet with them, there who are living right in the heart of it all and still doing the really awful, disgusting work that needs to be done.So I love it that it's in D.C. and I love the Gaylord.I think it's a tremendous venue.[3:05] It was, it was a wonderful venue and your drinks reception was also a wonderful event in the middle of that.But tell us for, I guess for those watching in the UK, we probably have 60% UK, 30% US, maybe around that split.I mean, tell us what kind of CPAC is about, because people in the UK, they think of political conferences and they're not really the most exciting or intriguing.And they're fairly dull and plodding along. CPAC is a little bit different. So let's start with CPAC, maybe the first time you went, what it was like?
 
Yeah, you know, it's funny when you think about conferences, generally conventions, you think that it's going to be a little bit stodgy and wonky and you know, all the political in the know people. But while there are political in the know people, It really is more like one little rally after another, culminating of course this time and the last time I had gone too with President Trump.But there's just tremendous energy. It's really, it's the who's who of political activism[4:15] and excitement and energy.The first time, maybe it's not the first time I mixed them all up, but I've seen Newt Gingrich, I've seen Sarah Palin.I had seen Donald Trump before. I'd seen Mitt Romney back when we really mourned,we still mourn that he lost, obviously, while we know a little bit more about him than we did at that time.That was a very painful thing. But it's really, if you are involved in the political scene in the U.S. at all, and that includes activism as well as politics, it really is the place to go.Because there's there's I would say three main aspects to the whole thing.One is the main stage in the main ballroom where the speakers are.And sometimes those are panels and sometimes it's more serious than others.But it's always got this high energy rally sense.Then downstairs is[5:09] where if you work in this arena, you can sponsor a booth, a table, you can make people aware of what you do, you can sell books, you can show videos, you can hand out t-shirts and stuff.So you increase your visibility, build up your mailing list, and that was always very exciting too. Then I would add there's media row, which is really where much of the activity actually happens. There's radio stations, there's TV stations, there's networks. And in the past, we had had Fox News, we had had Breitbart, we had had Town Hall as major sponsors of all of this.[5:51] There were more big names and also small names. If you're local and you just have a show you want to promote, you'd be there.This time, I still would contend that Radio Row was the place to be.It's where most of the action was, most of the energy was. There were smaller podcasters and so on as before, but not Breitbart, not Town Hall, not Fox.One of the more interesting ones was the new state of China Republic.I will get the letters all messed up, but the organization that's really trying to restore China to have legitimate rule that's not by the Chinese Communist Party.But then the biggest, the loudest voice at CPAC, the most energizing, engaging, really the hub of all the energy and action was Bannon's War Room that was set up.Luckily at the far end, if he hadn't been at the far end, nobody would have been able to get through.And that's, that honestly, I don't know if you felt the same way, but that to me was the hub of all the energy.[7:02] I agree. Let me just before I get on there, it was the NFSC, New Federal State of China, and they had a fantastic stage set up there in Media Row, interviewing a lot of people, and it's interesting that pushback against the CCP, which obviously Bannon will be doing that regularly as well. But you're right, it was sometimes you couldn't get up and down that that corridor because everyone wanted to see Mr. Stephen K. Bannon.And certainly so much energy, what he brings. And the thing that struck me most about Bannon was that he would do a two hour show, and then he would give maybe an hour and a half of actually talking to people, greeting them. And I think it was that connection which probably made it for a lot of people.They come as just a delegate to sit and listen, and they get to shake hands with Steve Bannon and chat to him, get their picture.[8:03] It was really gigantic. And there were people, because I walked by there, we all walked by there, and you would see the same people day after day after day, and his energy level was consistently high.Their adoration level was also consistently high, and that he gave his all to such an extent.And then as you say, that another hour and a half or two hours, he would shake hands, take photographs and actually have conversations as long as there were people who wanted to.And I heard over and over again, I don't know how I would have gotten through any of this without you.You are my source of optimism, of hope, of truth, of just everything.He's their touchstone.And it's quite remarkable that not only does he do this and of course, not all the information comes from him, but that he gives so many people a platform for their work, truth seeking, freedom seeking, and then that he gives of himself.It was really a startling thing because you expect kind of the energy to be in the ballroom area, the main speakers and so on, and that media row is gonna be media row, but that there was this,[9:23] the real epicenter was at War Room and quite remarkable. I also saw him on the main stage in the ballroom, same thing, tremendous energy there.Nigel Farage, of course, I also saw, just absolutely outstanding, very different.I also saw Kari Lake, a dynamic speaker, tremendous energy and various other speakers.But I think we go to CPAC to hear these great names, to see for our own eyes, instead of having the media sort of in the way, to capture the energy, to get a sense of what the conservative movement is like in the United States.Are we on our last gasp?Are we desperate?Are we despairing?[10:15] And I would have to say the answer to all that is absolutely not.The energy at CPAC was tremendous. Are we united in our thinking?No, so what? Nor should we be, we ought not be monolithic. We are independent thinkers and with independent thinkers, you get diversity of thought and of opinion as it should be.But I think overall, the optimism was high, even while recognizing what our major hurdles are.
Oh, completely. Karen, you're looking like you're enjoying the beautiful sunlight there.It looks like a gorgeous day where you are.Yeah, it's kind of astounding where I am. I am a little bit outside of Las Vegas.AFA, we just had an event in Las Vegas last night, in large part for our Angelenos who fled to Las Vegas.So they had wanted me to do an event there and I did, and it's always interesting seeing how refugees live and they have it pretty good, I must say.[11:27] But before getting the conservative mood, I mean, obviously you are extremely well-connected and it must be interesting to go to these events and of course, connect with many speakers.I mean, I know Bannon spoke in a previous event.I know he'll speak at future events and to see many of those people and you realize you're not to belittle or use a incorrect term,[11:53] but it is kind of family.You're there with people, like-minded people, you're connected with.And what's that like for you, knowing so many of those people, going to so many conferences, coming to an event like CPAC?
Well, it really is. It is like old home week. And I hadn't been in a while.And while I am deep in the conservative community,In Los Angeles, and conservative community and Republican community, I'm also an officer on the executive board of the Los Angeles County Republican Party, going to CPAC, every time I turn around, I'm with someone I know and or and or who knows me. And the warm embrace, I would say, of the of conservatives. That's another, that's certainly another reason to go. I hadn't really considered that when I decided to go. But being there, yes, we are the choir, but the, choir needs to be supported as well, because some of us do return to pretty hostile territory.And to know that we're not alone is such an important thing. And CPAC provides that, but I think also AFA and our conferences, which we'll talk about, that is in large part why we do those as well.We are not alone. And while we feel it's an uphill battle and we feel isolated, and of course, they do their best to isolate us.[13:21] Being among our family, really, and that you coming from the UK and Elizabeth coming from Austria and Nigel also from the UK, and we had others from Austria, others from Germany, from Sweden, from throughout Europe.[13:43] Is it politically expedient for them? I don't know, but I think it must be very warming and heartening for them, for you to see that we haven't rolled over here in the US and we are fighting and we're fighting as best we can.And we wanna reach out to you also and you're reaching out to us.The left is fighting globally.We have to fight globally as well.And I think it's just, you know, we talk about family. I have more love from the family that I met at CPAC than, you know, my literal family. And it's...
Well, I think that's probably true for lots of people.
 
And I'm not alone in that.
Yeah. Could I, obviously, the conservative movement, well, first, can I say, and blame Karen for me going there, it was Elizabeth Sabbaditsch-Wolf who first put the thought in my head, and then it was a 45 minute call with Karen that sealed the deal and persuaded me to come.So can I publicly thank you, Karen, for actually getting me there, because if it wasn't for that phone call, I would have missed it, so thank you.
You're very welcome, and I'm glad to have been part of your coming out, and I hope it's the first of many, because, I mean, you see who we are and what we are and what we do and the passion.There's such passion and such concern,[15:06] such global concern for the state of the world. And I would contend that any leftist such organization would not have, or event, would not have that deep love and caring that we have.I would contend that there would be more, and maybe we should do more of it too, conniving.And I don't know, I don't think they're driven by the same things we're driven by.
Oh, absolutely. Can I, the kind of stepping back while the conference ended with Trump, speaking President Trump and never having had that privilege and it was great to see such a giant in the conservative movement, in the Republican movement, worldwide, really, not just in the US and always good to be with someone who's hated so much by the left, which means he must be doing something right.But that was an hour and a half speech.[16:14] It was, I thought it was kind of two-sided, so it was maybe slightly subdued.And again, I haven't sat in the same room and had a Trump speech, but hit all the notes.And I ended up laughing through lots of it, thinking, oh, only Donald Trump could say that.What were your thoughts on that as an end point to the conference?[16:40] Oh, it was just absolutely spectacular. I have my concerns. I have my issues. I have my scepticisms. I hate to say this, but they all really went out the window. And really, they went out the window because the terrain we're fighting on right now is not normal terrain. It's really vicious.We have Biden, who in how long has just really destroyed the country?Our banking system is imploding, which we knew would happen.We've got we had energy independence. We no longer have it. We have food insecurity.People are just by every metric or this nation is going down the toilet from a very from, unprecedented high that we had under President Trump.And in that I would include strength of minorities, their jobs held and income and so on was tremendous.We had reverted back in large part to law and order.[17:45] Everything was humming along absolutely beautifully. And then it was broken with such deliberate malice and just in every way, the world is less safe.The country is less safe.Ukraine, China, you name it, the world is less safe at the hands ofwhoever's got the puppet strings of Joe Biden, because it's not really him. So the world is a less safe place, but they're playing by extremely ugly rules. And so when I have concerns about Donald Trump, this or that or the other thing, and maybe somebody might be better at reverting to politics as usual, the left is not playing politics as usual. And we can also not play as politics as usual. And there is no one who walks this earth who can say the things that Donald Trump says, who can get the energy that Donald Trump does, who can just stand his ground in the way that Donald Trump does. I had called him this before, not disparagingly at all. He is the alpha of all alphas. And we need an alpha, I believe very strongly in peace through strength, which is why we have war through weakness. We need strength back and nobody, nobody exudes strength like Donald Trump.[19:07] Absolutely. It doesn't matter from where I stand. Although it really didn't matter. None of the rest matters. We need a man like him and he is that man.When I saw him as a teen, he brought down the house. Yes, he was more subdued than at rallies, as he was the other day, more subdued than at rallies.And yet what he radiates is love of country, passion for the people.[19:41] A real horror at what has been done. I think in his first four years, he really didn't get a full handle on the viciousness, even though he was impeached once, he still didn't learn how evil they were.It took the second time for him really to open his eyes.I think coming in his second term, he will hit the ground running doing those things that a lot of us wished he would have done in the first go-around, more draining the swamp, more of being sceptical, of establishment hires and appointments, really bringing in from day one, hour one, minute one, those people who will seek to achieve the agenda that he has voiced, which is, you know, in shorthand, MAGA.It's the MAGA agenda, make America great again, that's it.As you may know, I've been saying over the last few years, we need to make America, America again.We have come so far from our founding principles.[20:45] And I think he willdo that as well. Are there other people who can do the politics better and more sane and maybe in a way that will attract more? I don't care. I just don't care. I don't. We need an alpha. We need a man who doesn't care. It's sort of like Ricky Gervais, you know.He came back for his last go around at the Golden Globes or whatever it was. I don't, care. And I think Donald Trump will be exactly that also. I'm going to do what the people voted for me to do, hired me to do, selected me to do, and the rest, I don't care. And that's exactly what we need right now. Because truly, is Joe Biden acting as if the people as if he cares about the people? And I,[21:32] let me rephrase that Trump not caring about what people, what the other side thinks. He cares deeply about the people. I should have been clear about that. I think Trump cares about the people, our well-being, the state of the nation infinitely more than Joe Biden in the remnants of his brain can do.
I wont even go in to that last point.[22:00] So I mean, yeah, I think Trump goes into this campaign with his eyes wide open and you're You're right. He has learned so much. And one of the things actually, which will stick out with me from his speech was the first five minutes where he didn't say anything.And to actually, it is a level of arrogance, but no showmanship, absolute confidence, knowing you have the room.And just to stand there for five minutes and just observe the crowd as everyone's on their feet cheering.[22:31] You obviously know whenever you go to a podium, you want to go and speak and that's your natural response.But just to take that applause, just, I love that showmanship, that just blew me away.
I do too, I do too. I mean, obviously it's CPAC, obviously it's friendly.He's used to it from rallies, but that really does radiate a kind of confidence.Again, the alpha, I'm here, I know you love me.And I would even go further and say, you love me for the right reasons.And I think that's really important. We do, we believe in make America great again.We believe that the world needs America to be what America has been.We see how people were thriving under his leadership during his four years and how people are suffering.So we knew coming out of Obama that we needed him. And I would contend that[23:31] we know even more so what happens when we walk away from those principles and how,[23:39] really perniciously evil, uncaring the left in this administration has been. East Palestine had just happened. The balloon had just sailed unmolested across our country and others as well.We know the world is a more dangerous place without him. We've learned these lessons.[23:59] And while we imagined that things would get worse, and we knew things would get worse, we have absolute evidence globally of how things have gotten worse.Who can repair it?He's the only guy. And again, it's not politics as usual. And during the course of the hour and a half, he hit on point after point after point after point.We won't allow children to have irreversible surgeries and other kinds of mutilations, I guess, one way or another, chemical or actual mutilations done to them.How can you not think that this is a wonderful thing, the thing that they're doing to children, that he will stop this?Marvellous. We'll get back to actual teaching in schools.[24:47] Energy independence, all of these things that he talked about, peace through strength, keeping our eye on China, not coddling, he was the only president who stood up to China and I think he will make us safer and by making the US safer, one does make the world safer.You need somewhere to turn.
 
I'm curious about people running against him.I heard Ron DeSantis speak at CNP in Miami just a few weeks earlier, absolutely fantastic speech, absolutely brilliant, watch what he's done governor in Florida and very exciting and he does what he says he will do. But he's still[25:33] fairly young and he's still got a lot of time ahead and I'm surprised that he has gone up against Trump and decided to make that a battle. I'm surprised Mike Pompeo is running against Trump and maybe Nikki Haley's different because probably no love lost there. But I'm obviously when was it was it 2016? There were like 17 Republican candidates, I think, initially, and then it got whittled down. And I'm curious to think why anyone would want to put themselves up against Trump, especially if you've got time on your side, and what's the rush?
Yeah, it's a great, it's a great question. It's one of the dividing issues among Republicans and the Republican Party. Does one revert back to politics as usual? Do we get, can we draw in more independence if we're just you know a benign political party as if the left is benign political party. I'm sorry, but that's, you've,[26:31] You're missing something very real if you think the Democrats are some benign political party.Look who they chose to be their minority leader, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.[26:43] I know why some people get in. It's one reason Larry Elder said he was going to run. I don't know if he is or isn't anymore, but because he felt that with that platform of running for that office for President of the United States, he can bring a highlight to issues of black families and so on, so that's great.Mike Pompeo, I don't know, I think he's a great man, not great presidential material.Nikki Haley, anything Nikki Haley did that was good was when she was ambassador to the United Nations, speaking to Donald Trump's policies.So as governor, I didn't particularly like her. Does she have a good story? Yes.Is she an appealing woman candidate? Okay, can we please just move past that?So not a big fan of her.I think she's a big self promoter and has bitten the hand that fed her.Ron DeSantis is really the one candidate and I don't think he's in quite yet.He just spoke here in Las Vegas two nights ago and did two events in Los Angeles.People love him and that's fine and great, I do too.And if you really think that business as usual is the way to go, then he would be your guy.[28:02] But I think if one has been paying, and you and I had this conversation pre CPAC, is he head and shoulders?He's a great speaker, he's very wise, he's very engaged in historical issues and aspects, He's been a fighter for Florida, great governor, great record.[28:24] And I think he's marvellous, marvellous, but I just keep coming back to politics as usual isn't going to cut it. I just don't think it is.As soon as the Democrats back off and do politics as usual, then we can too.But until that point.I don't think so. He is young. One of the issues of Trump, though, is he's in for only four years, right?[28:50] He can't do the full eight. This is his second term.He needs to be very judicious in who he picks as vice president because that person, can then do the eight.Or Ron DeSantis waits the four.I can't think that far ahead. I know I probably should right now.I think 2024 has got to be Trump again.That's all. And Ron DeSantis should stay governor in Florida, be the leader of all governors.He's exactly the example to follow as a Californian.Goodness, what I would trade to have him as our governor.But given 2024, who's the Democrat going to be?And as a Californian, I would contend too that it may well be Gavin Newsom, who's my current governor.So I don't know that pitting two guys, I just don't know. But the guy you need to go against the really evil, vindictive, hateful Democrats is the[29:57] guy who can withstand, I am the storm, I am your retribution, I am your man and I will take the arrows for you.I don't think anybody else can do that.
 
I am your retribution, that was an absolutely beautiful line.I'm going, I'm in the chairs, come on.
 
Yeah, but I was out of my chair so often during that and I'm not a jump to your feet kind of person but I was leaping and,because he does speak for us and he speaks for for everyone whether you're following along or not he's speaking for the guy who can't pay for gas. He's speaking for the,[30:38] he's speaking for all of us whether we are aware of it or not He's speaking for Democrats who are suffering because the political mayhem doesn't just, It's we're all suffering. It's not just Republicans, it's we're all suffering,
 
Let me kind of finish off looking at AFA.And I should have actually, my apologies for downgrading Karen from a doctor to just Karen.He has her PhD and that's a whole other side to that.But AFA, tell us what the, how long have you been president, about five years of AFA?[31:17] 2016, January, 2016, I came in as president. So more than six.We're just past past. I don't want to do that math. It makes me feel very old.
But tell us how AFA kind of fits into that conservative fight across the state because CPAC brought in all different media organisations, different speakers, often on the political side, but others as well. And I mean, let us know how AFA fits into that conservative pushback, fight, education.
Yeah, great question. Yes, we are a non-profit. We are not political.We can't endorse whatever I say about any candidate is Karen's, you know, personal opinion.We are much more ideas and policies and thoughts and trends and threats rather than advancing any particular, political agenda.So as you mentioned, we had a conference on propaganda, which is what you came to, which was marvellous.Because propaganda is the only reason that,[32:24] you know, left versus right. It's all great as long as you have a level playing field, but propaganda is how the left gains primacy in absolutely everything. So we had a conference on propaganda, as you said, we had Naomi Wolf, we had Patrick Wood, we had Alex Newman, James Lindsay, and many, many other amazing speakers, Trevor Loudon, and we culminated with James O'Keefe, the master at uncovering the propaganda, right?Project Veritas.He spoke he was our our keynote. Our last one was globalist puppet masters.So we talked about the globalist organizations that are out there in world economic forum, obviously, at the top of the list, but how these are implemented in our daily, how it affects us on a daily basis.We had Steve Bannon keynote. We also had Ed Dowd, just tremendous. James Lindsay again.[33:22] Just absolutely astounding. Mike Rechtenwald, who just finished a book on the Great Reset.So what we seek to do, the left sees absolutely everything as a political opportunity.Everything.What bathrooms you use. Everything. Plastic straws.[33:44] It's all politics. And we tend to leave politics in the political realm.But as many of us know, it's cultural. It's what happens in the culture.Culture, education, knowledge, knowledge is power, forewarned is forearmed, all of those things sort of inform what we do at AFA.And our next conference coming up in April is World War III, the early years, the contention being, obviously, we are in World War III.It's not a Cold War. It's gone hot.[34:13] The spark has been lit in Ukraine. Who's fighting, they've been fighting against us. Who is they?China, the globalists, the left, and various other entities.So we're aiming to inform on all of those. So again, it's not overtly political.The battles that we are engaged in are cultural. They are political, but we need to understand who our foes are, where the threats are, how to focus on them better.And a lot of that fighting is outside of the political arena.Some of course is in the political arena, but not all of it.And if more people are made aware of the threats that we face, they will be able to make better, much better decisions.I sort of liken it to nutrition facts on food, candy bars or whatever.If we give you the information, you can make better decisions or you can make decisions according to your preference.I don't care what it is, but you need the knowledge. and what we aim to do is give that knowledge.[35:19] I'm looking and people can of course still buy tickets for that.That's what you'll get if you go to Americanfreedomalliance.org.I see Ed Dowd just been confirmed and we had Ed as a guest and phenomenal speaker, great mind, love his book looking at, oh we're on YouTube, so I'll just say I love his book.I'll let you find out what it is.Can't even probably say what his book's called if we're on YouTube, but the whole finance side is really an area which I've enjoyed listening and learning from Ed Dowd.[35:54] Yeah, I mean, his contention about COVID before the book, before his book was when he watched what was happening economically with global finance, he was then looking for what the powers that be were going to use as a deflection from the economic mayhem that they had caused. And then low COVID comes along. So he won't be talking to us about COVID, but about really what we're seeing literally right now with the banking collapse. So we have him, big part of this is China. We have Gordon Chang, Frank Gaffney, Steve Coughlin, Joe, we have Joe Allen who's going to talk to us about AI in warfare.We have Mike Rechtenwald again, his new book. We have Patrick Wood.[36:47] I'm sure I'm missing somebody incredible. Oh, we have General Spalding who's written a lot about Chinese warfare.Colonel John Mills. Bradley Thayer, who's just, I'm sitting here reading his book right now, Understanding the China Threat.So it's going to be in large part about China, in large part about globalists, but also how they have infiltrated the American governance and civic institutions generally.Because without that, none of this would take root.And then it does look like we will have Steve Bannon come speak again, but sssh we don't want the bad guys to be causing us too much trouble too early.But it will be astounding, two days, April 22nd, 23rd in Torrance, just South of LAX.[37:38] A hotel that's been terrific to us. So it really is World War III and it sounds hysterical as so much that we've been saying sounds hysterical that there's a war on Western Civ, war on religion.But I think,any of us who's been paying attention knows that that's real.
I'm so jealous .
 
Well, you know, another 45 minute phone call, Peter, and maybe...
 
Too far this time though, East Coast I can cope with, and my wife can as well. Just to finish off and how does FAA have you? Have you been changing your your focus? Have you started one where and had to change to respond to the threats? How has the seven years changed at all?
 
Yeah, that's a great question. Absolutely, we've pivoted. The threats that Avi Davis, my predecessor and the founder of AFA, the threats that he had identified were still in large part radical environmentalism.[38:45] Islamization, not Islam itself, but Islamization of the West, global governance, education that's indoctrination and media that's propagandizing.So in large part, absolutely, they're the same.And we haven't really left them, but we've, During COVID, we had an initiative, Choose Freedom.We were fighting against mandates.So we were working on that a lot because that was really the number one threat to freedom.As soon as they require you to get a vaccine, for example, they can also then ask you for proof of it.And then you're just back, you're starting down a truly nightmarish path.Once they can legally ask you for proof of something in order to engage in civic life, this is just horrific.Obviously they backed up temporarily, but as we know, they never go away.So we had that, we've done a lot more in education.And I think we're focusing much more now on the globalist threat, which again, Avi had, but we're really focusing on that predominantly.[39:53] Because it really is the number one threat. And it's not just the threat to us, it's the threat to all Western civilization and they're very good at it and they've gotten better at it.And during COVID, we've seen how unbelievably effective they are, not just at the, not just sowing the virus globally, but sowing the narrative about the virus, the narrative about the threats, that the United States looked to China for guidance in how to deal with this, that China is in charge of the World Health Organization, essentially.Their reach is terrifying. So when I think about globalists, I think about China, the Chinese Communist Party together with the globalist organizations and how[40:42] deeply pernicious they are, how cunning they are. I had read Unrestricted Warfare some time ago, and this is what General Spalding talks about. It literally has been unrestricted warfare to such an extent we're not even aware of it. So I think war looks different now from how it had.Ghettoizing people looks different from how it had. Silencing people, shunning people looks different from how it once had, but it's no less dangerous and horrifying. And we are losing freedoms to their methods in a way that it's not just that we're losing them in a way, we're giving, we're giving, take, take my freedom, please. You know, it's surreal.They're very good at it and we need to alert people more. So that's been our predominant focus against the globalists and now also working with other anti-globalist organizations.[41:43] Politicians, political parties, alternative media, and we are working to do more things in Europe,as you know, I was just in Austria and Germany and Switzerland and I plan to do an event, hopefully in Germany in the summertime, bringing together freedom fighters throughout Europe, I think as American Freedom Alliance and the daughter of a German man who grew up during the 30s and 40s in Germany, I think it's something that AFA can do, that maybe Europeans can't.We don't, it's not a difficult thing for us to do and we're not a political party, we're just ideas.And that gives us, I think, the ability to do that. And I'm very sensitive to, I don't wanna be a bully of an American.I just want us all to be able to be the best we can be.I'm all for national sovereignty, national self-determination.But I think we do need to work together because they work together.So that's what I'm seeking to do.
 
Karen, thank you for joining us on your lovely road trip from Las Vegas to LA. I know where I would like to be with you, but anyway.There's the pool right there.[43:06] We don't have a pool here stuck in London, so I'm sorry. But yeah, thank you for coming on and sharing your thoughts on CPAC.
My pleasure, Peter.
Thank you. And if I could just, not at all, If I could just leave our viewers once again.Go to gun cat. I'll keep telling you this on every live we have because it was great to meet them.And I even got a great look at that great great t-shirt great top great hoodie. There you go.Can you see it there? Wow. Lovely shenanigans enthusiast and they've given us 10% off hearts 10 h-e-a-r-t-s 10. You can get get any of them there obviously in the states you can order them easily. They also ship abroad. But sign up to the mailing list and then if you're there in the States then you can get training on firearms. Sadly they don't offer training here, maybe one day.[44:02] But if you sign up the mailing list you can be kept informed of what they're doing and also, you can get some of the merch. And as I said what we do at Hearts of Oak is all about partnership, connection. It's not about simply having interviews on, but as Karen has been on the privilege I've had of getting to know Karen and discussing all different things with her and only by a connection and network I think will we actually be able to achieve any pushback. So Karen, thank you for coming on.
 
My pleasure.
 
Thank you to our viewers for watching or if you're listening as a podcast after, thank you so much for downloading that. We will look forward to seeing you on Thursday with Calvin Robinson looking at this recent split in the Church of England and what that means. Calvin obviously has his GB News slot every Sunday afternoon and he'll join us to discuss the tensions within the Anglican community worldwide. So tune in on Thursday 8pm UK.[45:01] When is it? 3pm Eastern and 12pm on the Pacific. I think that's it. And on that I wish you a wonderful rest of your evening and I'm off to jump on with Alex Newman. So thank you and good night to you all.

The Week According To . . . Dr Niall McCrae

More straight talking as Dr Niall McCrae returns to Hearts of Oak for an hour of news driven chat and discussion, giving his unbridled opinions on some of the top stories bouncing around this week on the web, in the papers and on social media. Topics and articles going under the microscope this week are...- Hate not Hope release their most recent report 'Rhetoric, Racism and Resentment' including Hearts of Oak amongst others.- Lineker Tweets: Presenters revolt for overpaid, jug eared BBC propaganda tool.- China Announces lockdown plans for the flu as Washington Post tells Americans to prepare for the same.- Russell Brand and how the left will eat themselves.- Corporate consumerism: Making us more dependent and less resilient while 'verging on extortion.'- The BBC (Biased Broadcasting Caliphate) welcome all the haters and conspiracy theorists back to Twitter.- ULEZ London: Cameras vandalised amid backlash against expansion. - Civil War at the New York Times! Older, liberal veterans Vs the younger, woke staff over the papers coverage of the trans issue. - Silent Prayer: Pro-life advocate arrested again for ‘thoughtcrime’ near abortion clinic.- Matt Hancock, COVID strains and 'frightening the pants' off the public.- Telegraph Misrepresents Ofcom Ruling Against Mark Steyn.Dr Niall McCrae is an officer for ‘Covid coercion in the workplace’ for the Workers of England trade union, the only union standing up for workers' rights and freedoms in the UK during these troubled times.From 2010 to 2021 he was a senior lecturer in mental health at King’s College London, and he continues to write on mental health matters.He was also a senior researcher for David Kurten and Peter Whittle on the London Assembly.His publications include several books including ‘Moralitis: a Cultural Virus’ (with Robert Oulds), ‘The Moon and Madness’, ‘Echoes from the Corridors’ (with Peter Nolan) and ‘The Year of the Bat’ (with MLR Smith).He is a regular contributor to Unity News Network, Gateway Pundit, Lockdown Sceptics, The Salisbury Review and The Light.Follow Niall on Gab @Dr_Niall_McCraehttps://www.workersofengland.co.uk/ 
For our listeners in the US, do check out our friends at https://guncat5.com/ 'Firearms training for women, by women'Originally broadcast live 11.3.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstinTo sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Please subscribe, like and share! Links to this episodes talking points...Hate not Hope https://hopenothate.org.uk/2023/02/26/state-of-hate-2023-rhetoric-racism-and-resentment/Linekerhttps://gab.com/TommyRobinsonOfficial/posts/110001603574903499Lockdownhttps://dailysceptic.org/2023/03/10/china-announces-lockdown-plans-for-the-flu-as-washington-post-prepares-americans-for-the-same/Russell Brandhttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/mar/10/russell-brand-politics-public-figures-responsibilitySee you Soonhttps://countrysquire.co.uk/2023/03/09/see-you-soon-the-showrooms-polite-warning/Twitterhttps://www.bbc.com/news/technology-64554381.ampULEZ https://gab.com/Dr_Niall_McCrae/posts/109993951077560823New York Timeshttps://dailysceptic.org/2023/03/07/civil-war-at-the-new-york-times/Silent prayerhttps://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2023/mar/6/isabel-vaughan-spruce-again-arrested-thoughtcrime-/Hancock https://www.itv.com/news/2023-03-05/need-to-frighten-the-pants-off-public-with-new-covid-strain-matt-hancock-saidMark Steynhttps://dailysceptic.org/2023/03/06/telegraph-misrepresents-ofcom-ruling-against-mark-steyn/
[0:22] Dr. Niall McCrae, thank you so much and sorry for keeping you waiting in the green room. You're live now.
it's quite comfortable in here.I'm sorry. There's lots of right-wing books to read in this room.
I'm sorry that I didn't supply you tea and coffee and drinks, but one day we'll have a proper green room to do that. Can I just, there was one comment on the side.Shelley Marlow said, I think she said, oh, Robert Malone. that's just weird, because I've seen people talk about controlled opposition. If that's a controlled opposition was, I wanted. The guy is absolutely genuine. I talked to him and his wife, what they're doing, all the work they've done. They were probably, probably the most genuine people[1:09] that I've met in some of my travels. They were hospitable. They opened up their house to me, they told me to stay as long as I wanted and just a wonderful couple. So don't believe the lies that only some of us are pure and the rest are all. There may be people in this for other reasons, but I think Robert Malone is not one of those. He is absolutely genuine.Anyway, we have enough stories and my sincere apologies for taking so much of Niall's time.You can of course find Niall on gab, that is, and we've taken most of the stories from his Gab account tonight.That said, let's jump in with our first story.It is Hate Not Hope have got a wonderful report. I love Hate Not Hope's annual report on the state of Hate, rhetoric, racism and resentment.It is an absolute honour for us here at Hearts of Oak to be in that.I thank Hate Not Hope so much for mentioning us and for showing us that things were doing well and not doing well and we will get a full page spread next time.That is our goal, a full paid spread in Hate Not Hope.[2:27] But Niall tell us about this because this obviously tries to target those of us sensible ones supposedly on the right.Many people mentioned are absolutely fantastic people. Some of them seem to be some Nazis.It's a whole mix really is.[2:47] Yeah, tell us about Hate Not Hope or this report or kind of what they highlight.
Well, I think you could take two approaches to this Hate Not Hope, sorry, it's the other way around, isn't it? Hope Not Hate report.
 
I always get it mixed up.
Yeah, well, of course, it is all about hate, really. These are the most hateful people, the most intolerant, woke Puritans.And I think that the first approach that you can take is just to find it all very amusing and to see it as a badge of honor.I mean, I saw that in the gallery of far-right extremists, there was a rather fetching picture of yourself, Peter.And there were also some other outlets. In fact, most of the outlets I write for[3:45] were in this Hate Not Hope report, including the conservative woman.I mean, Unity News Network, none of this, of course, is justifiable, but you can understand some of their websites are a bit more forthright, but conservative women are much more careful what they say.But also in amongst them was Richard Tice of the Reform Party.And so just as you said a few moments ago, Peter, there is such a crazy mix of people of all anywhere to the right of the spectrum.And I think what the intention[4:32] is here is to by associating Richard Tice with you know some real kind of far-right extremists because there are far-right extremists in that report. I think the intention is to warn people like Richard Tice, GB News, Nigel Farage, and in fact, anyone who follows Richard Tice, Reform Party, Nigel Farage and so on, that they are dabbling in, they're on a slippery slope, really to far right extremism. But I think the second approach is, and I guess what I would[5:24] recommend is a combination of two. The first is to extract some humour from it and to be quite pleased that you've got this free publicity. But the second approach is that that this is actually a dangerous organization.[5:45] They're well-funded by the establishment. This report will be sitting on every MP's desk, and it will have an impact.Now, obviously people in that report will have been well used to being canceled over the last three years or more on social media and other outlets.But that is just a thin end of the wedge. The disinformation industry is really ramping up, and the hate industry is really ramping up.And we see these bills going through Parliament.There's going to be a lot more clamping down on people who are in that report.
Well, let's go to another hateful figure and that is Mr. Lineker.And here he is. Pro Jam, can you just scroll down so we get the full..[6:49] Yep, so scroll down. Scroll down, down, down. Yes, revolt for Lineker.And I don't know if those of you will be watching the match today.I won't because Liverpool lost 1-0 so I'll certainly not be watching them.But they've all walked out. But it's him comparing what the UK government are doing to the Nazis.And this is on immigration.I guess you've no love lost for Mr. Gary Lineker, Neil.[7:20] Well, if you are a fan of Match of the Day on Saturday evenings, I think you'll be going without tonight. I think they've cancelled it, haven't they?And, you know, this is Lineker and Chums holding the viewing public to ransom with their political ideology.I saw Ian Wright defending Gary Lineker when he actually praised the sacking of some other pundits from Match of the Day.He said nothing about Matt Le Tissier. when Matt Le Tissier was, you know, shown the door because of his comments about, I think, footballers collapsing after having the vaccine. So nothing, this isn't really about free speech. These people have got no principles at all. If they did, they would have been speaking out about all the other people that have been cancelled by the BBC over the years.[8:38] No, this is simply that they are part of the, that they follow the same narrative.[8:44] As Gary Lineker. They think that speaking out in favour of refugees, that that's self-promotion.And I wish Gary Lineker, when he talks about these people coming across the English channel as the most vulnerable people in society, I wish that he would consider the vulnerability, of girls and young women who live in the proximity of these hotels that are putting up these undocumented male migrants who shouldn't be in the country. And isn't it funny how the likes of Gary Lineker were so anti-Brexit, so pro-EU. These people have fled from the EU. You know, that might be, that's not where they've come from originally, but that is a country that they have been so desperate to escape from, France and the European Union. So it doesn't sound like Gary has got much of an opinion of rights and compassion in the European Union, does it?Why don't we send them all back to the EU and send Gary Lineker[10:10] on the same ship, yeah? Because the British public is getting more and more resentful of these[10:20] rich, smug, arrogant celebrities, cocking a snoop at ordinary people whose lives are genuinely, being affected in all kinds of adverse ways by these migrants being dispersed all around the country.People have had weddings cancelled, hotels have sacked their staff, and these migrants are on the streets and we know what's going on in Britain and Ireland at the moment.We know what's been going on with the abuse of young girls, and that's not necessarily refugees that were doing that, but it was, you know, again, perpetrators were the sorts of people that Gary would call the victims, or the vulnerable people.You know, people that actually sexually abuse our daughters, and Gary Lineker calls them vulnerable.[11:24] Oh, exactly. Yeah. Well, now we've paid half a billion to the French to look after it.I'm sure everything will be fixed, but that's a whole other issue which we won't touch on.Projam, can you bring up the next one on China announces, China announces lockdown plans for the flu as Washington Post tells Americans to prepare for the same.And it is this, let me break this story here.That is the, the daily sceptic, which is becoming better and better.And Toby Young seems to be becoming more and more red-pilled, which is interesting.But yeah, they're all seemingly getting ready and Washington Post had the same for Americans.It seems to be their preparedness for something that's incoming Niall.
Well, of course, I mean, COVID-19 was a trial run, I think, for what's coming next.[12:21] I don't fully agree with your comment about daily sceptic becoming,[12:30] You know, there's that podcast that Toby Young does for James Dellingpole called London Calling and people say they're either on Team Toby or Team James. I think Toby is a long, long way from Team James. He still believes in the cock-up theory rather than the conspiracy theory that James believes in. But yes, there is some very good stuff on Daily Sceptic.And it's a brilliant library, if you like, of everything that's gone on over the last three years.If you want to search for any information about COVID, then Daily Sceptic is such a fantastic resource.But this particular piece, Washington Post supporting the idea of future lockdowns, and they're not even saying that this would be for a deadly new pathogen necessarily.It could just be that there's a bad strain of flu. So no lessons have been learned.But of course, this isn't about learning lessons. The Washington Post and the whole[13:52] COVID-19 regime, they knew that lockdowns don't stop an airborne respiratory virus any more than masks are a prevention. They know all this, but it's because lockdowns allow them to take huge strides forward with their project. And if you think back to 2020, just how much was done in that short space of time. For example, 5G aerials was put up all around the country during that time when you weren't really allowed out of your house.
 
Yeah, no, completely, completely. Let's go to Russell Brand. Pro Jam, can you bring up the next one? I once admired Russell Brand. This is weird because I've gone the other way. I once hated Russell Brand. I thought he was just a sex-crazed junkie.I don't know whether he is or not, but this is The Guardian. Obviously they once admired Russell Brand, but his grim trajectory shows us where politics is heading. Interesting how I've got opposite thoughts about it. But yeah, he's obviously gained a lot of popularity. I've got some questions around it but a lot of stuff he puts out is is bang on the money. What are your thoughts?
Well, I would say to all viewers that,[15:22] you know, usually it'd be like extracting your own teeth reading Guardian comment articles.But this one is so bad that it's good. Believe me, it's well worth a read. And there's too much to unpack in the time that we've got. But Russell Brand has really gone a long way in George Monbiot's perspective from where he should be. But actually, I think Russell Brand hasn't changed as much as the Guardian and George Monbiot have changed.I mean, they've moved ever further away from thinking about what ordinary people want, to pushing this totalitarian net zero technocracy.[16:21] And Russell Brand, he speaks to a young audience, people who like freedom, that hasn't changed.I think he was always speaking to a fairly sort of liberal, I mean, okay, in the past, he was probably more woke than he is now. And like you like you say, I can watch Russell Brand now when I couldn't really before. But really, George Monbiot's article is just such good fun to read. I mean, everything that's going on in the world that we know is wrong.The central digital currency, the lockdowns, the COVID vaccines and denial of the injuries, digital surveillance, the Dutch farmers, all these sorts of things.According to George Monbiot, they are conspiracy theories that Russell Brand is dabbling in.So what you see in this article is just one long dribble of denial[17:37] by George Monbiot of what's really going on. And George Monbiot is also saying that he's very worried about the way politics is going. And that's interesting to the likes of you and me, Peter, isn't it? Because, you know, we wouldn't be human if we didn't get pessimistic about things.But it's interesting to hear George Monbiot, the way that he, you know, reading the tea leaves, if you like, he sees things getting a lot worse for his side. And just very recently, three weeks ago, I think, I was at Oxford for a rally against the road closures for net zero by Oxford City Council against the wishes of the local residents. And it was a massive turn up. People came around from all over the country, 10 to 20,000 there. And George Monbiot lives in Oxford and he was seething with rage at what he saw that day. It was terrible for him. This was his home city.[18:42] And it was all these conspiracy theorists had come from near or far. So he's quite a worried man, is George Monbiot.
 
I'm glad you brought some joy to him. It's always good to bring joy to the the Guardianistas help them out in their struggle against reality.Let's move on to a piece you wrote.Let me just mention once again, guncat5.com. Go there.As I said, part of the parallel economy. And they haven't paid me a cent for this.I just enjoyed being with them. Go and you can sign up to their newsletter.And also if you want to get merch, I would encourage you to do that.[19:23] Over here, this is an article that you've put together, Neil, on Country Square magazine.If you can scroll down Pro Jam, it's a really interesting article, See you soon, the showroom's polite warning.It's about sustainability and I guess if the industry actually were green in any way, they would promote cars that last longer than a three-year warranty.That's kind of the overview. about this article Neil?
 
Yeah well I think there's two messages here. One is that you know we are opposing this new normal that the globalists want to impose on us but I think the last three years of Covid has shown, you know, certainly someone like myself who wasn't really very alert to what was going on until Covid.[20:20] It shows us that the old normal wasn't very good either. There were lots of things going wrong, and some of that was things that are creeping towards where we've got now. But this article is more about the corporate consumerism and how products are deliberately made not to last. And and it's been going on for a long time, but it's got steadily worse as, you know.[20:52] Computer tested components are made to last a very precise lifetime.And, you know, this started sort of infamously with planned obsolescence in the American motor industry in the 1950s, where they changed the model every year.And then they started putting on more more ridiculous wings and tail fins on the car. And incidentally, the editor of Country Squire has chosen what often comes up on an internet search. If you search Country Squire, you don't get the magazine top on Google, you get this American car called the Country Squire. And that's in the picture there is a Ford Country Squire from the late 1960s. Perhaps he could have chosen one with with the fins and wings from the late fifties.But anyway, the other point though, which is what you're touched on already, is that we have all these greenies lecturing us, hectoring us about the need for sustainability.Well, why aren't they[22:06] doing something about this corporate scam, because it is a scam, really. They could make products last for a lot longer than they do. And instead, things are lasting less and less time than ever. So we need to keep replacing them. We need to keep getting new stuff, mostly from China. You know, it has shipped all the way from China, made in sweatshops. I mean, this is not sustainability.So why aren't the so-called environmentalists making more of this, rather than trying to police every single aspect of yours and my lives?[22:50] Exactly. Exactly. Let's move on to Twitter. Projam, can you bring up the haters and conspiracy theorists back on Twitter?This is something the BBC had been working on and I'm not sure exactly why they had been working on it.It does seem as though they have a special unit.But this talks about the haters and conspiracy theorists back on Twitter and it's written by the disinformation team.I thought all the BBC was the disinformation team but obviously only part of it is the disinformation team.But they go and they talk all different people complain about Andrew Tate, complain about those who say that, stop the stealing, about saying the election was stolen in 2020.Mike Lindell talk about Robert Malone.And yeah, what were your thoughts? That disinformation, not really struck me.[23:51] It's interesting how the with the Gary Lineker story we mentioned earlier that there are all these people according to social media today who are cancelling their TV license because of Gary Lineker being kind of temporarily suspended from match of the day for his Nazi comments.I think that's just a cover up for the fact that the BBC is losing more and more people all the time.And I think some of those people are cancelling their TV license because of the latest nonsense from Gary Lineker. I was on a train home yesterday, I just heard three ladies who were in their 50s, ordinary sort of women and they were saying[24:46] Why does the BBC have people like him saying such nonsense? They're probably the people that will still carry on paying the license anyway, but hopefully UK based viewers[25:01] on Hearts of Oak, if you haven't cancelled your TV license already, you really need to do it.You don't need the BBC. The BBC hates you.This is the thing. It's got this disinformation TAll these people on good salaries paid for by your TV license.You are paying to be spied on and attacked by these people.And I saw that article a few days ago, Peter, and as you say, it's written by the disinformation team.If you go to the bottom of the article, you'll see there's about 10 or 12 names.And the article itself is really flimsy. I mean, you or I, Peter, could write such a piece in about 10 minutes flat.It's really flimsy. It mentions Andrew Tate, and that's about all.And yet all these people are being paid to produce this guff.So please, anyone that's still paying, just cancel it.You don't need the BBC. And the BBC doesn't need you either, because unfortunately, the money that they're losing, from hundreds of thousands of people leaving the TV license fee.[26:25] The government's quite willing to pay instead, just like they're paying for the newspapers, because authoritarian regimes love media, don't they?That's how they get their message across. So the BBC isn't gonna die, But why should you pay?[26:42] Why should you pay to have this constant barrage of anti-conservative, anti-traditional,They really don't like the ordinary British people much at all.[27:01] Yeah, no completely. We will move on this here, which was from your gab and it's telegraph, which obviously is often difficult to get because it's behind a paywall.This kind of connects with the Oxford thing. Someone said on the chat, HW Logan said, did the protest in Oxford help at all?Well, it's about applying pressure.All these things are applying pressure. It's never just a one off.But this is ULEZ cameras.Is the ultra-low emission zone, vandalized amid backlash against zone expansion. And there's a camera, you can see cut, the cable's cut, and you can see the front, not on that, the fronts are kind of blacked out. And yeah, it's a fight back against this control, isn't it Neil?
Yeah, and obviously I'm not going to incite crime on the show tonight, but I think my only comment on this, Peter, would be to quote from Thomas Jefferson.[28:13] 'When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty'[28:24] Very interesting. It's interesting how technology is used and that control has been used in different ways throughout the centuries, but now it's more insidious and invasive.Let's move on to, let me bring this is, what is our next? Our next is Civil War at the New York Times.A daily sceptic once again, who I think would be worse off without them, but they could be a lot better. I agree completely with your thoughts earlier.[29:01] I was giving some slack to Toby Young who I think deserves criticism and praise in equal measure.But this is civil war at the New York Times. This is the clash they talk about between the older liberal veterans, or how it's termed here, and its younger woke staff over the coverage of the trans issue.[29:28] I wonder whether it's that. I don't think every young person wants to chop off bits of children and sexually abuse them in that way. So I think that's probably over-egging it, that split.But it's I guess good to see the liberal media, the established media, the mainstream media actually up in arms with themselves over these issues.
Well, sometimes people can be quite flabbergasted by this woke momentum that doesn't seem to stop.You know, you get these stories every now and again, oh, they've gone too far this time. But no, they keep going because there isn't any real strong and meaningful resistance to them, either from the ordinary people or from the establishment. And for the latter, that's because the establishment likes what these young woke warriors are doing. They're pushing[30:41] the narrative. Look at the way, not just in Britain, but in other Western countries as well, you get these Antifa protesters coming up to counter freedom rallies, for example.[30:59] Their opponents are always accused of racism and homophobia and all that sort of thing.And the establishment just loves this because here is dissent against the establishment narrative[31:17] being countered by, and often such as when there's a drag queen protest outside a library, for example, that there are more antifa counter protesters and a few brave people who dare to turn up for the protest itself. So what I think you've got going on here, Peter, is a supposedly liberal left newspaper, The New York Times, getting in a generational struggle.The older writers, as you put it, who are more genuinely liberal, okay, they might have got fallen for all the COVID authoritarianism, but they still believe some of their kind of, liberal kind of outlook.Whereas the younger journalists and staff at the New York Times, they are like the Red Guards of Mao's China.You know, they're totally uncompromising and they are extremely shrill advocates of all these[32:39] extreme causes like transgenderism. And it's interesting to see what happens with someone like someone like JK Rowling, who has been completely sort of persona non grata now.And this is what goes on in workplaces as well. This is not just the New York Times, this goes on in universities up and down the country, not just in America, in Britain as well. In Britain,[33:11] universities, older, genuinely academic, enlightenment-infused lecturers and professors are skating on thin ice now because of this Red Guard-like, woke revolution that's going on.And the administrators, the senior administrators of principals and so on, they don't stand up for their staff.They say they want to support these courses. Look what universities did with Black Lives Matter, for example.They just took over the whole university for a couple of weeks back in 2020.And they're fully, completely, totally in support of transgender ideology.So who's going to win that battle in New York Times?I think it's fairly obvious,I think they'll just get, you know, they'll ease out some of their as some of some of their leading journalists have already left.[34:21] But they will be eased out, leaving an ever more woke staff behind.
No, completely.[34:31] I see. Sorry, I can see some of the comments as well from DLive.There's Kryptonite Dude on DLive.You can obviously watch on any of the platforms. If it's Rumble, if it's DLive, if it's Twitch, if it's on Twitter or on GETTR, on Rumble or directly on the website.Great having you with us. Obviously Niall McCrae is not for YouTube.So we keep more. We do do the, I think on Monday we'll do YouTube to discuss on CPAC.So that should be safe. I don't think CPAC has been cancelled by YouTube as yet, but you never know.We'll see. This is about the pro-life issue, well it's the free speech issue really.And Pro Jam if you can just scroll up, a British pro-life advocate again arrested for thought crime of silent prayer near abortion clinic.[35:25] This is the second time she's been arrested and actually the bill, this is under existing legislation, but the bill has passed through parliament, I think it was a couple of days ago and it passed through parliament which will now make it illegal to go within 150 metres of any abortion clinic if you do anything to oppose it, including silent prayer.Some MPs tried to get an amendment through that would remove prayer but no, it was kicked out.So the conservative government, Labour, all of them, they want to make prayer illegal.But the second time this woman, even after being acquitted, what are your thoughts on this Niall?[36:08] Well, you know, I could probably go on for half an hour on this, but I think I would prefer just to say the outstanding point about this incident, and it really is a profound point, is that thought crime literally is a thing now.So this woman's private thoughts in the form of prayer.[36:45] Completely unseen to anyone, but known only to herself, is now criminalized.And what an amazing achievement that is of the authoritarian state, that you can now be arrested for praying.I don't think the large numbers of Muslim men praying in the street in some towns and cities in the UK, I don't think they've got much to worry about. But you see, another just very quick point is that isn't it amazing how much protection abortion is being given?And it's almost become like Holocaust denial. You know, if you deny the right to abortion, and not just, you know, most people, my guess is that most of the ordinary British public would accept abortion within a certain time period, you know, 20 weeks, 24 weeks, which is what we've got at the moment.[38:03] But they wouldn't accept it to right, most people I don't think would want that right up to the point of birth or even beyond as some extreme advocates of abortion are calling for.But again, it's something that people feel very scared to resist such is the outrage[38:27] that you get for saying anything critical.Of course, if you're a man, you're not allowed to say, talk about abortion at all, aren't you?You'd have to do a temporary transition to females, so you could say a few words about it.Yeah, it's just quite stunning how successful that the establishment has been in making abortion totally out of bounds for criticism.
Yeah, I would actually go as far as I like the heartbeat legislation in the States. You feel someone's pulse and you know they're alive. So that's about six weeks. That's what I would roll it back to. So I would be a full-on extremist. But can I just again repeat, this is happening under a so-called Conservative government. This is the Tories that want to make prayer illegal.Let me repeat that. This is the Conservative government that if you go and vote for the the Conservative government, if you vote for Labour, if you vote for Green, if you vote for Libs, they all want to make prayer illegal. So choose how you vote. That's what I would say.
Yes. I'm glad you said that, Peter. Sometimes we need to remind ourselves and others that these things are happening under a Conservative government. And what the Conservatives hope[39:53] is that come the next election, people will think, well, it's bad enough under us.[39:59] But think how bad it's going to be under Labour. That's how they hope people will think, you know, better the devil you know. Now, I've got just a very quick self-promotion here. I've got an article coming out on Unity News Network tomorrow, which is a letter to MPs. So we've got an election that would be next year at latest. So probably it's going to be 2024. And before an election is called, I think people should be writing to their MPs, asking them where they stand on all these issues, which are the big issues of the time, none of which are in manifestos apart from the climate crap. But all this, the COVID stuff, the digital surveillance, you know, the cashless society, the transgender teaching to primary school children, none of these things were voted for. And I think that we deserve to know where our MPs, whether it's Labour, SNP, Tory, whatever they are. We need to be asking them where they stand on the biggest issues of our time, because the biggest issues of our time were not in large, mainly they were not in any party's manifesto.[41:26] Yeah, not completely.
 
So, sorry, just to say that the article, it includes a letter that people can send, and I think it'd be really good if people from, you know, everywhere in the country, if you're living in the UK, if you send this letter to your MP, and the answers will be interesting.It doesn't matter if they just use all kind of obfuscation or avoid the questions.That itself is interesting, but it's also interesting if they send you a splurge of woke justifications for these policies.
Yeah. Will that be available on your GAB Neil?[42:03] Yes, I'll put it out on GAB and it will also be on the Unity News Network website.
Yeah. Okay, wonderful.We will certainly repost that and put it out. Hold our politicians to account as they think they can get away with, well, literally murder, So anything they like.Last two stories will go to this lovely man who should be number one in a Nuremberg trial butI don't think that will ever happen. But Hancock wanted to frighten the pants off the public with new COVID strain leaked messages suggest. I'm really interested Niall with this whole thing.Obviously it was Isabelle Oakeshott, the other half, maybe the more evil half of Richard Tice, I would say. And she got these privately and then released them. That shows how despicable she is. Obviously, you can't trust her with a thing. But I'm just wondering whether they want to make Hancock the fall guy so the rest of them can walk away. What are your thoughts on all this stuff?
I agree with your comment that the fall guy in the UK is Matt Hancock.And the fall guy in America is Anthony Fauci with two different stories.[43:24] But they're both part of the same controlled release valve, the sort of revisionism on the the COVID narrative, because they have to move on.I think the globalists need to move on from COVID now. They can't keep this lingering forever.They've got big plans, and many things are going on behind the scenes.But it seems that they want to move on from it now. And that's happening with two big stories that are going on.In the Britain, we've had these WhatsApp messages, which were privately shown to Isabel Oakeshott, the journalist, but she said it was in the public interest for them to be published.[44:19] I'm very suspicious, I'm afraid, of this whole thing. Listen to Isabel Oakeshott's view on Midazolam because you know many people have been saying okay you're exposing this about Matt Hancock about you know wanting to scare the pants off people but what about what about Midazolam and she says oh that's not story there's nothing in that and and that you know that that makes me very suspicious. I'll be quite frank, I could be totally wrong and I doubt if she, if Isabelle Oakeshott is going to sue me for this, but I would say she's working for the other side. I really do believe that. And the other story which is going on is the lab leak. Now, there's three views about COVID-19 as a virus, right?One is that to believe the official narrative that it came from some bat soup in a wet market in Wuhan.You know, that was the official story, wasn't it? Zoonotic transmission to some, you know, unhygienic food market.The other story,[45:45] the second one is that this must have come from a leak, accidental or deliberate, from the Wuhan Institute of Virology. What a coincidence that this lab is in the same city where this unprecedented, deadly coronavirus arose from. And for a while, I believed that story. I believed that this must have come from the lab. But then I came to the conclusion, and I know that most sceptics are not fully on board on the same boat as me on this, but I came to the conclusion that the whole[46:29] COVID-19 phenomenon is a hoax. And that's why you can't be on YouTube, of course.
Oh yes. I know you too well Niall.
It is a hoax. And I think one of the best people to listen to on this is Patrick Henningsen, of UK Column. And if you look at the show he did yesterday, which you know, you can go back and replay it, and the one he did the Friday before where he lays out very clearly the argument that there never has been an isolated virus. The whole thing is a scam with PCR[47:16] test fraud. Anthony Fauci is a fall guy in America because he was involved in the funding of this laboratory in Wuhan through the National Institutes of Health. Now he's being accused of funding this dangerous gain of function virus.And people want him to be prosecuted, like Fox News and many Republican politicians and right wing commentators in America calling for Fauci to be prosecuted and for the Chinese government to pay reparations.I don't agree with that. I believe that this is a much more serious crime, which is that this whole thing was a hoax.And one day, one day in the future, people will eventually find that out.But at the moment, it's only a very small minority of really deeply cynical people like myself that have come to that conclusion.
I'm on the rabbit hole looking down. I'm trying to work out.I know it's interesting having the conversations with Dr. Malone about this specific thing.[48:32] I'm still above the rabbit hole where I know you're further down.Let's finish off with what happens when you do speak the truth. This is the absolutely legendary Mark Steyn. I say legendary because I remember following him 10 years ago whenever he was discussing Islam and the clash that we have in the West between Islam and our freedoms, and now he's taken on the role of legend and folklore through a completely separate, threat, and that is obviously on Covid. And here are telegraph misrepresenters of ruling against Mark Steyn. Well of course they do, sure they hate him. And they would like us all to be locked away and jammed. That's all the media right and left. But he obviously has had to leave. So, it's good, I guess, that this is coming out. Niall shows us the difficulty, I guess, of being a journalist in a mainstream organization. Even like GB News, it seems to be their massive restrictions under the Ofcom control?[49:45] The Daily Telegraph around about 10 to 15 years ago did this big splash about expenses, MPs claiming expenses and it was kind of epitomized by that rich old Tory grandee that bought a duck house on the lake in his private mansion. Do you remember that?
 
I remember.
 
And so this is a telegraph doing the same thing again where it is apparently doing something anti-establishment government. And so stunning and brave is the Telegraph, publishing those WhatsApp messages of Isabell Oakeshott, showing all of this scandalous activity going on in government.[50:55] And yet, the real story, which is the terrible harm that's been caused to people by these experimental genetic engineering injections, that they were coerced into taking and causing all kinds of problems, including death,[51:19] and the Telegraph has got nothing to say about that at all. And indeed, when this Ofcom ruling[51:27] was made, you know, total hypocritical ruling by Ofcom, but there we go, the Telegraph went out of its way to misreport it. This isn't just a mistake by the Telegraph. This is a message that it wanted people to know that anyone who criticizes the vaccines will be in trouble. And the Telegraph of course, like all the newspapers, they get vast amounts of money from the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. And, you know, journalists wages are paid by the government these days. So it's a very interesting illustration of just how bought the newspapers are. What should have been, you know, if things were working properly in the media, they should have been, journalists should have been dancing up and down with glee at having this big story of a journalist free speech being suppressed by an organ of the state. But sadly, we don't live in those times, we live in the times where the Telegraph, the Guardian, the Times and the Mail are themselves[52:50] organs of the state.
 
Yeah, they should all be on that Nuremberg trial. Neil, thank you so much for coming on. I really appreciate you giving your thoughts and there's Nanny Annie says, Thanks Niall, great show. I agree with everything you've said. So it's always good to have you on. Thank you.[53:10] Thank you, Peter. And goodbye to all the viewers. Thank you.
Let me, actually, let me, sorry, there's one other, I just wanted to leave the viewers with a smile.It's always good. Here was Bob Moran's latest, which I did think was genius as always.Thanks for making us a vaccine. We made you a play swing. Beautiful. Let me, yeah, that's, we made you a play swing, went great. Make sure and share Bob Moran. Make sure and share everything he puts up. Make him known far and wide, everywhere you can. Make sure and share that.[53:52] I just also wanted to just remind the viewers about, I've really got into Babylon Bee recently.I heard Seth Dillon speak at an event I was at a month ago, but I've kind of glanced at it. Here are some of the pieces on the front news if you go on their news thing.Man who's already purchased product just wants the ads to stop.Tucker Carlson obtains 40,000 unseen hours of Biden falling down Air Force One stairs.[54:22] Mario arrested for hate crime after leaving skid marks on Rainbow Road.But it was one I just want to leave you with to go and have a look at and it was page five and it is this. Obviously this is all satire just in case you missed that. This is shocking study shows more kids identifying as members of world's most celebrated popular group and it just says a shocking Gallup poll has revealed that a rapidly increasing number of kids in Gen Z are now identifying as members of the world's most celebrated popular group. We're absolutely stunned by this says sociologist Dr. Veg Bergman. We can't begin to explain why young, impressionable kids who are desperate for popularity and affirmation are suddenly choosing to become members of the most popular and affirmed group in human history. Every single movie, TV show, corporation, TikTok influencer, YouTuber, public school teacher, pop star and Hollywood star in the country openly promote and celebrate this group. Why on earth would teenagers want to be part of it?[55:25] It must be biology. And it goes on. Absolutely phenomenal how they use satire so powerfully[55:33] to mock and ridicule and give you a smile. So make sure and do go to Babylon Bee. I really got into it just a couple of days ago when I was in the States and someone sent me one and I read it, the whole article for the first time, I thought this isn't just good, this is genius. So obviously,
Yeah, and there's also the Pacific, which is a piss take of Atlantic monthly.[56:00] And another Twitter account that some of you might have seen is clownworldtoday.And I've often said to people, if you want to know what's going on in the world over the last three years, look at just go on clownworldtoday Twitter.
 
Yeah, no, I agree. I love it. I love it. I really do. Let me just say, do go, please do go when you finish, go to guncat5.com, go sign up the newsletter.[56:33] They've got a phenomenal team there of true conservatives who are making sure people are protected in the States and something that we can't do here. But anyway, that's a whole other issue. On that, I will say bye. We'll let you all go. We've kept you here for an hour. Let you go and enjoy your favourite beverage or whatever you wish to do for the rest of today. Have a great weekend. Good Sunday. I will see you on Monday with Karen Siegemund, unpacking CPAC. That'll be live at 8. So you can come on and give us your thoughts. We'll pull in comments during the show.I will even risk YouTube. There you go. Can't do better than that.On that, thank you so much and we'll see you Monday. So thank you and goodbye.

In Conversation With . . . Robert W Malone MD

While attending CPAC in Washington DC I had the honour of being invited to guest host for the wonderful folks at Lindell TV and on the list of people I was scheduled to talk to is someone who I have interviewed a couple of times before and has since become a friend, Robert W Malone MD.While catching up off camera, Robert was telling me all about his new studio he has built at his home and if I had time I must come and see it.Not one to turn down such a gracious invitation, I jumped at the chance and then spent a couple of wonderful days with Jill and Robert at their home.While checking out the new studio we sat down for an impromptu discussion, starting off with his new book and going onto many subjects, touching on Matt Hancock and the UK WhatsApp files, the chances of future prosecution for those spearheading the COVID pandemic and listen out for some wise words on our mindset and how we move forward when all trust seems to of been eroded. Robert W Malone MD is the discoverer of in-vitro and in-vivo RNA transfection and the inventor of mRNA vaccines, while he was at the Salk Institute in 1988.His research was continued at Vical in 1989, where the first in-vivo mammalian experiments were designed by him.The mRNA, constructs, reagents were developed at the Salk institute and Vical by Dr. Malone.The initial patent disclosures were written by Robert in 1988-1989.He was also an inventor of DNA vaccines in 1988 and 1989. This work results in over 10 patents and numerous publications, yielding about 7000 citations for this work.Dr. Malone has extensive research and development experience in the areas of pre-clinical discovery research, clinical trials, vaccines, gene therapy, bio-defense, and immunology. He has over twenty years of management and leadership experience in academia, pharmaceutical and biotechnology industries, as well as in governmental and non-governmental organizations.Robert specializes in clinical research, medical affairs, regulatory affairs, project management, proposal management (large grants and contracts), vaccines and biodefense. This includes writing, developing, reviewing and managing vaccine, bio-threat and biologics clinical trials and clinical development strategies.His proposal development work has yielded clients billions of dollars.He holds numerous fundamental domestic and foreign patents in the fields of gene delivery, delivery formulations, and vaccines.'Lies My Gov't Told Me: And the Better Future Coming' Available from Amazon.....https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lies-My-Govt-Told-Me-ebook/dp/B09R4YD4MP/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=robert+w+malone&sr=8-1Follow and support Dr Malone.....GETTR: https://gettr.com/user/rwmalonemdTWITTER: https://twitter.com/RWMaloneMD?s=20WEBSITE: https://www.rwmalonemd.com/https://maloneinstitute.org/SUBSTACK: https://rwmalonemd.substack.com/Interview recorded 7.3.23
*Special thanks to Bosch Fawstin for recording our intro/outro on this podcast.
Check out his art https://theboschfawstinstore.blogspot.com/ and follow him on GETTR https://gettr.com/user/BoschFawstinPlease give us a follow on all our social media, podcast, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Spread the word by liking and sharing where you can!
[0:24] Robert Malone, it's wonderful to be back with you.
 
Thanks for being here in the studio and taking the time to travel here to Virginia.
 
Not at all. Is this the first in-studio interview you've done?
Yeah, since the studio's been set up, I've done a bunch of hits, obviously, broadcasting directly, but not having somebody here in the studio. Very early before we had all the infrastructure, there was an interview for Epoch Times, but that'll come out in some future documentary I'm told.
 
Looking forward to it. Before we get on the book, CPAC, we bumped into each other at CPAC and interest in CPAC, but from your involvement, because CPAC obviously is a political event and you're there walking down media row and everyone wanting a piece of you.[1:18] What's that like? Everyone turns their head and everyone recognizes you.Everyone recognizes you.
 
Yeah, it's especially at CPAC, perhaps more than almost any other venue. And this is my third time speaking at CPAC. So the first time was in Orlando and that was a wake up call.I had no idea that I had this level of recognition in the conservative circles.CPAC is a funny place because it's people that are politically active that are very committed to the conservative movement of the United States.And increasingly CPAC has become almost an international hub of conservatism.So it's a biased sample.What happens in CPAC is not what happens in most places. And so it's a special place, but a little bit weird.What is it like?I don't know how to describe it. It's almost surreal, very odd. The[2:35] endorsement, support, encouragement, and particularly the people that come up and say things like, I felt that I was alone, or I felt like I must be crazy and then I heard you and I knew I wasn't.That's really, that gives me a lot of positive feedback to think that I'm actually helping people.The adulation is a little weird and I'm very wary of it.The whole cult of personality thing makes me very uncomfortable because I know how easily that can be perverted.And I also know that just because today this is happening, that has no predictive value of what's gonna be happening a month from now.And it could all go away in a moment. And so I think it's important to maintain perspective.[3:35] In what I try to do is focus on the mission and focus on helping people.If you stay, I think if you stay grounded in a sense of, this term has become very trendy lately, servant leadership.If you're keeping, if you, what I try to do is keep in my head that I'm in this moment because I'm providing value to people and the moment that I lose control of my ego or start imagining that this has something to do with anything other than this moment in time, then I have lost my own integrity and I won't be true to the mission. So I try really hard to not let it get to my head. And of course, Jill does her best to make sure that I maintain perspective.That's one of the lovely things about having a long time stable partner is they can keep you grounded.
Servant leadership is not a term I would expect to come out of something like CPAC. That political.[4:49] The lights are on, it's showbiz and even sitting, listening to some radio interviews and the level of respect and I guess adoration that people have for what you do.
It's a little weird, there's kind of a folk hero aspect to it.The tension for me is that people need role models.And they kind of need heroes. And this all gets wrapped up in the Joseph Campbell hero's journey, a narrative that surrounds all of us. It seems to almost be hardwired into our DNA.And I'm very conscious that there's an aspect here that's recreating the hero's journey, including the trials and tribulations in the time when the hero goes into the unknown and has to come out hopefully with wisdom that they can then share.I mean, this is the hero's journey laid out by Campbell.And I find myself unconsciously recapitulating that.And I see it in many of my colleagues.[6:05] But it is so easy, as I see it again and again, for people to get wrapped up in a sense of self-importance.And the other one that can really compromise people's perspective is all of us have set aside our careers.[6:28] All of us have, all the way down, the labour that has had their income compromised because of lockdown.You know, everybody has had, well, except for the elite, right?We've had this massive upward transfer of wealth.But for most folks, this has been really hard times. And so it's natural to want to make a buck to recover.You know, for instance, if you're a high profile physician and you've lost your practice.And so that siren song of making money and doing things to make money can easily lead you down pathways that you may not be aware you're walking that road until suddenly it's got you.And I've seen that happen also.And I'm really... Jill and I have been very, very conscious of that risk.And this is why in our substack, we don't charge.[7:33] People can voluntarily pay, but we make the information available to everybody.Yeah, it would be really neat to have 300,000 paying subscribers.Number one, that would never happen.And number two, it's contrary to the mission. Yeah, I'm not Joe Rogan.Memo to self, I'm not Joe Rogan![8:00] So I think it's hard but super important to stay focused on this moment in time and this mission of trying to help.[8:11] Hence the servant leader mission space, as if you don't, it is so easy for all of these forces to corrupt you.You have people wanting to touch, wanting to shake your hand, wanting to engage with you, wanting to be your business partner, wanting you to do their podcast, come on their show, you know, and all of this gets monetized. It's a little bit of a weird transactional relationship, not in your case, but with many podcasters. Like there's been an estimate that the net value of my appearance on Rogan, which I was very glad to do, it got information out, it had an impact on the world. But for Spotify and Rogan, it was worth a couple hundred thousands of dollars based on the number of hits. I mean, they have these simple equations. And when you hear those kinds of numbers, I didn't get a couple hundred thousand. I didn't get Zed, right? I paid for my trip down there, right? But there's money at play and there's all kinds of forces that are really easy to get lost in. And I think that that's a challenge. That's the problem I have with[9:34] moving through spaces like that, like we were talking about CPAC, is all of this comes at you in,[9:46] and it's useful if you are seeking, if your objective is to build your brand and to monetize it.It's a window of opportunity if that's what you want to do.But as I'm saying, if you go down that path, you quickly find yourself making decisions that will compromise people's, they'll compromise your objectivity and your genuineness.And I think that's the key thing that I've learned through all of this, is people are just craving genuine.So much is synthetic in their world.And particularly in the media. You know, it's, I have somehow, together with Jill, found ourselves, because of a set of circumstances, a very odd set of circumstances, in this weird position of being able to influence the tide of human events in some way.And that's a gift and a burden.[10:56] Yeah, well, I want to, can I ask you a different question about you that haven't got asked before?It's Lies My Government Told Me, will touch on the better future coming after, and just out, just before Christmas. And I thought it was a very large book. And then I thought, actually, it's probably very small. Lies My Government.
That's the criticism. It should be as big as the Encyclopedia Britannica.It was actually twice that size. And when I turned it into Tony Lyons, his acerbic comment was.[11:31] well, this will sell well for those who need a doorstep, but no one's actually going to read it.And so they went to their credit, Skyhorse and Children's Health Defense, pulled together a team that just went on a marathon editing effort because everybody wanted to get it out before Christmas.And so unfortunately, a number of chapters, particularly chapters from the first section that were sharing personal anecdotes about what it was like to be a frontline physician, for instance, got dropped. And I regret that. But that was out of my hands. And then some of the other chapters got condensed. And then the one that I could never properly rewrite was the one about mRNA because for me it's all so technical and it was, you know, I kept getting this feedback nobody is going to read this and the anybody who does is not going to understand it.[12:33] And so I'd make an attempt to rewrite and then I would get the same feedback. So eventually what happened was that somebody from Skyhorse had to step in and rewrite that chapter and kind of make it easier reading.
Tell me about getting it published. I didn't dare to hold it up.I held it up and it wasn't in.But I mean, there are a couple of questions. One is probably why write it?Because there's a lot of information out there.And you were already doing lots of media work. So you're getting the story out.But you decide to spend, I mean, never done this, but I assume it's a heck of a lot of time.
It's about a year for Jill and I.
Okay.
 
So the genesis of the book...
 
This was pre-substack. so it was fine?
No, actually it was,So that's,This is intimate, This is woven into the sub-stacks.So I'm asked by Tony in Sky Horse and Bobby Kennedy to edit Bobby's book, The Real Anthony Fauci.And that was an earlier draft.[13:49] That was a heavy lift, both time-wise and psychologically. For me, I thought I had known a lot about Tony Fauci.I've looked at him my entire career. I've been younger than him, but he's always been the big kahuna in infectious disease throughout my entire career, starting from the earliest days when the laboratory where I cut my teeth was working on the AIDS vaccine.[14:22] Back in 80, starting in 83.
And that's a whole other conversation.
 
And so, so I thought I had known, you know, cause I sit on these study sections in the office of the study section chair.I spent a ton of time hanging out in NIH and dealing with their stuff.And, and thought I knew a lot of the inside scoop on the way things are.But after the first read on Bobby's book, I was depressed for two weeks.It was just like, oh my God, the burden of just becoming aware of how deeply corrupted everything is.And then they liked my detailed edits that were not just content, but also I'm a reasonably good editor for language.And then they wanted me to edit again with the next version did and then after the you know, the big scrum and rush to get it out the door.[15:30] Tony Lyons asked me to think about writing my own book and, Jill and I talked about it. The problem is there isn't much money in publishing a book these days and so we said well, you know naively well, what would the advance be?And modest is an understatement. Overstatement. Modest is an overstatement. You know, it's a couple thousand bucks and we're like, well, this is going to be a heavy lift and there's no way we can afford to take the time to write this book with this kind of revenue model. It just makes no sense at all. You know, we do try to,[16:12] we had to live on the edge forever and run our small consulting business and we're very attuned to cash flow as probably you are too?Well, yes.
 
People listening to that.
 
Oh, yes. We all are.
Right? And so, Around that time Steve Kirsch, this is before the Rogan hit, and I was still on Twitter.
 
Did you use the black horse interview the three of you?Did you have that interview with you and Brett was that before?
 
Yeah, so so after yeah, it was way before Rogan. Okay Um, so and and I actually looked up my very first podcast was in February of 21.[16:53] With a woman named Dr. Aaron Stair who does a podcast as Dr. Eekes.And my very first podcast, it turns out, was about antibody-dependent enhancement in the vaccines.So that's a kind of historic marker, so we'd already done the Dark Horse thing, which was kind of a breakthrough.[17:19] And Steve calls me up one day. Steve Kirsch can be very effervescent.
I've had him on once, and enjoyed it.
 
Very enthusiastic guy, and he's like, and he knows that we have, I'm destroying my, I've essentially destroyed my consumption.And so, so Steve calls up and says, Hey, there's this thing, Substack, and I've gotten on it.And he says, I've made $30,000 in the last month. And you really got to get on this.And we were like, well, $30,000 a month, that sounds like real money to me.
And this was mid-2021, was it, or?
It was like early fall.And I'd never heard of Substack, but maybe a little bit.It was on the fringes. That's in Substack. That doesn't mean that it's anything real.And then Steve calls up and says, you've got to get on this thing.And so we launched that and that's kind of percolating along.And then I get deplatformed. And in parallel, we started on GETTR,[18:32] knowing that there was this chronic risk, I was busy basically self-censoring on Twitter to try to avoid getting deplatformed.And I posted a link to the World Economic Forum's, the little circular diagram they have of all their different policy positions, and a link to the Canadian COVID Care Alliance video on the Pfizer vaccine trials that had the title Safe and Effective question mark.And I still think it's a fantastic video covering all of the nuances that were known then about Pfizer trials and the misrepresentation, the deleted data and other things.[19:28] And suddenly, about two days before I go on Rogan, I'm deplatformed from both LinkedIn and Twitter.That was the third time I was deplatformed from LinkedIn. Steve Kirsch had Buddy, who is a vice president at LinkedIn, who saved me the prior two times.And I had personal correspondence with him. Yeah, because it's all a Microsoft problem.And so I'm already on GETTR.I get deplatformed on Twitter and LinkedIn just before the Rogan hit.[20:07] Rogan rushes the release, accelerates the timeline. So like two days after we did the hit, he dumps it on New Year's Eve of 2021.All right, is that right? 2021. New Year's. And the substack subscriptions and the GETTR connections just go boom. And I've never seen anything like it and suddenly were launched.And so it was a kind of this cascade of events that there's no way I could reproduce it.It was just, you know, like a lot of things being the right place at the right time and having things put in place.And then we were approached about writing the book and perplexed about how to do it.There was a history, a century or more ago in British literature, a lot of things were serialized in the kind of like local little publication flyers that would be circulating in London.[21:32] And so I thought, well, okay, maybe what we can do is use substack as a way to serialize is the building of the book by a chapter by chapter basis.And so that's what we did of necessity. And one of the consequences is that because we're writing it in the moment, each of these chapters, as a substack essay, Jill and I together, and discussing all the latest news and everything, as you've seen us do in the morning over coffee,It's full of details that there is no way I could recapture. If I had to start writing this book right now, there's no way I would remember all that stuff. And about the same time, Bannon was saying that he was making the point that everything is getting memory holed.And he was making comments on his show, which I was on periodically, that the only surviving artefacts of this period in time are going to be written text. That everything is going to get censored and memory hold and we've seen that happening even with the Wayback Machine.[22:50] And that it's really important to capture these things in the form of the written word.And that his posse that he's assembled, these people, really love written text. And that there was a market for this. And so we just persevered and had a couple of quote vacation trips. We were away from the farm and able to kind of focus. And one of them involved some people that were very seasoned, experienced writers. And so we were able to get coaching and feedback from them and talked about the structure of the book. And that's when it really got going.And pulling these chapters together. And then of course the chapters had to be rewritten because they were written in that moment in time and they have to be restructured.And then trying to figure out how to pull all this, really almost stream of consciousness writing together in a way that made sense.The epiphany was to structure it using the metaphor of how a physician approaches a patient.[23:58] Where when the patient comes to you, the way I've been trained, is the first thing you do is you take history and physicals. So you say, what is your chief complaint? What's your pain point? What are the things that are bothering you? And then you do some tests and you examine the patient. And then you have a period of time where you have to synthesize that and say, what is the diagnosis or the series of diagnoses and what's going on with this patient? What is causing their pain?And then you have to come up with a treatment plan. How are you gonna mitigate their pain?How are you gonna treat them for whatever their ailment and their chief complaint is?And so the epiphany was, oh, why don't we use this as a way to structure the book?So the first third is basically first person accounts of people saying, this is my pain.This is what I've experienced. This is what this has been like to me.Which I think is really cool for people that haven't been at the forefront and on the front battle lines to see kind of what it's like.What is it like through Paul Merrick's eyes to have his career destroyed?[25:03] What is it like for someone who, there's a chapter in there from a Chicago lawyer, who has always been a philanthropist, often a advocate for liberal causes in the city of Chicago that had bought a non-profit paper, and had written a essay about the vaccine and the problems with the vaccination based on, triggered by his own experiences in his family and what he had seen that had kind of, woken him up about this.And then had his own damn paper, refused to publish it and go through and edit it and everything in his kind of outrage about that whole experience.So there's just a bunch of these kind of first person, this is what I experienced, this is what it's like.And then it was this whole chasing down every rabbit hole we could think of about what the heck gave rise to this.What was really behind it? And[26:12] Ernst Wolf was a chapter that got dropped because we couldn't get his permission.He's a German economist who was really way out front in the theories around the role of the central banks and the economics behind all of this.And then Ed Dowd, you know, I brought that to Ed's attention that I had met in Hawaii early on when we did a rally there and brought him into this matrix of...
I'd love to do rallies in Hawaii? It's beautiful.
 
Oh, it was amazing.It was amazing. Yeah, that was a, it's like 10% of the population in Maui came out.It was one of the biggest rallies we've ever done. Early on, and then we went from there to Pearl Harbor and then spoke on Oahu.Not quite as big a rally. There was some key organizers that had done prior rallies in Maui.[27:20] So that's where we met Ed. So I sent Ed the Ernst Wolff essays about Ernst's interpretation of the economics behind this.And Ed was, his response was, you know, this is pretty much the way I've been seeing it, but I haven't been able to verbalize it. And this is so much more clear.And so we ended up with a chapter from Ed in the book. And I was very influenced in parts by things I learned from Steve Bannon.And, you know, as you know, whatever you think of Steve, he has a great grasp of history.And he was able to mention some historic precedents that then triggered me, and I went back and researched those same things like events around Watergate, etc. and the Nixon administration and other historic examples that kind of tie into this whole government weaponization of propaganda against their own citizenry and Operation Paperclip and that kind of Mockingbird and those kinds of things. So that's the middle part. The hardest part to write was the third part.[28:35] Because yeah, the better future coming. The genesis of that part was that Tony Lions had come up with the title,together talking to some others in the network of writers and experienced authors.And everybody loved The Lies My Government Told Me. You know, what's not to like about that?That's red meat, right? But it was so negative. It was so grim. And I just did not want to put out a book that was just dark. And so I insisted that we put a tagline on the back. And that's hence the better future coming. And then I had to write the damn thing. I had to write what is the better future, right? Which was the hardest part of the whole thing. So that third part is the prescription.What can we do about this? And it goes into things that we can do about the administrative state, the corruption that exists within HHS, the revolving door, all of those kinds of details.[29:39] There's some comments in there in terms of the lies that I got from Scott Atlas from a presentation that he made at MIT, which he's now kind of recapitulated in this new Newsweek article that's just come out.And so those are incorporated in there as key lies, these various things that are clearly, you know, I originally thought they were intended as noble lies in the historic Greek philosopher's sense.
 
Can I, because what is it like to be so vindicated? Because you've spent the last year putting this together and this was all happening before the great revealing. We'll touch on that a little bit, over the last couple of months you were already doing the hard work. And then as you're putting this out, you're realizing the media are beginning to admit and catch on.So what is that like for you to put together something like this? And then for the media, who have attacked you continuously to say, you're right, not admit you're right.
No, they don't say you're right. They never say that,
No, no. Yeah. So I wrote an essay about that and our substack it's one of our most popular. I think the top one is about
[31:08] this being the greatest experiment in human history.But another one of the top ones is my open letter to the Canadian truckers.But my essay on what is it like to be vindicated basically makes the point, in many ways, I would prefer I wasn't.It would have been a lot better if I was wrong.And we didn't have this massive human tragedy.And it has been hurtful, because you can't deny that. To be defamed by the fringe conspiracy theorists, some of whom you thought were your allies, as well as by corporate media is not a lot of fun.And there's been times when I've been frankly suicidal. I have if I'm going to be honest.Particularly when people that I thought were with me then started attacking me.That was really hard for me to come to terms with.[32:20] It's been a really steep learning curve to come to terms with the kind of fundamental evil modern media. And the complete lack of integrity and, you know, ethics. That's another one of the chapters is about the New York Times. And my experience with that essay, which appears to have been written by someone that was probably funded by the government as part of those initiatives, and right after their interview and publication with me, they left the New York Times. And all indications are that they did have connections with the intelligence community, because they had intimate detailed understanding of status with the CIA. So, a complete unwillingness to even look at the paths, let alone mention them in the attack art, which has been kind of a consistent theme with the Atlantic Monthly and the other ones.[33:30] Um, it's it was really hard, I think, for Jill and I to come to terms with the ethics and the fundamental evil of modern media and into being in a position, I don't want to say victimized, because I hate taking the role of being a victim. You know, I really counsel people against doing that better to become a warrior than a victim. But that's been kind of my own part of my key journey is maybe we were talking about the hero's journey early on. One of the journeying into the unknown for me has been throwing myself into modern media and alternative media and coming to grips with what I encountered. How do you process that? How do you process a ecosystem that is fundamentally evil and just grinds people up like their input for a sausage and with no accountability, never an apology or acknowledgement of the evil that they do to others and the damage that they do. It's just part of how they do business. That, you know, there was a book that I cited here.[34:58] That a key mentor gave to me that is something like the Journalist and the Murderer, I think is the title. And it's an essay about the legal case that was brought, it was a defamation case, by a convicted murderer against the journalists that had basically taken advantage of him and gained his confidence and then wrote a series of very high-profile but very ugly stories that they got good coverage on.And this then was examined, this case was examined by a New York Times author, you know, who is normally a New York Times writer.[35:47] But then wrote a book about this, about basically the dynamic that gets set up repeatedly between investigative journalists and what are really their targets, the people that they're investigating.And they have a tendency to try to seduce you. And at first, so I would get like this happened with the Atlantic Monthly, oh, I just want to tell your story, right? As soon as I can tell you, If somebody says, I just want to tell your story, the proper response is click, hang up the phone.Okay, there is no other response. There's a cluster of tricks that I've now come to understand journalists use repeatedly in trying to gain your confidence. And I'm now to the point where I'm very wary about who I talk to because even people that you think might be your friends, there's as I've become more high-profile, I'm a, great target. It's a business model to raise outrage and come up with claims about me because you can get many people, you know, people loved gossip.[37:08] And so anything that they can gossip about, they'll latch on and they'll get clicks and views and subscribers and all of that. Very dark. And it's really just a version. It's really the same dynamic from CNN spreading fear porn about monkeypox or outrage about Donald Trump, all the way down to the smallest podcaster that's trying to increase their market share and, their clicks by attacking somebody who is seen as more high profile.It's been an amazing journey.So do I, I don't regret it.I Would Do It Again was the conclusion of my essay and it has been extremely painful.[37:57] And it was worth it.
 
You're probably going to have to do an updated version because the information, is continually coming out and what you've done is a snapshot of the information available.That's contained change and this article in Newsweek by Scott Atlas, I mean he puts down his 10.I mean, for you, as you were going through the lies, I know you said the better future coming was difficult, but the lies are the dark part.When you were going through that, were there one or two that you thought actually that, was the lie at all, was on, or I wasn't expecting that until I really delved deeper or kind of stuck out with you?
So a bunch of them.So the whole thing is a cascade of, what? That doesn't make any sense. I don't get it.I thought that was a conspiracy theory, right?
 
Just gets worse and worse.
Yeah, it does. The deeper you go. And the metaphor is the one from Shrek.You recall ogres are like onions.They have layers, right? That whole storyline, which is profound wisdom.All of this stuff has layers.And the shedding of one's naivete occurs in layers.[39:22] And I'm not sure that I'm down to the stub yet. There are still things that I, you know, you think that the world is supposed to be fair and right and good if you've been brought up a certain way.And then you encounter this stuff. So was there, one of the big ones was early on I hada film crew come here and there were people that had actually travelled, one of them travelled with Trump to Davos. Okay. And they kept talking about the great reset and I was really wary of that.I was like, I don't know anything about this. I don't know Davos.
 
Full on conspiracy.
 
I don't want to comment on this, you know, try to be nice to the film crew and let's just stick to the things that I do know, we talk about the JABs and technology and stuff like that. And then, truth be told, I was kind of brought into the sphere of influence of Children's Health Defense.[40:28] And I think they were a little wary of me. You know, was I the real thing? Was I controlled opposition and all that. And so, Meryl Nass and Mary Holland came down to visit us here at the farm, and spent a couple days up at the house where you are staying right now. And Mary kept talking to Jill and I about this great reset and Klaus Schwab and the World Economic Forum. And afterwards, after they left, Jill was like, well, I like them, but I don't know, this Mary Hall. And she's, pretty far out there with all that. But at that point, we had enough respect for them. We felt like we had to look into it. And Jill found the book, The Great Reset on Amazon as a paperback and got that and we read through it and it was just the the logic there was squishy at best.[41:35] And, you know, it was real. And then we had to investigate the world economic forum and go down that rabbit hole and understand that.And that led to the Young Leaders Program. This is before the Trudeau truckers event.And we had a colleague here locally that was working with us part time.And we asked, and there'd been another group in Sweden that we were aware of that had done a lot of diligence on the Young Leaders Program and the WEF.[42:11] And so we connected our local person that we hired part-time with them.And then they did this huge deep dive, took a couple of months, collating all of the young leaders.They had to go back into the Wayback Machine and they just searched all kinds of different threads, to create this massive spreadsheet.It's still the most comprehensive spreadsheet of all of the young leaders.And we posted this on our MaloneInstitute.org site as a Excel sheet, everybody can download it.[42:43] And search by industry or nation state or person's name or whatever, and find when they graduated, who the other people were in their class, what industry they're in and all of that.So it's all there.And wrote a series of essays about the wef, which are partially condensed in the book.And came to terms with that. And then once you go there, then you have to look into the Jekyll Island story and the central banks and the Bank of International Settlements.And like I said, Ernst Wolf and the whole economics this and in central bank digital currency and then along comes Justin and Christopher Greenland and their little reveal about what this brave new world of finance is really going to be like under digital currency where the government can just push a button and you no longer have a bank account or if you've donated to a cause, it gets redirected.[43:53] Or not made available for that cause because of political pressure.That was all validating. Then it's like the mask came off and we could see the beast, right?And the whole world suddenly went,Wow. And then they almost crashed the Canadian banking system, right?Do you remember that press conference with Christopher Friedland and Justin Trudeau where they said we're going to drop this?Christopher Friedland looks like she's having a nervous break down.[44:28] It's a fascinating case of watching body language. They, it's like they disclosed to us a financial nuclear weapon and had deployed it, you know, the metaphor using a tank to shoot squirrels.They deployed it prematurely against these peaceful protests that were guilty of the sin of parking their trucks and honking their horns, right?And for that sin, they decided this was the moment to show the whole world that the Canadian banking system was not a secure place to deposit your Chinese money.If you're a Chinese heiress or whatever, right?It was no longer a safe harbor. And then the whole world kind of went, oh, if the Canadian banking system isn't a safe harbor, what is?And I think I've heard people say it was the greatest advertisement for cyber currency in the history of the world, right?For Bitcoin. Yeah, so it's been a long strange trip for sure to quote the greatful dead And um..[45:55] Another book. So we continue to push out the substack. Yeah. Yeah. And Jill and I debate[46:02] almost daily about whether the next book is more personal biography.
 
People love your journey.
 
Yeah, they love this. The personal story of us. You know, we now passed our 44th wedding anniversary the other day. And, you know, we're high school sweethearts and that whole arc of history.
 
That's on your Wikipedia. Goodness, that little bit's left.
 
Is it?
 
Your childhood sweethearts. Yes. Oh, that's been added. Yeah, apparently I haven't looked at Wikipedia. I got so fed up with Wikipedia and Jill's head just explodes whenever she sees it. So we just try not to look at it because it's been so highly edited. And fascinating backstory to that is that it's a lot of that entertainment has been by a person called the sock puppet by the name of Philip Cross, which there's another wiki that some most people don't know about called Wiki Spooks.
Okay. So that's a good tip, always good to check out Wiki Spooks when you're dealing with the 77th Brigade or[47:10] any of these names because it's an archive of the whole intelligence community globally, that people have built instead of Wiki. And they have their opinions about me too, but they, If you look up the Robert Malone page in Wiki Spooks, they go deep into who Philip Cross is.And apparently this person edits, it's one of the top editors for Wikipedia.They edit seven days a week, basically 24 hours a day.And their personal image is literally a sock puppet.[47:47] Okay. That's the clip that they have for their picture as a Wiki editor.And according to Wikispooks, this is an MI5 operation.And it's just a pseudonym for a group of people that have been, you know, they edit.I've now to the point where if your Wikipedia page has not been raped in this way, you're probably not trustworthy.
Completely. I want to ask you about this book which you contributed, Rise of the Fourth Reich, and you're one of the contributors.But this concept of Nuremberg trial, this concept of those who have done this, and we've seen a lot of the leaks, whether they are leaks or not, coming out.Matt Hancock, who was Health Minister in the UK.
 
Yeah, that's the big one.
That's the big one at the moment, but that's the tip of the iceberg.But this whole thing about Nuremberg trial, about those who are guilty of these crimes having to pay for it, be punished.Where do you think that's going to go? Do you think we're ever going to have that?[49:03] So one of the earliest podcast recordings I did was with Reiner Fuellmich.A lot of people aren't aware of that.When he was very early in his investigations this German lawyer who also has a license to practice in the States, I think he can, in California. And there was a whole group around him that were pursuing this idea of an indictment for a Nuremberg 2.[49:34] And when I interviewed with him, the person immediately preceding me, I thought, was a little off the rails because they were citing the US Army and CIA manuals on PsyOps.Of course, now we all know that that's exactly what's going on in the fifth generation warfare.But at the time, I thought this was just a little bit too fringy for me.And it shows how times change.
 
Well, we are all into it now.
And so Fuellmich was the spearhead, really the tip of the spear in pushing this Nuremberg 2 concept, at least in my experience.And it all blew up like about half a year ago with accusations that Reiner Fuellmich was controlled opposition.And on the basis of sketchy evidence and imprints, it's remarkably parallel to[50:42] the recent events with Project Veritas and James O'Keefe. But there was a rejection of of Reiner Fuellmich, Reiner Fuellmich carried forward, that committee carried forward independently, and that whole thing got diffused.I'm completely convinced that there actually are infiltrators that are agents of disruption.And I've written about one of them that was originally identified by Children's Health Defence of things that unfortunately used to work for[51:22] And I don't think he was aware of her prior history of the Nuremberg's.But they're out there. Yeah. And they seek, and there's some very active in Europe, that seek to infiltrate and disrupt and destroy these initiatives. Do I think that a Nuremberg 2 might ever take place? That would require a willingness within the European community in particular to allow a legal case to proceed, right, under an international court.And that's as much a political question as a legal question. And right now I don't see any appetite for it. I don't see any appetite for accountability with the possible, except what was the name of the person that's in the UK that you were just referencing with these WeChat or whatever.
 
So with Matt Hancock, who was the health secretary.
 
Yeah, so Matt Hancock, if there is any accountability being the cynic that I am having spent too many years dealing with DZ, it will be some convenient fall guy that'll be thrown under the bus and Matt Hancock kind of fits the profile.
 
He fits that kind of useful idiot. That's kind of what he's been portrayed as and he went and looked at celebrity status and they sent him on to[52:51] I'm a celebrity get me out of here and he was there and then he came back and it looked as like he was being rehabilitated and suddenly all this information comes out and he's low enough to throw him under the bus and save the government.
 
Yeah and the question is will people be satisfied with the bone?Will the thing that is pending,[53:20] that I'm hearing about is that some of the large NGOs non-governmental organizations that have played a key role in this are now being clearly identified for the, activities that they have engaged in okay that if I'm choosing my words That have contributed to the gross mismanagement, whether it's social distancing, lockdown, mask use, or that thing, the vaccine products, that is so controversial right now. But I think that I don't think there are many who can credibly deny the governmental overreach around the lockdowns and social distancing and mask, agendas, masking agendas, the shutdown of churches here in the United States, those are all clearly government overreach. And the, I argue that the weaponized[54:29] denigration of early treatment is is responsible for at a minimum hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths and so if you are one of these large NGOs and you're facing a public relations nightmare what are you going to do and or if you're a American political party and you're facing congressional inquiries about and if there was to build enough momentum that this is where the lovely things for the administration in terms of the logic that for democracy to survive there must be censorship. Right? Is this media control, this massive, profound level of corporate media control. They can shape reality.[55:32] As former CIA directors have identified as a specific objective of being able to shape reality and craft public opinion. So they clearly can do that now for a large fraction of the population and they have been successful in doing it. So if there is sufficient momentum where the natives get restless, then the logical DC strategy would be, as you say, turning somebody in the bus. Who would be large enough to deflect criticism from more senior, currently serving government officials and leaders of large NGOs. And I think that Tony Fauci is the one.[56:24] And he's, you know, getting a huge pension, made a huge salary, his wife is still is in NIH head of bioethics, but his power base of being able to influence as he has done, there's clear smoking gun evidence of paying off virologists with very large grants, $1 million grants to flip their story about the lab leak, for instance, and his intimate involvement in propagating the falsehoods around the natural origin of this virus, the well-documented interactions between him and Jeremy Perard, and the use of burner phones, and all of this franticness around trying to cover up things in the initial phase, It just reeks of complicity at a minimum, and awareness, and an active attempt to obscure truth.So, does, you know, do we get to a point where there's enough of a concern that someone has gotta get thrown under.[57:42] In a more global sense?I don't know. It could be. A lot depends, my sense is there's more anger growing in the EU than there is in the United States.I think it is funny way, United States has become so jaded about their politics that there is a kind of a numbness.Of course they are manipulating things. Of course we can't trust them.Of course they have lied to us. What else would you expect them to do?And everybody just kind of passes it off as, you know, normal business practice in DC, in the kind of normal Kabuki theatre that DC is famous for.But what I'm hearing,In my brief travels that I'm always susceptible to confirmation bias, being around people who are activists or are awake, then it makes you think that everybody is.[58:48] But because in New York, I mean, you had everyone, my worry is that there be a couple of, medium to lower profile figures who, or maybe one person, but being in Europe, I walked around and looked at the museum there, all the top of the trials, and it was to punish those who had committed wrong. It wasn't to punish one person using them as a scapegoat, everyone who did wrong, and I want them all punished. So I don't know if we'll get to that point, I think, except they'll get a pass.
 
Except the people that are guilty are so, it's such a large group. And we don't have, one of the things the dynamics in Nuremberg 1 is, you know, victory is history is written by the victors, right? And so we had the allies doing the prosecuting and the vanquished were the defendants. Here we have the world leaders are the guilty, right? Who is the equivalent of the conquering allies? There's nothing like that. There is these transnational organizations and the capital behind them and their various organs of influence and control.[1:00:12] And they're all still there. They're all still fully empowered.Why you know, they're there,I don't see how we end up with an environment where there is political appetite for accountability.[1:00:30] Unless you know and that's that was my point in the Carlton Club to the conservative MPs was if you don't, release the pressure functionally and acknowledge the harms that have been done and, and seek to provide compensation, restitution and[1:00:54] some pathway to recovery for the harms that have been done economically and physically medically. You risk an upswelling of anger that you cannot control. And the, longer you postpone it, the higher the probability that there is going to be some abrupt event where people's tolerance is exceeded. And there seems to be the belief that we're never going to reach that because we have so much control over information that we don't have to worry about it. We can completely control the narrative and there's no way that we're gonna be able to be held accountable because we'll just find ways to diffuse it or deflect it or whatever and I gotta say that the data suggests they're right.So I don't know, that's why I've been trying so hard to message, and it's a tight wire for me, because of the accusation that I'm of controlled opposition, to try to use, you know, we were talking earlier about the kind of burden of responsibility of having this level of profile and recognition. And my desire to use it for good and to use it for healing.[1:02:22] And our society has been torn asunder. There's no hiding that by the events.And if they, the more that people become aware of what has been done to them, the more likely we are to have social unrest and disruption, and all the consequences of that.Do we want revolution?Is revolution a good way to change?Is revolution an appropriate response? Because a lot of people want it. They are angry, and they want to fight, and they want to punish, and they want to hate. The hate level is just so high, and it's like a monster. That's why I love the Yates, the second coming, The beast slouching towards Bethlehem would be born is this upwelling of hate.And it is slinking along looking for a target.I don't think that gets us to the better future.[1:03:43] If anybody understands how sucky it is to be subjected to the propaganda and the attacks and vilification, it would be me. Not belittling anybody else, but certainly I've experienced that in its full glory. And I don't forgive my persecutors, but I don't hate them.[1:04:13] Somebody early, you know, had so many people counselling me, you know, hate the process, don't hate the individual. Hate the culture maybe, but don't hate the person.
Hate the sin, not the sinner.
 
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Right. Okay. Yeah, a lot of this does come down to people who went through it in a strange way. And all the logic of evil and the many levels of hell and all those metaphors. So I can fully understand people's pain and anger about, having to do with how they've been treated and the you know this logic that was propagated functionally advocating for concentration camp, isolation, isolation in home, the damage to business, you're not being able to worship in church or to congregate the direct targeting, you know, this is an epidemic of the unvaccinated.The unvaccinated are responsible for killing your grandmother.[1:05:38] The children, unmasked children are responsible for killing granny.[1:05:44] Remember, that's one of the things that's in the book is, it's captured, it's one of the Easter eggs for the aficionado's is the Yale University prospective randomized clinical trial that tested in 10 separate randomized groups messaging for what would be most effective. Essentially, they clinically tested the propaganda messaging.
[1:06:06] For before they had a jab, before they ever had a vaccine. They tested the propaganda messaging that would cause you to be most likely to take a vaccine and to convince other people in your social circle to take a vaccine. They tested that through a prospective randomized clinical trial at Yale, which it's not disclosed who funded it. It's like 600 people. That's not a cheap date.Okay. A 600 person randomized clinical trial with a six month follow-up is a minimum of a few million.Okay, could be more than that, but it's not a cheap date to run that study.Somebody dropped a lot of money on Yale to figure out the right propaganda messaging.And it's from that that we get the stuff that you saw deployed on CNN with Sesame Street.That's Big Bird, right? It was all pre-tested.Okay? And what it is, if you unpack it, is it's surreptitious advertising[1:07:16] by the government for a unlicensed experimental medical product to be deployed in children.I mean, if you go 40,000 feet, look down, unpack it, the stuff that's been done is obscene.And it certainly merits anger. To be told that you're responsible for somebody else's parents' death, is grossly irresponsible and it's violent. It's violence against people, and it's totally understandable that they're pissed off and want retaliation.Want that Nuremberg. Want to see people hanging from trees. And the problem is that if you, number one, that kind of anger will just destroy your soul and it will just corrode you.It's like acid. And the other problem is that if you keep that anger inside of you, you can never reach those people that are in that persuadable middle.And those that are awake, like those that we're probably just talking to, I doubt anybody else is going to listen to this. Those that are awake, we're basically preaching to the choir.[1:08:43] Are already convinced. So all we're doing is reinforcing them in many cases. And they may be[1:08:51] 20 to 30 percent of the population. That is not a majority. Right? We don't win elections with 20 to 30 percent of the people. Somehow we've got to get, you know, there's as Huxley, we were just earlier going over that video of Huxley from 62 in an interview in which he was presciently saying 20% of the people are completely resistant to hypnosis, 20% of people can be hypnotized with[1:09:16] a feather basically, and the remaining 60% are in a gradient between those two. And he argues that this is good for society. Society needs some fraction of people that are easily convinced[1:09:29] to go along with whatever the narrative is or the thing or the society wants. And it's useful for society to have a fraction of people who are never able to be convinced that are always basically a bunch of stray cats going their own way. These are the libertarians. And then the rest to be in some spectrum of the heat makes the case is it's adaptive in terms of social organization, which is why it's probably there, innately maintained in adaptive balance. But the point is that those of us that are in the difficult to hypnotize and awake grouparen't going to win if we just hate and hold anger in our souls as we can never convince those that are in the persuadable middle unless we approach them with an open heart. And I've said repeatedly, this is a lesson from years of consulting, no one will trust you if you don't trust them. No client will ever confer trust on you if you approach them from the base of assuming that they may be controlled opposition or whatever the thing is, right? This is the problem with the whole storyline of controlled opposition. I know of a high-profile person that leads a major[1:10:56] bonafide anti-vax group, a very successful one, who makes the case that well at least those that are asserting that others are controlled opposition are thinking, so that's a good thing, and that it's adaptive to always be questioning whether somebody else is controlled opposition.The problem with that is that that drives complete breakdown in society because if nobody can trust anybody, then we cannot exist as a social group. And trust, I think, is the foundational thing. That's why it's so harmful when it gets broken in a marriage or any interpersonal relationship. Once trust is broken, the relationship is gone. The only thing you can have left after that is some sort of transactional thing, right, where you're doing business, but even then that becomes exceedingly hard if you lose trust. So I think this is the problem that we now face is, how can we trust the people that have done this to us? How can we open our hearts? And that gets to this, as we were just saying these fundamental religious and frankly Judeo-Christian ethic-based relationship guidance that we've required over millennia.[1:12:24] Whether it's divinely inspired or just the product of human society, collective wisdom over you know millennia, whatever it is the idea that you you have to forgive in order to heal, And one of the things, because I've had many times in my life where I've been hurt by people, doing stuff, you know, you know my story of the origins here, my nervous breakdown of the soul and all that, you know, there's a lot of things I have to be angry about. And there are times when I have wished for revenge. But with the tincture of time, and you know, wisdom from the, living. I love the saying the person who goes seeking revenge should first dig two graves. If you seek revenge it will destroy you. You may or may not succeed in destroying your home but you will definitely lose your soul.[1:13:33] And I think if we're going to heal as a society, even just to the simple transactional level of, building a political majority so we can hold the bad guys responsible and try to make it so this doesn't happen again, you know, try to put laws in place so that we can't have government overreach like this, try to change the laws so that we make it explicitly illegal to breach, we were just talking about Nuremberg, the Nuremberg court Helsinki agreement, the Belmont report, the common rule, these fundamentals of medical ethics that have just been thrown right down the garbage incinerator as if they mattered not at all, so casually we discarded them. Which was the thing that really people ask what did you, you know, what really red-coated you. One of the key things was this willingness to just throw away the fundamentals of biomedical ethics, that we've seen. It's all justified of course because it was such a public health crisis that we couldn't afford the morality of following well-established biomedical ethics.That's the other thing about this, Jill points out a lot, is[1:14:58] we are paying for these public health officers. We're paying for these leaders that were supposed to guide us and were supposed to be trained and experienced and seasoned to the point that they would not overreact, to the point that they would provide us with a mature appropriate response, to a true threat assessment. And instead they lost their minds. They were consumed apparently by fear, greed, I don't know what, but an appropriate public health response was not what we got. We did not get what we paid for.And I think we have a justifiable cause to complain about this.This is why I just loved being in Mexico last week and testifying in the Senate is[1:15:57] we all have our stereotypes about different nations, like we can all agree, and want to poke at the Italians for their corruption, right? I mean, this is universal.You know, the Germans have certain characteristics, the French have certain characteristics, And there's a whole joke about that and the British cook.Right? But what the Mexicans are not supposed to be by stereotype a mature political organization.That's not the stereotype.[1:16:40] And yet the government in Mexico and the president in particular saw what was happening and recognized that there was a lot of propaganda being pushed.And maybe it's, you know, being a Latin American country that, I don't know if you in the UK, they know this little saying, poor Mexico, so far from God and so close to the United States.Right? There's wisdom in that. Right? And so, you know, Mexico has seen American shenanigans, United States shenanigans, their entire history, right? The truth is we stole California from Mexico. I mean, that's what we did, right? And so, for whatever reason, they were able to provide to their populace a much more mature response.[1:17:39] And to not engage in these egregious breaches of sovereignty and freedom and allowed the, contingent. And it's not that the outcome wasn't that great for Mexico. They're near the top of overall mortality, but they have a population that is quite obese in general, has a lot of, kind of pro-inflammatory diabetes or pre-diabetes, the things that are known to be risk factors.[1:18:18] And they lost a lot of people. It's strange though in Mexico there are sub-populations like people that are more genetically the old Mayan native Indian populations which tend to not be obese.They tend to be shorter, thinner people, had virtually no mortality. So in any case, Mexico is an example that leadership did not have to overreact like they did. And I think that's one of the things that, you know, people don't talk about that. What the heck happened here?[1:18:59] I think this is one of the discussions we have to have is why did the Western governments, particularly the Five Eyes nations, but also Austria overreact on this? And why was it considered acceptable to deploy military grade psy ops on civilian populations by these countries that, you know, those in the, in the, they're really all the British tradition, you know, even in America, we still go back to the common law and Magna Carta were still rooted in British law. And the stereotype was that Great Britain, Canada, New Zealand, Australia, the United States were all so civilized and freedom-loving and yet they went totally overboard. What the heck happened here?I think that's, the African states didn't fall for that.Not even South Africa kind of gave lip service, but my understanding is in South Africa, vaccine cards, which are really doled out and have no relationship to whether or not what took a jab are the norm.[1:20:27] Yeah, I think we, this, as you point out, this book is a starting point.It's a way to help people along the journey and make their own assessment, which I think any thinking person has an obligation, really, to their children, to society, to try to process what has happened here and think through what is it that we want to do about it, because otherwise they're just going to continue to do it to us. It's power propaganda and fifth generation warfare technology and information control and the logic that it's necessary to preserve democracy.[1:21:11] To have censorship. How perverted is that? All of these Orwellian things and you're here visiting us from the UK, we, I think here in the United States and in the West in general, we owe a huge debt to British culture and British intellectuals. In particular, Huxley and his, and the one, and the person that he mentored Orwell, and their in their prescient awareness of where this thrust towards a centralized global government was going. It's captured in so many of the UN Charter and so many other documents from back in the 40s. And I one of the one of, our followers pointed out to me that I'm very indebted for that, in an early edition of 1984, Orwell wrote a forward, in which he predicted the rise of a pharmaceutical state in which we would all be.Pharmaceutical control to become passive and acceptance. You know, I think a case can be made that we're already doing this with our children, with Ritalin, things like that, they're little boys.[1:22:37] And that in his opinion, the only way to avoid this as the eventual outcome of the totalitarian[1:22:47] state that he was envisioning this totalitarian pharmaceutical state specifically, was to push towards decentralization, which is one of the key components in the last section of the book, is various examples of intentional communities being formed in Italy and the need to grow your own food and become more self-sufficient.And this is what Orwell believed was the only way that we could escape this dark, totalitarian, pharmaceutical future that he envisioned we were being driven towards.What a gift. It's so unfortunate that we haven't paid attention to that. Let's try.And maybe, hopefully, it's not too late.[1:23:40] Well, I appreciate you giving me your time in the middle of slotting into the middle of[1:23:46] a hectic schedule, as I know you have all the time. Lies, my government told me you can get it as a hardback, you can get it as an ebook. And also to those watching, if you, well, of course you will have signed up to Dr. Malone's substack, but do consider clicking that button where you can actually pay for the content. I think it's vital that we all have learned to consume information for free, but there is a cost to actually put that information out. One way, I think probably the easiest way people can support you and what you're doing is simply click on that and to turn your free subscription into a paid subscription. You may not want to say that, but I can happily say that.
I'm really poor at shopping for money. But thanks for saying that.
And it has been fun and thanks for coming and visiting.
Thank you. And I hope you'll be here again.
 
Wife permitting.
I'm positive wife will be here. She, you know, as you know, my wife is a dual citizen, US and UK.And she always likes to have folks visit us or chances to interact with people from the UK just as like her native culture.So thanks for coming and[1:25:10] thanks also for your courage. You've been right at the forefront politically and speaking out in a very challenging environment.I mean, I've come to learn it's even more challenging in the UK than it was here in terms of the censorship and oversight and pressure from the government.
But you do as you say, you do what you do, it's in front of you and you learn from great mentors. Thank you.

Chad Connelly - How Faith Wins is Educating, Activating and Mobilizing Churches Across America

Christianity and politics have a love hate relationship in the US. Despite the separation of church and state, many churches are highly engaged in the political process but they are not always well informed of the issues. Chad Connelly’s work as chairman of his state Replication Party was recognised by the White House and he became the first ever Faith Envoy for the Republican National Committee (RNC). Through this role he built up church engagement to another level and has continued this endeavour through Faith Wins. Chad joins us to discuss the importance of voter registration, providing leaders with resources, identifying church liaisons and connecting with political thought leaders.Founder Chad Connelly was the Republican National Committee’s first-ever National Director of Faith Engagement, a key position that influenced the elections of 2016. Having been elected to two terms as the Chairman of the South Carolina Republican Party, Chad set new fundraising records for the party, hosted two nationally televised debates that brought over $50 million in revenue and advertising exposure to the state, and held the largest Presidential Preference Primary at that time in South Carolina’s history with over 607,000 voting in the election. Since 2013, he’s traveled to 43 states and spoke to more than 82,000 pastors and faith leaders about the importance of pastoral leadership in the public arena. His work has led to trusted relationships with a wide variety of denominational and organizational ministry leaders across the nation and resulted in the highest evangelical turnout and vote in modern American political history in the 2016 elections. He has appeared on numerous national television shows and has been a featured commentator on Fox News, CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC and others. Chad is well known in political and religious circles around the nation as an effective speaker, relationship builder and prolific fundraiser and is in demand as an inspirational speaker on a variety of topics. Chad is passionate about his home state of South Carolina, America and her true history but is most passionate about his family: his wife Dana and their four children. Chad is a life-long South Carolinian and he and his family live in Prosperity, SC.Faith Wins is dedicated to educating, activating and mobilizing faith leaders, helping them leverage their influence and impact within the governmental and political arena.https://faithwins.org/Interview recorded 24.2.23Audio Podcast version available on Podbean and all major podcast directories... ⁣https://heartsofoak.podbean.com/To sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Please subscribe, like and share!
[0:22] Hello, Hearts of Oak and welcome to another interview coming up in a moment with Chad Connelly. Chad Connelly heads up Faith Wins, an organization in America that engages churches and politics. I met him a couple of weeks ago at a conference in Miami and was intrigued and excited by hearing his background story. So in this interview, we talk about how he got involved in politics and how he became the first national director of faith engagement in the Republican Party, a position which here in the UK we would be desperate for. Over in the US you've had this, and that was during 2016 during Trump's presidency, his first presidency. So we talk about how that happened, how he ruled that across the country, got engaged with churches, got them connected with politics and got them voting, got them inspired and got their congregations understanding what political engagement was about.Now we go into Faith Wins, the organization he started post that.So I know you'll enjoy this conversation with Chad Connelly.[1:34] It is absolutely wonderful to have Chad Connelly with us today. Chad, thank you for your time today.
Honoured to be here with you. I really am, Peter, and I appreciate the opportunity, brother.
Not at all. I had the absolute honour and privilege of meeting Chad over in Miami a few weeks ago, sitting at the table together and also listening to you speak. So I'm looking forward to unpacking a little bit about your story and what you do and to our viewers and listeners, faithwins.org is where you can find more of Chad. We'll get into that a little bit more.The links are in the description. If you're listening on any podcasting apps, Podbean, any podcasting apps, all the links are there so you can keep in touch. But just to our UK viewers, our non-US viewers, Chad served as chairman of the South Carolina Republican Party, the first ever national director of faith engagement for the RNC or the Republican National Committee, for those of us not on stateside, and founder and president of Faith Wins. Now before we get into some of that Chad, you were literally born in Prosperity. I've never come across this. A town in South Carolina is called Prosperity. I thought it was a typo, but no, you're born in Prosperity.
Yes, you know prosperity is a really small town, Peter. It's probably, you know, you probably heard me make the joke.There are four or five hundred people counting the dogs and cats.[3:03] So it's a small little town, a great slice of rural America.But I grew up here and actually built a home here.My mom and dad, my mom's passed now, but my mom dad's house is behind me and my grandparents house is behind them.And I never really thought I'd come back to little town, but I travel so much.I really enjoyed the little town feel.[3:25] It's always good to come back home. Always good to come back home.Chad, your background is in business, but maybe you can tell us how you moved from being involved in business to being involved in politics.[3:41] Yeah. You know, Peter, I went to college, got my degree in engineering, got into the corporate world.I was doing design and engineering testing. It wasn't that I didn't enjoy it.I did, but I watched my dad lose a career in downsizing in the late 80s and my career was going up, and his was ending and it just, it changed my life.I decided I wanted to be on my own.And at about that time I had been in the army, I'd served in the army and I think that my military service made me come to grips with what's this thing called freedom?Why do we have it? What's it about?And I think it wasn't that I disrespected the idea of freedom, it was, I didn't really grasp it.You know how it is when you're 16 or 18 or 20, you have all the answers, none of the questions, but you have the answers.And life has a way of making you think through stuff. And so I was in the army and I started thinking, man, people died for this thing called freedom.And it started me really on a journey to examine my freedom, what the gifts we've been given, the blessings of liberty, and then that, It made me deeper in my faith.It made me realize God's had his hand on me[4:55] my whole life and where people can deny that or ignore it or act like it's not true, they can't deny the things going on in their lives and they see around them. And so I was a Christian, I'd give my heart to Christ in my teen years, of course wasn't very serious about it. Married my college sweetheart and I got more serious about my faith. And I think the army was big in that Peter because you know, you start thinking about why would somebody die for something and Jesus died for all of us. And so I started reading biblical worldview books and those books really are what got me in my own business. It got me speaking for a living, got me coaching other people to get in their own business, and it really gave me an appreciation for the whole idea of America and for freedom. That's the short version, but then God just moved me into politics. And I'll give you more of it, but I'll let you talk and ask any other questions on that part.
 
It's always interesting now people get involved in politics. I mean, I love politics. I lived and read politics for years, work in the House of Lords, all of that. But I always loved to find out how anyone made that leap because when we talk to people on the street, people generally seem disengaged with the political process. So what attracted you to begin to get involved in politics?[6:13] Well, you know, it was really reading the biblical worldview books and biblical worldview is we all have a worldview, right? We all have a way, a foundation, how we think, what we believe.And to me, it all boils down to one question, and that is, who says?There are only two answers. Man says, where there's no standard but me and you, which seems very haphazard to me, or God says.And if God says there's a standard, and if our standard is God and the Bible and the Holy Word, then that begins to inform our decision-making.And so when I was studying biblical worldview, I started realizing, oh boy, this,[6:49] here's why people turn from the faith or don't get involved in religion or relationship with Jesus.They don't want accountability. A lot of people, a lot of my friends, and they think, well, I don't want to be accountable to anybody. And I started realizing I am accountable. I am my brother's keeper. I'm responsible for myself and my family, my children, the people around me, my sphere of influence. I've been given this great blessing of being born in this free land.And that started to motivate me to, boy, there ought to be more like-minded people involved in this political thing, not just as a president or a congressman or woman, but school boards, city council.And so the more I read in those areas, I said, boy, I think God's telling me I better be involved in this.If I'm unhappy about something going on politically, it's really not political, Peter.It's spiritual. all our lives in a biblical worldview, my God's big enough to be in everything, everywhere, all the time.And while there's no question that people, I say the media and the left.[7:54] And I think that applies everywhere, have kind of taught us Christians out of being involved.You know, they say, ooh, you Christians shouldn't be involved in it.You're gonna offend somebody. And we're the very ones who don't wanna offend somebody.And so we put on our turn the other cheek Jesus, when really we might oughta find turn the tables over Jesus.And so the first thing I did in politics is, I did door knocking to get people to vote for a friend of mine for Congress in Charlotte, North Carolina, a great lady named Sue Myrick.After that, I actually went to Boston, Massachusetts and helped a guy named Mitt Romney run against Ted Kennedy.I had read about Senator Kennedy and the whole Chappaquiddick thing, and I couldn't believe anybody would vote for the guy.And so here's this little lost Southern boy, Peter, knocking on doors, you ought to vote for Mitt Romney.And of course, I didn't get a great response, but I felt compelled to do it.And I kind of had the bug. My boys came along,[8:51] CJ who's now 25, I was born in 97, Bennett was born in 2000, and we started doing political campaigns. They would sippy cup in a hand, a pacifier to mouth and a vote for somebody signed.That was how they grew up. And I got involved in the school choice movement.I got involved in the pro-life movement.I got on some boards. In 02, I actually wrote my first book called Freedom Time, where I was just explaining to people, you should be involved, get involved in the process.Don't sit over here on the side-lines and complain and whine and fuss and cuss.Get involved, make a difference.And after that, in 05, my wife Michelle, I met in college, her mom died, spun her into a deep depression.In July of 06, she took her own life, committed suicide, left me a single dad with two little boys who saw something nobody should ever see.But God used this too, Peter. It's a deep, raw part of my story and God's been good.I'm remarried, but I had spoken at Chick-fil-A the week before that.I said something I never remembered saying. I probably didn't say this when you saw me speak in Miami.[10:00] I said something I'd never remembered saying all the times I ever spoken.And I so didn't trust how bad Michelle was.I left her at her dad's home nearby and I went to Chick-fil-A headquarters in Atlanta.And I was doing a marriage and family talk, very humbling.Nobody in the audience knew my wife was home with deep depression, much less would put a gun in her mouth a week later. The boys were five and nine,they were sitting in the corner of the room, Peter, and I said, you know, I've messed up, I've made mistakes, but before God, man, I'm not going to be a failure with my wife and my boys. And I remember looking at the boys over there in the corner and going, hey, Lord, that was good. I'm going to I'm going to use that again.The next Sunday, we come in to find her. And I knew she was bad,I didn't I didn't know she had had some blues more than more like not really depression, more like deep blues throughout our marriage, but not that bad.And I knew it was bad, but I never thought she'd do that. Anyway, we get in from church to find her.The boys are on my heels.[11:06] I pick her up to cover, I didn't want them to see, right? And so I go to your room, go to your room, go to your room.I pull her close to me, I lay her back down.And in my spirit, I feel the devil say, ha ha, you failed. Immediately I feel the Lord put his arm around me and say this wasn't my plan but I have a plan for Satan's disruption. And as I'm laying my wife of 18 and a half years back down on the ground on the floor, Romans 8 28, now you probably know the scripture, I wasn't studying it, I wasn't reading it at that point but I had put it in my heart and the scripture says, and we know that all, things work together for good of those who love God and are called according purpose. And I'd read that scripture over and over again, and I don't know if anybody out there reads the Bible, there's times you read it and you're not sure what you read.Other times it leaps up off the pages and punch you and just really grabs you. And so Romans 8 28, I laid her back down and it came to mind. And I said, really Lord, all things?All things? All things? My wife's in a pool of blood. All things, Lord? Really? And he, And he said to me, did you believe it yesterday?Yes, Lord, I did.So I need you to trust me and believe it today. And I told him I would. Now, I was a mess.I had three or four months. I couldn't get off the mat, Peter. The boys, I sobbed.Michelle's my best friend.[12:31] I went back to my pro-life board several months later, and there's a guy in there who's in heaven now.He passed away a few months ago.And he just, three meetings in a row kept coming at me. Chad, you gotta meet this girl.You gotta meet this girl.I'm like, "JD, I love you, leave me alone. Get out my face",[12:47] I don't have time for any girl. I got two little boys that saw their mom come in. I mean, it's awful.It's awful. I don't wish it on anybody." He said, "you ought to meet this girl". And he got in my face at the second meeting. He said, "Chad, you're Mr. Positive. I've been watching you speak for years.This is not going to beat you". He said, "you know that talk you do about counting your blessings?"And I said, "yeah, JD, I wrote it". He said, "read your notes". And you know how a Christian brother, sometimes has to hold us accountable. And literally, I prayed for accountability and responsibility partners. And I went home that day and I read my notes and the Lord gave me three very specific prayers. I wrote down 103 blessings. I go to the next meeting. He says, "you got to meet this girl". And I finally said, "what's her name?" He said, "Dana". And I said, "JD, big question. How did she become single?"And he hung his head and he said, "man, I'm sorry to tell you, but same way you did". Turns out her husband committed suicide, Peter, almost two years to the the day before my wife.And she had two little girls, I had two little boys, and long story made short, six months later we were married, and today the kids are 25, 23, 22, and 21. We're blessed and highly favoured.That's been 15 years ago.It's the most monumental thing in my life though, to watch God work that way.And when people tell me there's no God, I don't have enough faith to be an atheist, I just don't.[14:07] It takes a lot of faith to think that we have the answers, that all this came because of an accident, that's beyond common sense.And I've watched God work in my life.And it doesn't mean he works the same way with people and he's got a purpose to fulfil.That scripture, Romans 8.28, if your audience hasn't read it, You ought to go read it.And we know all things work together for good of those who love God and are called according to His purpose.Now at the time, I had felt called into politics, Peter. I didn't know how, I didn't know what.I didn't know if it was elected or work behind the scenes.I was very involved in the school choice movement, the pro-life movement, and I thought it was that way.When Dana came along, I got back involved. As you said, I ran for state party chairman, and anybody who's familiar with American politics knows our state of South Carolina, you will be here a lot. You know, it picks presidents.[15:02] Ten out of the last 11 Republican nominees were whoever won in South Carolina. And we have what we call carve out states. There's Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, and South Carolina. So I did every political show on television. It was a big bright spotlight on our state. And on one of those shows, a guy named Reince Priebus, and if you're political folks that are watching, have paid attention. He was Trump's, President Trump's first chief of staff. He saw me on television, and I was basically beating up the party for leaving out the faith vote. That was the long and short of my talk that day on that TV show. And Reince, I knew him, I voted for him, but I didn't have any kind of relationship with the guy. And so he texted me. He said, 'hey, I'm a believer too.'I'd like to talk to you. You're right. We should be involved more. Let's talk about it. That's how That's how I got to be the first ever national director of faith engagement.Of course, I helped Trump in 16. I actually went to 43 states and spoke to 80-something thousand pastors just telling them, you got to get involved.How can you have a Matthew 5, salt and light, biblical worldview and not engage?How are you going to be salt and light if you're not engaged?And just imploring them to get involved.And then of course I left the RNC,[16:11] I didn't go work in the White House. I think I was probably Reince Priebus's only senior staffer not to go work in the Trump White House.And that's when I started Faith Wins. But man, we exist to just get Christians involved and let your voices be heard, not just your votes.And that's the short version. Look, I'm so honoured, Peter, I've gotten to watch God work in my life.He didn't always choose to do it that way. And that's where faith comes in.But the fact that a man named Jesus hung on a tree for me and for you is just amazing.[16:42] And what is it? Some 67,000 historical references by non-biblical figures that prove the life, the death, the burial, the resurrection of Jesus Christ.And to get to watch him working life, it's humbling, brother.
Chad, I love when you say that when you talk to atheists, I have the same conversation that I couldn't possibly have their faith to look at the complexity of the universe of the world, to think of simply the human body, never mind the universe, and to come to believe that actually there's no greater designer, figure body out there that actually is luck and chance.I said, well, you've got a lot more faith than I have, so I don't know how you come.So I agree completely. But I, National Director of Faith Engagement, that for a new role, you're the first person in that, that's quite intriguing because you get an opportunity to make that your own.You're not coming in a job description, but actually you get this and you think, wow, how can I take this right across the country?Tell me about those early days with something brand new, how you actually built that out.
Yeah, that's a great question. You know what, nobody ever asked me.I do a bunch of TV and radio and podcasts.[18:06] Very few people ask that. I literally told Priebus, Reince, we got to do this right.Let's don't do a political approach.Let's do a spiritual approach. Let's talk to them about their biblical responsibilities.I told him, I said, Reince, I'm not going to push a candidate.I'm not going to push the party. I'll work for the party, but I really think God let me do something to go to all these different, because you know there are different groups of denominations and all the segments of Christians and churches.I really think working for the party, the blessing was I got to wade through all of that and say, look, I'm not here to split doctrinal hairs.I'm not here to discuss our differences.But if we don't unify over things like the defence of Israel, that's biblical, life, it's biblical.[18:53] Traditional marriage, it's biblical, religious liberty. Man, I can say sovereignty of states and borders.It's biblical. Those are biblical spiritual issues, not political.Now they've been politicized, but that doesn't remove my responsibility as a Christian, a dad, a husband, a Sunday school teacher.I got to tell the truth.And so when Reince and I sat down, that's exactly what I told him.That's the exact conversation I had with him.And I said, I need your assurance. You'll give me the latitude to do this the right way.And I said, Reince, it's no offense, but there are very few people in this political world who've done politics at the level I've done it, been a state party chairman, run a bunch of races, but also are Christian first.It's like they separate, right? It's like you described, and I think it happens everywhere.Some of it's intentional, some of it's fear driven. Some of it's just, I don't wanna deal with it.It's an ugly mess. I can't tell you Peter how many people say well we shouldn't get involved in politics. It's it's a dirty business. I'm like[19:56] if you're been to a meeting, I'm not deep in meetings can be political I know what that's exactly why we as Christians should be involved. It's a dirty mess, We should permeate society in every way and let's face it. This is where we failed So this conversation of you asking me that Reince Priebus and I to his great credit and he's a great friend and mentor.We sat down and had this very talk, fleshing this out. What's it look like?And I said, well, first Reince.You can't contact my pastor buddies. You can't ask them for money. You can't ping them about you must vote this way You cannot irritate them and and I'll tell you the truth when I first built my list I said you can't ping them. You can't hit them up with emails and all that junk. I[20:43] salted the list y'all probably use that term, I put fake names in the email list to make sure that he communicated with his data people. We're not doing this and it was about ten days somebody in the data department, hit up my pastors and one of my fake emails got the email.So I called Reince and said, hey man, we're not doing this. We're not gonna bug these pastors.And again, to his great credit, he made sure there was a firewall.And then I started keeping my own list and I didn't give it to him.I just said, I gotta have my word and integrity.So I quit giving cell phone numbers and emails to the party, which of course was much weeping and gnashing of teeth.But I want it to be authentic relationships, Peter. I think that relationships matter.I think our world right now is going through a time it doesn't value relationships like it, but I think it will again.I think we're gonna get back to a very high touch personal relationship driven society again, in your country and mine.If they value the ideas of liberty and freedom, we're gonna get back to where that person to person relationship matters far more than a digital ad or a television ad or whatever.And so when we started the program, I'm telling you, the people in the RMC building, the political people, it was, it was, they didn't get it.Quite frankly, a lot of them still don't. And they don't want to deal with pastors.They want to be able to say, hey, we control this or we've got the data or we can contact them.[22:12] And I was like, no, no, no, no, we're not doing it that way.
About that because you look at one, first question is how did this position only start at that point?Secondly, how you kind of from over here, maybe in the UK, we look at the Republican Party as as a party that many Christians, we look at America's Christianity is not something to be ashamed or afraid about and people wear it on their sleeves passionately. So how did the RNC not really get it at the beginning.[22:47] Well, it's interesting. Part of this is the denominational differences. Part of it is, they're in political mode first, and you and I are Christians first. I tell people all the time I'm a Christian, that I'm a conservative, I happen to be a Republican because their belief system lines up most closely. And I also tell pastors, you're not going to find perfect. There are no perfect candidates. Only Jesus was perfect. He's the only one.And therefore, since there are no perfect candidates, there are no perfect parties either.And goodness, Peter, I'm married with four kids.We can't get our kids to agree on a Whopper or a Big Mac. That's normal.And Reagan said that, right? Reagan said, if you're 80% of my friend, it doesn't make you 20% of my enemy.And so we try to teach those lessons that you're looking for the person that most closely aligns.And I told them, don't vote on the party, don't vote on the candidate, don't vote on a personality, vote on policies and principles. So when we were building this, it was a complete oddity to the people inside the political structure. No doubt about it.And I think, let's face it, a lot of the political types will check a box.Okay, I'm covering the Hispanics, I'm covering the black vote, I'm covering the faith vote, whatever.And I think what Priebus did that set apart the RNC, and they've not done since to my my knowledge is he had a very specific plan for every segment of that.[24:10] And he had authentic people connecting with people of like mind and talking to them.Even if they didn't agree on issues, he really was intentional about authentic evangelicals talking to evangelicals and Hispanics talking to Hispanics down the line trying to really[24:27] go back to a basic relationship model. And let's face it, it worked.In 2014, we flipped nine US Senate seats, hadn't been done in 150 years.In 2016, a guy named Donald Trump hit a record.You know, and probably not the most evangelical guy to run, right?And again, we didn't tell him who to vote for.Romney, in 2012, had hit 78%. 78% of the self-identified evangelicals voted for the Republican candidate in 2012. And I told Reince at the time, I said, Reince, if you ever hit 80%, the left can't win. I don't care if they're running for dog catcher or president and Trump hit 81%. And I believe it was because we were very intentional about going into areas and running up the score. We found that there were a lot of people sitting in churches who thought, my vote doesn't count. I don't care about this. I don't want to go to go vote. And our deal was, I'm going to get to know the pastor. And hey, Pastor Peter.[25:26] Listen, let's talk about this and I'll tell you to vote for, but can you do two things?Can you make sure they're registered to vote? And can you teach them to vote by the Bible?That's it. You don't have to say Republican. You don't have to say a candidate like a Trump or a particular Senator, but can you register to vote? And can you teach them to vote biblical values and use voter guides and so forth.I tell people, look, I'm not trying to get you to charge the beach at D-Day.Can you register everybody?And can you give them the vote biblical values? Those are our asks.And that's not difficult.And listen, you've read scripture, Matthew five. Jesus says, if you're not salt, I know you're probably familiar with this, then you are good for nothing to be thrown in the street and trodden under the feet of men.Not about you, Peter, or any other believers out there. I don't wanna be standing before the Father because we will all stand before the Father and be told I was good for nothing.That seems like a really bad life to me. And let's face it,[26:27] I think our world's hurting for purpose. You know, suicide's a big deal to me, obviously. We live through it.My wife and her girls lived through it. The girls lived through it.My boys live through it. It's horrible. You don't wish on anybody.When you see suicide rates like our world sees, you realize we're missing purpose.[26:47] They're missing purpose. And some people are retrievable. There are things going on.Michelle's depression was real.I don't doubt that it's real, but it goes back to purpose. and she felt like she lost purpose.And I know that from my experience. And so I think the political world is a great purpose for people.Go out and make a difference. You know, I was a Little League baseball coach because I wanted to make a difference.I'm a Sunday school teacher because I want to make a difference.I'm involved in my local community because I want to make a difference.You know, we had a family friend, his wife's got an incurable disease.My wife and I organized the Sunday school class to take a meal, just to take a little burden off because I want to make a difference.And there's so many unfilled needs out there that government is fulfilling wrongly in my opinion, that people like me and you, because scripture says the church and the individual should take care of people.There's not a jot, tittle or phrase about the government doing it, especially through coercion like we're seeing now.You must, and we're gonna tax you super high. So my whole message is get involved, Christian, get involved, find purpose. God's got a plan in your life, he doesn't make accidents, and so figure out what that is and spend the rest of your life doing it.[27:59] I want to ask you about your church engagement because I for this conversation with my church about abortion and pro-life, there is an absolute fear to engage that no, no, we need to be very careful what we say because we would offend people and there's an inability to come out and say this is what we believe but we will love those who have failed.And that's quite different from, I remember the one time was over in the States, quite a few four years ago in Houston, Second Baptist Church Houston, Reverend Ed Young, at Phenomenal Church and Tucker Carlson happened to be speaking that evening on a Saturday.I just was blown away by the....Intentionality, I think, of bringing your faith into any realm of public life.In the UK there's that mass of separation.I mean, talk to us about that because that is quite exciting, that engagement generally with churches, in not only politics but across the board in public life.[29:12] Yeah, you know, I think as a Christian, the more you read the Word, the closer you get to God, the more, you know, my prayer is, Lord, I need wisdom today, every day, 15 minutes.I want to be more Christ-like.I want to have a better walk.And when you say those prayers, kind of dangerous prayers, if you will, right?Then what do you have for me, Lord?Then there's a response. You know, faith without works is dead.We don't get to heaven by our works, but our works are a response to what He's done for us. He died for our sins. So how do I say thank you?I believe it's by engaging, by activating, by doing my part.And part of that's the justice the Bible talks about. God is justice. God is just.The Bible doesn't talk about fairness, except with the weather and fair ladies, I believe, but justice is God.[30:05] And how do I let the murder of innocent babies go without me speaking up if I'm a Christian?And there are two victims, right? a girl and there's a baby that we take a life and I think they've been lied to.Listen, this is deeply personal to me. I know so many friends who've, and they didn't see a way out.My wife's involved in a local crisis pregnancy centre.[30:30] We've marched, we've counselled, my son and his fiancé started a pro-life group on their college campus at Clemson.It's deeply personal and I don't want to condemn people because, yep, with the grace of God, lie, right? And so we're all sinners saved by grace. We've all fallen short of The Glory[30:47] Of God. None of us is righteous, no, not one. We go right down the Roman road scriptures and we realize, you know, none of us is perfect. And so I don't want to condemn somebody who's made a horrible mistake. But I also want to reach out to them and I want to make sure they don't make that second mistake. And I told my kids, listen, mistakes aren't fatal for you. What you got to do is take them as learning experiences. I don't want you to be scared of making a mistake and I don't want to minimize the death of a baby as a mistake but in a bigger sense you want to think about it was I did something I can't undo. You know Michelle did something we can't undo. It's a horrible thing. I believe she got to heaven and she figured that out. But also understand that people do things every day they're influenced by their people around them or,mass media or whatever else. And we got to reach out to them and love on them and tell them there's a different way and tell them that there's a thing called forgiveness. And you know, he removes your sin as far as the east is from the west. So there's nothing that you or I do or have done that Jesus isn't willing to forgive us for except denying Him and the Holy Spirit, obviously. And so he is about forgiveness. That's why he died.He knew what we were going to do before he hung on the tree.And so my response to that knowledge, the more I read the Bible, the more I understand[32:10] that, is I got to get involved.And part of that is loving on people who've been through stuff relating to them, but also in a political sense, standing up for truth.And truth is, God made every single one of us with His perfect design.We messed it up, but He had a plan. He had a purpose.And Peter, if he had a plan and a purpose through the decision my wife made to commit suicide, then he's got a plan and a purpose. And far be it from me to question that.I don't understand it.It's beyond my capability to understand. But I do know God's got a plan and a purpose for me and for you and for everybody else watching and listening.What's up to for me is to find out when he strikes us with this thing about abortion, You know, our nation alone, we've taken what, some 65 million babies' lives.And who did we kill in the name of choice? Who did we kill in the name of convenience?Who did we snuff out a life far too soon because it didn't fit our plans?And so I've got a friend who was conceived by rape.[33:15] And I have a pastor whose granddaughter was conceived by rape.And I dare you, when somebody says, yeah, but rape, whatever, incest, why don't you tell Ryan, or that, and I won't mention her name, why don't you tell those two people their lives don't matter?And I think people don't think through that sometimes. And let's face it, we're in a society now where emotions and feelings count more than facts and that'll recentre. We'll get back to truth.
Not completely and no one is too far, whatever they've done, whatever has happened is too far from God's ability to reach out as he is all powerful. Can I ask you about[33:59] Faith Wins. Faith Wins is all about engaging Christians and helping them understand that Christians have a responsibility to vote according to their values. Tell us about that journey. Why did you start it? You'd finish your time in the White House with that responsibility. You started Faith Wins. Tell us why and give us that journey.
 
You know, I really, I think that when I left the the RNC and I just thought I should do this through a ministry side as opposed to through a political side.I think that pastors do respond better to the ministry angle than they do to a political angle and it just, it was a God thing.It really was a God thing. I was driving along one night and Faith Wins came in my mind.It was a prayer result. I believe God answered prayer.You know, what do you call this? If I do this on my own? Of course, now the responsibility is mine.Go raise money. Go tell people about what we're doing.But our laser focus is building relationships with pastors to get them to engage the culture.[35:06] I mean, Peter, we're living in a time when, I don't know if it's like this in your country, this whole, if a boy feels like a girl, he should swim or race or wrestle or whatever else against a biological girl. And that's pure insanity.And it defies common sense. How about those girls that have been working their whole lives?And I'll tell you what it tells me. I told a pastor yesterday and I with this.[35:31] The first time somebody said, if a boy feels like a girl, he should go to a girl's bathroom. Here's what I know.There wasn't a Christian in the room with a backbone.[35:39] Because if my mama, who's in heaven now, had been in the room when somebody said something that stupid, she would have picked up a chair and whopped somebody upside the head.It defies common sense. And so we're told, oh, you can't talk like that.And that's offensive. Listen, let's get people like that help.You know, that's not healthy for them. And this whole sexualization of children and genital mutilate, I mean, that's,[36:05] that's evil. That's demonic. That's not doing them a favour. But, you know, I live with somebody who had mental illness.I get it. Let's get them help. And some people you can't help.I'm the first to say it. We did everything we knew to do with her.But when you look at all the things going on around that movement and the the apologists who are pushing for it, it shows me that there are not enough Christians around. And all that's a big reason I started Faith Wins. Just go get involved, Christian.Don't sit on the side-lines. You will be held accountable for what you do and don't do.
Part of Faith Wins is about providing leaders with resources.Tell us how you do that.
Yeah, you know what we do is we teach them how to do voter registration.We hand out voter guides. We distribute them digitally and printed.We make sure they know about who's running. We get involved in judges races.We get involved on anti gambling, pro life, pro traditional marriage.We'd get involved in all sorts of things like that and we just educate them.We provide them the tools. Most states that means voter guides.It means how to conduct voter registration. It probably means having a pastor come in to train their people.It kind of runs the full slate of whatever it takes.We make an assessment of what do they need in that area and we go at it.
When you engage with churches, what are the conversations? I guess you meet some people who are engaged politically.[37:32] But I guess, as I've known for many of my conversations, you meet many people who are completely disengaged.Tell us about that and how those conversations go.[37:44] I remember the first time I got a pushback from a pastor. I was in a town in Colorado in 2013.And I knew it was coming, but I'd never really heard it framed.And I already felt like some people hide behind the pulpit, some people just don't want to deal with it.Some people, they think I'm gonna make somebody mad. So this pastor said, "Chad, we just, you know, I appreciate what you're doing. I just, we don't get political."And I didn't know what to say.And it kind of, you know, took me aback. And so when I don't know what to say, I always whisper a quick prayer. "Okay, Lord, you better give me something."And then I ask a question, what do you mean? And it gives me a chance to think.And he said, "well, you know, we don't talk about controversial stuff."And here's what the Lord gave me."Well, do y'all talk about the Bible? He preached the whole council of God, as scripture says."He said, "what do you mean?" I said, "well, I don't believe life is a political issue.It's a spiritual issue.Traditional marriage, religious liberty, defensive visual, I can go down the line.Those are biblical issues.And yes, pastor, they've been politicized, but how does that remove our responsibility to be salt and light?" He said, "nobody's ever told me that." And then last fall, I had a pastor, I was in the state of Wisconsin.[38:53] This pastor got saved late in life, tattooed, full-arm tattoos.Pretty big church in a medium-sized town in Wisconsin.He came up to me and he hosted our meeting because my pastor that works on my team had asked him to be the host. He said, "Chad, I wanted to host because your pastor's a long-time buddy. He's been a mentor.But I just gotta tell you, I'm pretty sceptical."I said, "pastor, what are you sceptical about?" He said, "well, I just guessed the whole political thing."I said, "do you think I want you to be political?"He said, "yeah, I thought so." I said, "no, no, I want you to be biblical."[39:28] He said, "I don't think I understand". I said, "you should stick around for my talk."So I did, he said, "I can't, I'm too busy."I looked out, I did my 15 minute talk.He was out there.David Barton did his 40 minute talk. He was out there. When we got done, our conversation and our avenue, our approach to explaining it, he comes over, he grabs you by the arm firmly.And he said, "Chad, I've never heard anybody explain it this way.And I got to tell you, I want to be ground zero for everything you're doing in our state."And Peter, I can tell a story like that from virtually every state, because we're going out into the nooks and crannies.Faith Wins had 132 meetings in 24 states between February and November last year, so if someone has got a better pulse on Christian America in the nooks and crannies, I'd love to meet them.Save me some time. I'd like to meet them and ask them their experiences, but we had 24 different denominations host our meetings.We have over 40 different denominations attend our meetings.We had 27,000 people in those meetings in very specific areas, and we had over 4,100 pastors in those 132 meetings.And so we got a pretty good take on what people are thinking and feeling.And you're seeing what's happening in Asbury. I think God's moving.I think God's moving in our nation and the world.I think that he's tapping us on the shoulder. Hey, hey, who shall I send?Here I am, send me, said the prophet. So I think the onus is upon us.[40:52] Or perhaps I was reading about Asprey today and feeling that excitement within me, reading about what was happening and wanting God to continue doing that and to spread out.My prayer was, well, as I'm going to CPAC, maybe a little bit of Asprey and CPAC would be wonderful.Just mess up the agenda. But can I say, obviously connecting with churches is about connecting, I guess, with political thought leaders.And many, I assume you come across pastors, I come across many people and they say, well, you know, I just need to stay in my lane and to what I've been called to do.And I'm thinking, well, your lane is the world, your lane is everything.Why live yourself? How do you kind of encourage, I guess, encourage those maybe within churches that feel, well, I need to constrain myself to what God's given me and their worldview is quite small and you're trying to enlarge that worldview?[41:53] I think the way that works is, and you're exactly right, because I don't ever wanna disrupt what a pastor's main thing is, right?I believe it is preaching the gospel to tell the truth. And so, I'll give you this analogy that our friend Bob McKeown uses.If you and I walk in your office there, and you say, well, it's 40 feet wide.And I say, well, Peter, I think it's 35 feet wide.And those are just opinions. until we pull a tape measure out and we have the truth.[42:23] And truth reveals error and error hates truth. And that's why you see so much truth being confronted these days.Well, that's not my truth. No, no, no. You get to have your experience.You don't get to create truth.Truth is his, not ours.You know, we can have an experience and that's our experience.But we got the bugs view of the windshield. God's got the helicopter.And so we don't get to decide what truth is. And when truth reveals error, that's why you see all this error going absolutely nuts.If they ask you to go down to the local university and say a prayer, they're going to say, Peter, what are you going to pray about? You're going to say, well, I'm going to pray in the wind or goat's breath or eagle's feathers.Ooh, that's wonderful.But if you say you're going to pray in the name of Jesus, all hell breaks loose because truth reveals error.And so I think that when they think I got to stay in my lane and just preach the gospel, we are. And every time you tell the truth, that is preaching the gospel. You know, I've got a buddy named Bill Feddory says two things. He says, number one, we got to get everybody to heaven we can, and number two, make sure it keeps it legal. And I think that part of what a lot of these pastors that won't engage, they think they're going to lose a tether in the church, or they think they're going to lose, you know, respect. And the truth is, the churches that preach the truth, the unfettered,[43:45] unfiltered, absolute Word of God. They don't change it for their own needs or wants or feelings. They're growing. The mainline churches in America, they're hurting. Some of them are dying. And the reason they're dying, I've got five new couples in my Sunday school class in my little town. And every one of them came from a mainline denomination that's capitulated on the truth.They've watered it down. They've apologized for it. They won't jump into into the culture wars and tell the truth.And our pastor's preaching truth, and I'm sure trying to in my Sunday school class every Sunday.[44:19] I want to end on the truth, let me ask you one question before we end on that. It seems to be what you're doing has gone past the party limitations. I mean, it's what you're talking about has taken on a life of its own, you're engaging churches irrespective of whether the RNC is happy or not, irrespective of who is running or not. Actually, what you're doing[44:44] has passed that point of, I guess, control and ownership.Tell us about that because it's then irrelevant what the ideas or policy or campaign is of any particular party. What you're doing is now separate and much bigger than that.
Yeah we think so and we think it's been a God thing. Thank you for for saying that. That's awful nice and it's certainly been a prayer and a heartfelt desire that Christians not just give votes but voices.And, you know, there's too many candidates, too many staffs that don't acknowledge a biblical worldview. They don't understand it. They see it from their own worldview, which is, as I said, who says only one question, only two answers, man or God.Man's always going to have a standard that moves all over the place, different based on the different people, and God's going to have a standard that doesn't move, whether it's inconvenient or not.I think it's gotten bigger because we've been able to tell candidates and party people, Love you, proud of you, but no, you're not gonna hire us. I've had presidential candidates already.We wanna hire your network. That is not how we work.[45:49] And we're gonna get pastors out to maximize the Christian vote.But if you're not talking their issues and you're not standing for truth, they're probably not gonna be with you, just quite frankly.And so I raise money through donors who believe in this. And I talked to them, you met some of them, probably in Miami, who just have bought into what we're doing and they realized we gotta get our nation and the world back to a foundational truth that doesn't move with the changing winds.And we gotta be able to identify liberty as, true freedom is freedom in Christ.That's true freedom. Bondage, releasing the bondage and the chains of sin.That's true freedom.And we gotta get people back to understanding truth instead of all this haphazard, all over the map, ricochet rabbit stuff that we see today. So we think it has, we just thank the Lord for it, and we're humbled, we're excited where we're at and where we're going.[46:40] Can I end off on a paradox that I see? America's traditional culture of Christians being engaged in politics, even though you have a separation of church and state, you have huge Christian engagement.Well, we in the UK, we have an established church, we have that connection and yet we are seeing traditionally that has been very much one with our education system, with our health service, all of that came from faith, came from the church.But now we have a huge disconnect and it's curious that over in the States where you have that separation, you seem to have churches being engaged where over here in the UK we have that connection in theory in our constitution, but we have a separation.I mean, speaking to that on the end and how kind of that works.[47:39] Well, in America, that whole idea of separation of church and state has been mislabelled.That was in a private letter by Thomas Jefferson in 1802.Thomas Jefferson wasn't there when the US Constitution was written. It was just hearsay.But it was taken out of context over 150 years later in a Supreme Court case.It was used by the up-and-coming modern progressive left to say, oh, you can't be involved.And see, our First Amendment assures freedom of speech just because you're a Christian or you're behind a pulpit.You don't lose that. And I think the more you see judges that are committed to our constitutional, they're constitutional conservatives, they're not trying to rewrite laws.You're seeing a rebalancing of that in America right now. You know, you probably watched, you are probably familiar with that coach out in the state of Washington, Peter, who was fired for doing a silent prayer at a football game.He had done it for years, never promoted it, never made people do it, but people came out of the stands after the game. The kids on the teams came out and it became a big deal.The school district punished him, they fired him, the guy was mocked and lied about, he lost his job. I think he lost his house.[48:50] And a Christian attorney that was at that meeting, Kelly Shackelford at First Liberty Institute took it up and they finally won last June, the right to pray in public like that.And that's a big reversal for America. So coach Kennedy, they had to pay him back pay, they hired him.And I'm sure you remember when that football player on Monday night football about six weeks ago, when he went down, do you know what those football players did and everybody in the stand?They took a knee. There was not a Supreme Court ruling.There was not a school district punishing them. There wasn't a newspaper reporter saying, no, you can't do that. So when people are in dire straits, you know what they do?They pray. They may not know to God. They may not know how. They may not know why.And so this whole idea of separation of church and state has been a misnomer, it's been mislabelled, it's been misapplied.And in America, when you read America's founding documents, those words don't appear in any American founding document.It's been so misinformed to people people are miseducated about it. We've been trying to re-educate them and teach them about the truth and going back to America's original history.
 
Just to end, Faith Wins for probably a quarter of our viewers or state side, a quarter of our listeners or state side, how can they get involved? Can they register? Can they donate? How can they get involved on the website?[50:13] Absolutely. That's faithwins.org .org you've got on your screen. We'd love to have you involved.We'd love to know where you are. We'd love to invite you to our meetings. We were in Iowa yesterday We got meetings in South Carolina this week coming up. We were in 24 states last year. I know we're gonna add Oregon, Washington,[50:31] Minnesota Maine, I know we're adding those four states this year, but if you go on that website You'll see where our meetings are. We'd love to have you come they're free. They're open to people, We want to help educate people we want to have those dialogues and conversation And so faith wins, F-A-I-T-H-W-I-N-S, faithwins.org.We'd love to have you involved.
 
Chad, thank you for coming on.The story of what you're doing with Faith Wins and your story with RNC is exciting and inspiring.So thank you for joining us and sharing your story with us.
Thank you, brother. God bless you. Thanks for what you're doing.I hate to won't see you at CPAC, but I know I'll see you soon.
 
I'll see you soon.Thank you so much, Chad. And thank you to our viewers, listeners for watching, for tuning in, for being part of the conversation and look forward to seeing you on our next interview.So thank you so much and good evening to you all.

Katherine Macbean - How the People’s Health Alliance is Providing an Integrative Approach to Wellness

A warm welcome to our guest this episode, the founder of The People's Health Alliance, Katherine Macbean.Trust in our institutions are at an all time low. The police, courts and government are viewed with suspicion or even seen as the enemy of the people. With the enforced jabbing of an experimental 'vaccine', many are now even apprehensive of visiting their doctor or hospital. People are seeking to find advice from doctors and health care staff that they can trust so it is this need that The Peoples Health Alliance is attempting to fix. Katherine started The PHA as a way to connect the public to trusted doctors and to promote a holistic approach that does not simply rely on more and more drugs to fix health issues. Big Pharma has such a strong hold on our health industry and The PHA is seeking to break this stranglehold.The People's Health Alliance is an integrative approach to health that is an organic, people-led initiative, working at a community level to educate about true health and preventative approaches all without interference from government or big pharma.The PHA was established in April 2022 and has spread across 30+ counties in the UK with over one hundred individual community groups wanting to create a health hub in their area, all unique and serving their community in different ways. PHA have moved internationally with hubs currently being created in NZ, Australia, Canada, Portugal, Slovenia, Spain and the USA.Connect with Katherine and The People's Health Alliance...WEBSITE: https://the-pha.org/TWITTER: https://twitter.com/TPHA_UK?s=20https://twitter.com/Win11We?s=20GETTR: https://gettr.com/user/PeoplesHealthAllianceFACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com/groups/470135028119956/TELEGRAM: https://t.me/ThePeoplesHealthAlliance/RUMBLE: https://rumble.com/user/ThePeoplesPodcastPODCAST: https://open.spotify.com/show/3J5i3EiTquLpgBzYJYIkRz?si=bb51fab718c846d3People’s Food & Farming Alliance....WEBSITE: https://the-pffa.org/TWITTER: https://twitter.com/PFFA_UK?s=20TELEGRAM: https://t.me/PFFAGrowYourOwnVote Freedom Project....WEBSITE: https://vote-freedom.org/Interview recorded 25.2.23Audio Podcast version available on Podbean and all major podcast directories... ⁣https://heartsofoak.podbean.com/To sign up for our weekly email, find our social media, podcasts, video, livestreaming platforms and more... https://heartsofoak.org/connect/Please subscribe, like and share!
[0:22] Hello, Hearts of Oak and welcome to another interview just coming up with Katherine Macbean.She is the founder of the People's Health Alliance.[0:31] And this is something that's come up, I think, talking to Dr. David Cartland, he mentioned originally, and I was asking him about what system there is in place to provide access to healthcare if we do not want to use or can't use the NHS.And what Katherine has done in setting up this is phenomenal.We talk about why she set it up, what drove her to set this up.Quite a number of ambassadors they have on it, Dr. David Cartland and Dolores Cahill, along with many others, and many organizations linked with them.How it's set up, talking about this integrative approach to health, this joined up thinking where it's not just big pharma, here's a pill.Talk about mental health and the impact of the last couple of years on that, and the important of community action and community hubs, which I think we've got away from, but we need to return back to those and look at some projects she has coming up. So great website and you simply put in your details and it will show you a doctor, a health practitioner who lives close by and you can sort it by where you live, but also what you're looking for. All the links are in the description. I know you'll enjoy listening to Catherine as much as I enjoyed speaking with her.
 
Katherine Macbean, thank you so much for joining us today.[1:52] Thank you for having me.
 
Not all. Katherine is the founder of the People's Health Alliance. We'll get into all of that soon. And there's the website underneath on your screen and in the description.And I encourage you all to go and have a look at it. But maybe Katherine, we could start with you given just a little bit of your background before you got to the point of actually setting up the organization. So give us a little bit of your background.[2:21] Yeah, so I woke up about 25 years ago. I was working in the grocery sector and a number of my clients would have the supermarkets come in, your Tesco's and Safeway and Asda and so forth.And I was watching the control that these supermarkets had at audit times and how these small businesses effectively were having to invest really heavily to keep up with the requirements of the supermarket and the supermarkets were making it very very difficult for these suppliers through contracts to deliver directly to people and I was watching this happen over a period of a year or two and the monopolization started to become really quite frightening to me. I could see where this would head, I could see where this would go and farmers were almost handing over and producers were handing over there, their sort of sovereignty as a business, if you like, over to the likes of the supermarkets. And so I started researching and going down these holes. And that's when you start finding the likes of Monsanto's of this world and various other organizations. And for those that have done it, they know where it heads and you go off in a lot of different directions. It was a lot slower process for me to sort of wake up and be fully aware, I think, than people nowadays, because I didn't have the internet at home back then. And you know, you really had to do proper research if you like. And as time went on I realized that there was going to come a point They were going to do something to mess up.[3:48] And there had to be solutions that were found as to how do you move forward from a situation like that?So for me personally, I'd lie awake for hours at night trying to find solutions.[3:58] And it was always for me about decentralization. It was about taking power back to the people, back to communities, not this centralized control that we see now.And you could see it was going in that direction even back then.So I started to create models in my head of what that could look like.And when, during that time, I went and worked in big bag, big chem, big feed, big seed. I worked for smaller organizations. I got myself into a position where I could go and deal directly with farmers and growers and producers and really understand what was happening. And then later on down the line, I went and worked in community projects. So again, I could understand how you work with volunteers, because I knew this was going to take people power. And when you're asking people to dedicate a big chunk of their lives to doing something outside of paid work, you have to know what you're dealing with and how that needs handling and how you can work with people to achieve your goals. So yeah, I spent a lot of time doing that and then when COVID hit within a month or two, for me it was the shoving the test up the nose thing for this prolific virus that was going around something, I thought yeah this is it, this is the time. And prior to that obviously we had Trump come in and upset the apple cart somewhat. So we could see there was the light at the end of the tunnel that was coming at that point. So for me, I started off just trying to get a feel within the movement, if you like, as it started growing as to who's authentic, who's not, how can we work.And I'm a single parent of three kids.[5:24] So, and I was working full time at the time. So for me to start something, I'm not gonna lie, I sat back and thought someone will do it in a minute.Someone will do something in a minute. Yeah, just waiting. And it became apparent that no one was actually going to take the bull by the horns and do some things that needed to happen.So I decided to do it. And PHA just organically started to be developed. And from there, it's just we launched last April and it's gone bonkers. It's been insane.[5:53] Well, tell us, I understand your thinking when you sit back and you wait for something to happen and you realize nothing happens.That's why it's fun jumping in and actually doing something.And I think we both probably end up talking to people and they tell us about their dreams.And we guys say, well, we've been doing X and Y, so why don't you do Z?And it's too much bother.But you've, I mean, it's fascinating, the simply before we get into people's health and self, just the people on the website.So let me bring up the website and let people see what they will see when they go on.That's just what you will see when you go on the website.But you've got a great number of ambassadors and anyone who has Dr. David Cartland or Dolores Cahill certainly been with us before and many others.Tell us about that kind of networking and pulling those like-minded people into the plans and the projects you had.[6:55] Yeah, so it wasn't difficult actually. It was just natural connections that were made because I'm a networker, I'm a connector, I love speaking with other people who are genuine and authentic.And there was certain like Sam White was the first guy I connected with and I went and met with Sam.You know, what he's been put through is just revolting. It's disgusting that any individual who's trying to help other people should go through what he's been through.And Dave Cartland, as such, has had similar issues afterwards.So once we kind of got established, I felt it was important that these guys felt not only were they supported by the people across the UK who knew what was going on, but they have much to offer.And we're, as a core group of volunteers who started PHA, none of us are medically trained.And we wanted to ensure that we could bring across supporters and ambassadors for PHA who come from a variety of different backgrounds, because what we do is integrative. It isn't just medical, it isn't just allopathic. We do believe there's space for both. And in fact, it's essential.We adopt both methods moving forward. So I got to connect with Sam and Dave, and we've all become really good friends, genuinely, you know, really good mates now. You know, we message each other regularly. They're real people. They're real people with feelings, and real people with skills and the real people who've got drive to make a difference and that's what we found with the ambassadors we work with, they all are so driven.[8:20] To bring real change to how we look at health as well as supporting accountability for what's taken place. And so just one-to-one I connected with them. One thing I think that's really important is we just remain human and we just remain really genuine and authentic in who we are and I think people like that about what we're doing. There's no egos involved with PHA, there's no agendas involved with PHA, it is about producing for the people and every single one of the ambassadors we've got including Dr Kat Linley who's been profoundly supportive on the medical side.[8:53] We need these people to help you know get message out there and the trouble we've got Peter is the same old adage across the board within the movement too few do very much for so many and we'd love to get more ambassadors on board to help and as time allows we'll get to it.
 
I love that that networking side as you pointed out the last three years one of the massive plus points in the midst of the chaos has been meeting people, connecting with people, making those new relationships of people maybe wouldn't traditionally have crossed. But looking at the, on the website you talk about a future where Big Pharma no longer has control over us and I think a lot of us have questioned that power that is over us and controls every area of our lives and not just big pharma but you have their big everything there's so many institutions and organizations but maybe want to tell us what the need is for the People's Health Alliance in the midst of that.[9:57] And yeah so tell us kind of how PHA fits into what need it addresses.
Yeah one of the main reasons I wanted to get started was it was the when the government announced that the NHS staff might be mandated for vaccines. And so for me, I could see there are a lot of doctors and nurses who would eventually become uncomfortable with this and want to leave.Now we don't want to lose that skill set, that expertise, that knowledge. You know, people still need healthcare across the UK. But we knew there were going to be far less medical practitioners available initially, because so many have swallowed what they were told. So, and there's such a place for natural approaches to health, more holistic approaches to health. And these guys, these homeopathic doctors and nutritionists and so forth, the knowledge they have is absolutely profound but they've always been pushed into the shadows because Big Pharma can't make money, a huge amount of money off the back of more natural approaches to health and preventative approaches to health. So whilst you look at Big Pharma and it just seems overwhelming, It's like, how do we stop this?How do we stop them? They are so big.[11:03] Actually, we have the power to do it. But we can start small. If you go into your community as a practitioner and start working with the more holistic and natural approaches and certainly in a preventative way, over time, you're going to eradicate the need for big pharma quite a lot more.Also what we want to support is if there are local producers in the UK who do manufacture and produce pharmaceuticals, essential pharmaceuticals, that's great.But by bringing it back to smaller businesses, bringing it back to a more community based way of living, you eradicate the need for the big control mechanisms that are there.And with everything we do under the People's Alliance, it is about eradicating that central power source and bringing the power back to the people, back to communities.So whilst Big Pharma, it seems like they're massive and they have a hold on everything.What you do in your community on the daily will eradicate the need for these big conglomerates that currently have the control in place.But we don't need them.We don't need them. And the sooner people realize that and step into their power, we're going to see change start to happen.
Yeah, I think we've all seen the Big Pharma are not there to help us help our health.They're there to make profits for their shareholders.That's why they exist. But we see the NHS system collapsing, whether by chance or by design, and I'm still trying to work that out personally.But yeah, the NHS completely collapsed.[12:29] Is what you're doing trying to set up another NHS? How does it kind of, when people see that as the model they understand, how does PHA fit into that understanding?
So we're not trying to replace the NHS. Predominantly what we're doing is creating safety nets and a way to start moving forward.So, you know, I've always been a huge proponent of the NHS. My mum's an NHS nurse for over 30 years. They've saved my life twice.You know, I've been on rallies in the past many years ago to support the NHS. It isn't a crack at the NHS per se, but the NHS are not performing.People cannot access health care. And so whilst we're not in a position right now as PHA to address things like secondary and acute care, We can certainly support at that primary care level and create safety nets.Another thing I foresaw coming was the fact that people might lose faith in the NHS.[13:19] And actually might say, no, I'm not going to go and see my doctor.I'm not going to go and see anyone about this or refuse to see it.They've lost confidence. So actually, it's really essential we still all take care of ourselves.And there's incredible practitioners out there who certainly at that primary care level can support people within the community.And it's giving them an affordable way to access that. But the beauty of what we do here is no health hubs will look the same from each other.It isn't about us at core who are providing resources and the information and so forth.It's about what you need in your community. So every single health hub looks unique, it looks a bit different. And what we want to encourage is more of that old school.[13:59] For the GPs to come in and create a relationship with the people within their community. At the the moment it's cattle fodder, you're in and out, five minutes, job done. The amount of GPs I've spoken to who really don't like working that way.So PHA want to bring back the opportunity for practitioners to connect with their patients on a one to one level, get to know them and understand them and people genuinely receiving solid support and advice on what they can do and how they can take care of themselves at home.Without the need as Dave Cartland put it, GP's just going there's a pill for every year or crack on, you know, we want to move away from that.
 
Yeah and I completely understand, I've got friends who are, don't want to go to their doctor because they are concerned if you're maybe older or weaker, they're worried about being forced to have jabs, they're worried about being forced to have medication that they don't want to have, so I completely get that concern about actually going and that trust is completely gone. But how is it set up practically? How does it work? Is it purely education? Is it actually people setting up a system where people can get treatment? Explain kind of how it does work and what your vision is for moving forward.[15:12] Yeah, so like I said, every hub is unique. So for example, we've got 10 physical hubs open in the UK in 10 months, which actually is profound. And it isn't us at core. This is the people doing it and doing it with very, very little money.So each one looks different.So some have what they call drop-ins, whereby their practitioners dedicate a morning a week, for example, to being able to see patients within their community and it's free of charge or donation is asked for.Some hubs are set up whereby they've got practitioners available all day, every day, where you can make an appointment, but we've asked every hub to ensure that there are schemes available for those in the community who may be on a low income or poverty situation. So we don't have people missing out.[15:54] Each hub looks different. And there's a really, really good reason for that.And that is because it's about empowering people.It's not about us at Central controlling things. It's about empowering and supplying resources for each community to create what it wants.So each one will look different, but there'll be a plethora of different practitioners available in every hub.It could be nutritionists, a homeopath, a chiropractor, and so on and so forth.And they refer to each other, different patients, depending on what they are analysing within that, you know, what they're finding with that patient.And then they can refer it over to a colleague who might be more expert in that field.And quite often, GPs, as it stands, and you know, you can speak to Dave Cartland about this, the amount of training they get in nutrition, for example, is actually pathetic.Whereas we know gut health and good nutrition is such an integral part of our health overall.So these hubs work differently. You don't see GPs often referring to anyone who will take a common sense, natural approach, if I'm honest, whereas these practitioners are encouraged to do so and they do.We've even got some groups who are creating, buying buses.and they're going to go around their local community and stop certain days each week for a few hours so people can access them, particularly those in a rural environment.That is one of the beauties of this. It is about empowering people to make decisions for what their community needs and doing it together.[17:21] And it's happening. We've got 30 counties now involved. We've got 30 hubs set up that serve in the community.Even if they haven't got a physical hub, there's virtual hubs. There are, like I say, the bus option.Some people are going and hiring a village hall for two mornings a week and just having a drop-in[17:36] situation where people can come by. So each one looks different and actually we love that, because this really is for people to create what they need for their community. Not be dictated to by somebody who doesn't go to their community and doesn't understand what's there or what the issues are. This is about the people identifying what they need and stepping into their power and creating it for others within their area.
 
It's a very different, it's an approach, a holistic approach I guess. We've come to reassess a lot of things, but I think for me it dawned whenever you were told, go and get your jab and you can get a doughnut. Okay, so how is that going to improve? And there is absolutely no focus or emphasis on healthcare, on nutritional value, on exercise, on physically looking. It was all get a jab, off a substance, and will make you all better. But I mean, tell us about that integrative approach, that whole approach, that connecting so many things, because that is maybe it's going back to what it was traditionally.[18:41] Or maybe it's reassessing and a new model going forward. But yeah, I mean, tell us that kind of connect approach, because that again, it's a departure from our traditional understanding of the NHS or healthcare.[18:56] Yeah, no, absolutely. Common sense, common sense is something that's brought back in. You know, back a number of years ago, decades ago, you know, your nan and your mum that have a kitchen cupboard full of natural herbs and teas and things that you could use tinctures to support your health.And we know the preventative way is the ideal way forward, let's be honest.So we do a huge amount in terms of education. It's available on the website on kitchen cupboard type[19:25] medical healing things you can do and so on and so forth.But what, for example, our health optimization program, which is on our website, I mean, anyone can take it up with stages one and two, but what it is, it's to help deal with the injured.And we take a very natural approach. but actually we look at things like gut health, stress, sleep, all of these different areas that actually anyone can go and look at the health optimization program and take something from it that will help build your immunity, but it's based on a natural common sense approach.And everything in our bodies is interconnected. We know that. So we also supply non-medical options for dealing with injuries that have been proven to replicate what you can do with certain pharmaceutical items. So we very much try and take a natural approach across the board. But we also don't deny the fact that there are situations whereby people do need to have an allopathic approach to their health and we absolutely welcome that.[20:28] But in terms of that preventative approach, we all have a responsibility to do something for ourselves. We've been led down this road based on fear over a number of decades about our health.The government across the world and the pharmaceutical companies have done an excellent job in letting us know how brittle we are, how likely we are to break, you know, and actually[20:50] that isn't the case. If we change the way we live and this is why it has to be an all-round the clock approach to how we move forward as societies because you know you've got the economic side, of things that makes a difference to how people's health looks, the societal differences across the board depending on where you live, on what you can do with your health and actually no we need to get, I hate to use the word equity, equality if you like, across society to deal with this because you've got mental health, you've not just got your physical health, we've got masses we need to do.And we have to see societal changes and that starts in your community, that starts with you people out there. So yeah, that's the kind of approach we take, but we're not here to dictate, we're here to guide and educate.
 
I guess ideally you'd want a system where people financially put in. I mean, when you think of the American model, in theory, that should work where you have an insurance scheme where you have something you pay in because what we pay in in our taxes doesn't seem to get anything out for the NHS and that's no longer free at the point of service anyway.So ideally you want something where you have more and more people becoming, I guess, paid up members who you pay. We pay subscriptions for many services so I don't see why we shouldn't pay it for access to health and healthcare we can trust. I mean, is that where because everything needs funding to make it happen. So tell us about that side.[22:20] Yeah, so that's the more difficult side of it, if you like, but it doesn't need to be hugely difficult, but it's a mindset shift. That's the biggest challenge is the mindset shift. So, for example, I was interviewing Dr. Kat Lindley this week, that'll be out soon. And we were talking about different models that doctors who leave the NHS can take in opening up their own practice within their community.And one of the model that Kat works with is[22:43] her patients pay a it's a sliding scale depending on what age you are and you pay a certain amounts each month. Now what that does is give the doctors the security of the financial income but she just makes herself available 24 seven.She doesn't just give a pill for I mean she takes a very holistic approach to how she deals with her patients and you would put Kat in the GP category I suppose in the UK.But she will, like if they've got the sniffles, are you taking your vitamins? Have you created this soup? What about doing this? You know, very holistic approach. At hub level, the way it works for a lot of the hubs is they're doing it again as a memberships thing. So you pay x amount each month and each hub will work that out, but you pay x amounts each month and you then can access all of the practitioners, for example, or some work on an independent level and they will give discounts to people who are, you know, financially not in a strong position. But what we've got to wrap our heads around in the UK is we do pay for the NHS. We pay quite heavily for the NHS. And what you see within the NHS is a massive amount of waste, huge amount of waste. And on the salaries for middle management, it's just unreal. I mean, we've looked at it. And actually, we could probably provide healthcare across the board, primary, secondary and acute care, for probably about one tenth of what the NHS is costing us right now. It's astounding and so much is wasted.[24:08] But that's because of the centralisation. It's about central bodies dictating to hospitals what they can spend, where they can spend it, who they can buy from and so forth. And actually they have no idea what that community looks like and what it needs. They have no idea what the requirements are on a local level. And as such, you've seen a one size fits all across the board. And that doesn't work. It's proven it doesn't work. If each hospital had control over its own budgets, its own finances, its own way forwards, who they bring in, the employment and so forth. I think we see a very, very different situation, but we don't have it. And until the government lets go of that and takes the power back to the hospitals or the local regions to take care of themselves, you're going to carry on seeing wastage. So don't think you don't pay for the NHS, you do pay for the NHS.I'm not saying the NHS should go, but what I am saying is I would love to see a situation whereby our tax money was allocated to us as people to spend on healthcare as we see fit, rather than us being dictated to and where our money should go.[25:03] Yeah, and we've certainly seen over the last three years, not just destruction on the NHS, on our health service, but also on health, people's health.When you're told stay at home, don't get any exercise, you don't really want to visit your daughter, it has a massive negative effect and then get jab with experimental jabs, another impact on health.So what this is, is needed, I guess, more than ever that nothing is working.The health service system is not functioning and people's health is in a much worse place than it was.And then you've got crazy, crazy waiting lists. And then you've got a supposed phone call with a doctor who will then someone somewhere will tell you without actually seeing anyone.The whole system is broken. tell us that impact on I guess healthcare since COVID and then the response to that.[26:03] Yeah, I mean, it's been dire. It's been absolutely dire. And we're seeing obviously with injuries, increasing issues across the board. It's a very difficult time for people. And I understand why people are frightened, people are worried. But actually raising your hand and saying, I need help right now is the best thing you can do. But I think we also need to bear in mind, It's not just been the physical health impact, a massive issue is the mental wellbeing. I mean, I cannot[26:31] express heavily enough just how much of an impact has taken place, even on those that are awake and aware and have seen it of what it is. You know, it's added a massive mental strain. And one thing that we're doing is working with partners across the UK. One in particular, our mental wellbeing ambassador, a lady called Helen Gibson, is currently beta testing, train of trainers on mental health first aid. So we're going to deliver that across the UK and train people like secondary level practitioners and so forth in how to deliver mental wellbeing first aid. It's going to be profound. And as people wake up, which they will, as people wake up across the UK, what we want to do is avoid any risk of kind of societal collapse because people just don't know how to cope. They don't know how to move forward. And this has affected our young people as well. This is not just us adults, our young people have been affected. It's incredibly important that we put a huge amount of onus and focus on how we can heal people on the mental side of things, how we can work with them to support them through that.And we need people across every single community getting trained in mental wellbeing first aid so we can catch them when they fall. Because this is about us, don't let the division come into this.That we've all got to help each other. We know who the bad guys are. They're the ones who should be getting our[27:44] anger, I suppose we want a better word, but no, we've got to put some onus here, not just on the physical wellbeing, which needs a lot of work, but on the mental wellbeing as well.But again, it's about education, it's about taking it back to basics, it's about good nutrition, good sleep, good gut health, you know, really start to take care of yourself, taking the good vitamins that you need.All of that's on our website and it's going to keep building and keep building those resources and education.But there are specialists out there, there are experts out there in this field.Go and find your local practitioners on our directory, on our website, and reach out to them.And if money is an issue, the amount we speak to who say, just put a little donation of what you can or let's just work something out moving forward.I've got one lady who happily will see her patients with a dozen eggs or something else in return.So don't be put off by the fact that they are private practitioners.Reach out because I tell you what the ones I'm speaking to are incredibly generous and kind.We are all here to help each other and we mustn't lose sight of that.[28:49] Let me focus on that a little bit more because I remember talking to David the first time I interviewed him and realizing, I think it could have been actually after the interview, realizing that we need a separate system that actually offers healthcare for individuals.And I remember earlier on David mentioning the People's Health Alliance and I've seen a number of initiatives in the US, which are of course always well funded and they can make things happen.We are always working seemingly on a shoestring in the UK where you have the individuals, but not necessarily the finance. America sometimes did the finance before the individuals.But here in the UK, looking on the website, it's not just that you have a dozen or so, GPs or health professionals around the country, but actually you have pages and pages and pages.So, I mean, tell us more about it because what you're building isn't actually on the education side, isn't actually saying, well, if you follow this, you'll be better and we need that. But it actually is about giving that access.And that's something that is desperately needed. And I have been concerned that that maybe wasn't happening, but that is literally what you're doing on the ground.[30:13] Absolutely. One of the most overwhelming things that happened when we, well, prior to us actually launching, was we connected with literally hundreds of holistic practitioners. It could be people from a background in homeopathy, it could be reflexology, it could be nutrition, chiropractor, osteoporosis.So many actually cried with joy that we were doing this genuinely cried with joy because they have been forced into the shadows.They haven't been taken seriously. And these guys, there's doctors out there, naturopathic doctors who are immense.They trained in both allopathic and holistic approaches.You know, the knowledge base out there is phenomenal. And we wanted to give a platform to these guys who want to shine a light on it.They have so much to offer. And because of Big Pharma and, you know, the NHS approach and so forth, they haven't been given the opportunity. I think you can still get homeopathic treatments paid for through the NHS in Scotland, but you can't in the UK and yet you used to be able to. But that's been taken away now. And these guys are incredible, absolutely incredible. They have so much to give, they are so excited to be able to have a light shining on them now so they can show what they can do. You know, we've got some homeopathic doctors who are having incredible success with some vaccine injured, for example. You know, people underestimate what is available out there and the amount of doctors we're seeing like your Sam Whites and others that are coming out of the NHS and actually training[31:38] in a different holistic sphere. So we are now connecting with different colleges and education providers across the UK to get discounts for people through PHAs. So if you're a doctor you want to leave the NHS, maybe you want to take a more holistic approach to how you treat your patients.You've still got the allopathic knowledge there, you're still able to access that, but maybe you want to understand more.[32:00] On the holistic side. So we're keen to get doctors and nurses trained up should they want it in different holistic practices. So it gives them a broader spectrum and knowledge as well as what other practitioners they can do when they refer. You know we want to give as many doctors the options as we can and nurses to get involved with it. But yeah it's been, it's not easy on the financial front because we ask for donations from the public. Great people are very kindly donating, we've got the power of the pound campaign where we ask people to donate one pound a month ongoing, you know, we're very realistic as to what's going on out there and what people are up against. But yeah, we haven't, in all honesty, we haven't sourced big funding, we haven't gone after big donors at this stage, we do need to do that. But as with everything, it's still relatively speaking, a small skeleton crew that are driving PHA forward. And there's so many hours, only so many hours in the day. But we're not here about big conferences, big marketing budgets, this sort of stuff, we could have ploughed money into that, but we're not, we're ploughing it back into functionality. And we want to plough more back into getting hub doors open. We've got so many hub groups this far away from opening their doors. And it might just be that financial thing, it could be just five grand they need to just flick the switch and be able to get live. So if anyone out there is in a position to donate, please kindly do. We are very transparent with where money is spent.[33:22] We are very frugal. And that's probably down to me. I've been a single mum for 25 years. You watch where every single penny goes and you use it in the most optimum way to have the biggest impact. So yeah, finances are difficult but we're not going out there getting money from Big Pharma. Integrity is key and we tend to lead by example.
Let me just show people where, because I didn't actually believe it until I was looking through your website. Many people talk about what's possible and give you a great spiel, then you realise the substance doesn't actually back it up. But if people go on to the website and click on the practitioners, you can get a map, you can put in your details. And as you can see, it is a lot of... We could go one by one, we could take maybe a few hours, literally, you can scroll down and people are there. So people could just go, they can put in their postcode and I looked and there are a number near me actually, just did a search while we've been speaking. But people can go, they can put in their postcode, they can put in their area and they can see and they can contact someone directly. Is that how it works?[34:40] Yep, absolutely. So we are just updating the hub list, which will be live hopefully by the end of the weekend. We're actually updating the whole website at the moment as we've worked out better ways for us to work. So and bear in mind, the majority of everything done through PHA is done by volunteers. And so that's why this is such a phenomenal success People aren't here making bundles of money. This has been done by the will of the people. But yes, you can go onto the map, go and look up a practitioner, you might have a particular modality that you're looking for, for example, you know, you might want to find a nutritionist. So you can go and find who is in your area, we make no promises, we make no, you know, anything outside of that. Because one thing that's happened as well, we want to encourage is people to figure things out for themselves. For so long, we've been spoon fed intentionally, we've been spoon fed on how we need to work our lives, who we need to go and see how things should be. And we're breaking the mould here, we're saying no, think for yourself, Find out what works for you.So we're doing lots and lots of Zooms and round tables with various members from different modalities.So people can start to learn, well, what's the difference between this and that type of modality?What works for me? It's about choice. It's about option. It's about you deciding what you need, not being told what you need, but you deciding what works for you.And we want to encourage that. And the practitioner directory is a great place to start.These guys, they've been checked.[36:03] We know they're legitimate, but it's over to you. It's over to you to take control of your health, be responsible for your health and use these practitioners to support you on your health journey.And, you know, one day we might have to come into secondary and acute care, but hey, we can start with primary care now because it's not costing us bundles of money that we don't have.But yeah, there's bigger plans. But unfortunately, we're going to need money for that and that time will come.
And what you're doing is needed. It's not just a one off thing, supposedly in the last few years of chaos and then it goes back.There is no going back to normal. This is the normal where we have seen actually some of the institutions as being against us, as being the enemy. And it's quite weird when you think that of the government, of the police, of the legal system, of the health system, not actually for you or working with you, but they're there for others. But so what you're doing is, is long term. It's not just, you know, over the last few years with COVID, well, we needed something, but now we're getting back to normal so we can just go back to the systems that we once trusted.They're gone. They're not there anymore. So what you're doing is for the long term.[37:18] Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. We have to all understand that we are going to need to create new ways forward, be that health, be that food production, be that education, be it local politics, alternative media. There are so many ways people can be empowered and helping to create the new. And as we're watching the old crumble, it's very important we start putting those safety nets into place because what we don't want to see is people full of fear, people full of worry that actually what now, the NHS is crumbling? What do I do? What do I do? Don't worry.All right, you've got the NHS still, it is still there, but it isn't necessarily a sustainable model right now.We're building for the future, not just us, other groups across the world.There's incredible authentic grassroots groups across the world doing fantastic work.And a lot of those will be highlighted on my new podcast. But, you know, there are community groups out there already doing it.[38:09] PHA has had such an impact that we've got hubs open in Australia, New Zealand.I mean, those two countries have been absolutely flying along.They're already open.They're working in less than six months. It's astounding. We've got groups opening up now in Portugal, Spain.Canada's not far away. It's really taken hold. And I think the reason it works so well is because we are not dictating what you should do.We're supplying you with bundles of information, resources, ideas, blueprints, all the rest of it, for you to go and create what you need.We've got a few very simple principles. We ask people to buy buy, like do no harm, for example.Very, very simple, but key ones.And it's over to you. You can do this. Don't think for a minute.You're only being told you can't do it by either your own mind or the government.Don't listen. You are more than capable of doing it and we need to build the future.And PHA is a solid part of that.[39:02] And the community action, the community hubs, it's going back to what it traditionally was and not just during COVID where we were told, stay away from each other, that people are bad.And therefore put that massive divide and destroyed any interaction and connections that people have.I mean, that kind of moving away, that losing connections with your neighbour or family or friends, that's been happening anyway, but COVID certainly has sped that up.So I guess it is essential and important that these community hubs go in place because they will provide that.I mean, when you go to your GP, you go there, you feel as though you're going to get more sick because the people you look around you and you just want to get out of there. So it's in and out.Again, what you're talking about with community hubs, with those networks is somewhere where you go for just more than actually to fix your health issue.It's about those connections and networking.
Yeah, I mean, we're connected to groups like the pharmacy cooperative.So on the PFA side, they're one of our partners.We are connected with some community assemblies. We've connected with a lot of groups across the UK.[40:13] And some of these guys are creating community hubs whereby there's an education element.They've got a PHA hub in there.They've got a PFA side to it or cooperative side to it, where the food's concerned for local food production.I mean, these hubs are becoming quite serious now, you know, and they are going to become the heart of communities and you're absolutely right, we're just producing a blueprint now actually[40:35] with our teams to create youth hubs across the UK and some of these will be adopted by the community hubs. Now our kids have had a tough time, you know, really I can't express enough how much we need to start doing for our young people to support them through it from the mental, physical and spiritual side of their own well-being and these youth hubs are going to be absolute lifesavers for some kids. You know, we've got a lot of young carers out there as it is. I think with the injuries, we're going to see more young carers coming to the fore. We need to take care of our children.And so these youth hubs will be educational. There'll be an escape, a safe escape for kids to go to. At the moment, you go to the park, young kids. What else is there? What really else is there?Screens. Screens. And we've seen the damage that can be caused by a number of social media apps and and so on and so forth. So we want to create environments for the communities to grow, to heal, to benefit on all levels and that includes our young people and these community hubs are going to become an essential part of building the new and moving forward together. Like you say, we've been ostracized from our neighbours and encouraged to have that distance intentionally. I don't believe for a second this is accidental, this is intentional. So you either let them win that or.[41:46] You say no, I'm actually going to go out there and connect with my neighbours, I'm going to go and and see my elderly neighbour who gets no visitors and have a cup of tea.I'm gonna go and look after the garden of my elderly neighbour who can't do it for herself.And hey, what, we'll grow some food for her and ourselves.There are a million different ways you can support the people in the community.Don't think for a second government to come into the rescue.They are not, certainly not the current government we've got.So we either sit back and wait for some sort of white horse that doesn't seem to be arriving, or we get off our butts and we do it for ourselves.And that's what we do. That's what other community groups do.That's it, our partners and affiliates that we work with encouraging people within their community to take back their power, step into it and support each other.[42:24] Yeah there's no one coming to help, it's us or no one. As we finish you dropped in some other things and maybe you can finish letting the people know what they are. You mentioned your podcast, you've mentioned PFFA which is the People's Food and Farming Alliance. I know we've talked before about the Vote Freedom Project, do you want to just touch on those to give us a flavour of what they are and what people should expect.
 
Yeah, absolutely. So because my heart[42:56] ultimately, historically has been in agriculture and farming, that's where I started my awakening and it's still an issue now. In fact, it's a more of an issue than it's ever been before. So we formed the People's Food and Farming Alliance last September. There's three strands to that of where we support through resources, education, that's grow your own, community growing groups and then farmers and producers. Now the grow your own is self-explanatory through community growing groups. We're connecting with groups out there, groups out there doing it.They are absolutely flying along and we've shown blueprints and models and we continue to do so, how you form a community growing group, why it's important and we connect with partners like the Pharmacy Cooperative and others in order to deliver logistical support in making that happen.We also have a partner like the Open Food Network which can be found on our website where they plot every single producer shop individual who produces food or food products for people across the UK, across the world actually. So you can go and find, similar to our directory, you can go and find who's local to you and you can start sourcing directly. And then the other side of it is supporting farmers and producers in very practical common sense ways through new accreditation systems, on-site butcheries, on-site feed mixes and so forth, because what we need to do is we need to take out the big controlling mechanisms which are the conglomerates and do it for ourselves.So, PFFA is about finding common sense solutions and getting them out there again into the communities.[44:19] We've also now got my podcast All Hands on Deck. That's now just starting off. And what that is, is to give a platform to those community groups and those individuals across the UK who are already making a difference. But they haven't got a big marketing budget. They haven't got a big way of communicating with the world. But that people need to know and be inspired by what is actually already going on. These are the heroes of the grassroots. These are the guys out there, not doing a song and dance about it, they're getting their heads down and getting it done.So if you're that's all just starting off now we've got a few episodes already up that's all hands on deck.[44:50] And the final thing that I'm working on is I've connected with a few people we've produced, we've just started the Vote Freedom project. Now what this is, is actually for me personally very essential. I don't have any faith in any party politics anymore. We've got MPs and would-be MPs across the country who are dictated to by their political party. They have to abide by certain rules, they could be influenced by donors, they could be influenced by the whip. What we want to to see is 650 freedom-loving MPs standing up in the Houses of Parliament in come 2024, who are there to just represent their constituents. A lot of reasons potential candidates go to the parties is because they need the support in terms of standing, the bureaucracy, the paperwork, dotting the i's, crossing the t's, the campaigning and so forth. The Vote Freedom Project will help do that with you.If you are genuinely, authentically looking to stand and support freedom for people across the UK, we'll support you through that so you can stand as an independent and that's what the Vote Freedom Project is all about.
 
Okay so it's all hands on deck and looking at the PFFA and that's just you put FF there instead of the H and Vote Freedom Project. All the links will be in the description whether you're watching or listening to the podcasting apps. Katherine thank you so much for coming on it's really exciting what's happened as I said I first heard it from David Cartland and it's exciting to see when something moves from an idea to actually rolling it out and it's happening.So thank you for coming on today and sharing what's happening.[46:20] Thank you so much for having me, Peter. It's been an absolute pleasure.
Not at all. Thank you and thank you to our viewers and listeners for tuning in.Do make use of all the links in the descriptions and we will see you very soon for our next interview.So thank you and goodbye.